Ridiculous car maintenance

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Kevin

Kevin

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Dallas, TX
I know ya’ll like automotive engineers and cars etc.

I’ve got a 2022 BMW, with 19,000 miles so it’s still under warranty.

But I’m getting the oil changed and for a while now I’ve been getting an error message.

“Low windshield washer fluid.”

Even when I filled it up.

It turns out, BMW has this sensor built into the tank, it isn’t a normal floating sensor. Regular washer fluid has some sort of additive that will gum up the sensor.

You are only supposed to use “special” BMW washer fluid.

This is just crazy for a couple reasons. First, why the need for a sensor at all? Secondly, why not a normal sensor if you must have one? Or even better, change the system to allow for normal windshield washer fluid.

I suppose a German auto engineer would have a good reason for what they did. Maybe?
 
We live in a fairly rural area so there’s not much for “high end” car dealers. No BMW, Volvo, Subaru, Mercedes, etc. unless you don’t mind driving 150 miles or more. Accordingly, there’s almost zero selection for someone local to service anything that isn’t a Chevy, Ford, Ram, Honda, Kia, etc.

One local friend who drives 30,000 or more a year just had to have a Volvo. So, he drove the 100-plus miles to look. Drove again to buy and now whines 2 or 3 times a year when again he gets to take a day off work and drive a 200-plus mile round trip for an OIL CHANGE to keep the warranty in order.

My experience has been that the more you spend on gadgets and widgets, the more trouble you’re inviting. Some seem to have a tolerance for that. I’m not one of them. Simplicity works for me.
 
There's a reason BMWs are so precise and comfortable. They are designed all the way to the pavement. You can't put cheap tires on and expect the same performance as top end tires, etc.. My BIL has an X5M and he drives 180 miles to a dealer to get his oil changed. It costs at least a couple of hundred dollars each time. Plus he has winter tires and summer tires which he always has changed at the dealer. In fact, the dealer stores his out-of-season tires for him. Ridiculous, I agree. He figures it is part of the cost of ownership and it is worth it to him.
 
interestingly enough, the average cost of a new car is $45k. Mine is one of the cheapest BMW, and is right at the national average. So I’m certainly not complaining.

And they are actually pretty awesome cars. Although I did have a VW Golf which was just slightly more fun to drive.


Dallas must be different. Either that or the BMW dealership has some pretty good sales people. I can’t go anywhere without seeing quite a few on the roads around town.
 
I drive a nine year old Ford car and a ten year old Ford pickup. Both bought used. No special washer fluid needed. Oil changes are 25 minutes round trip. I won't be buying a new vehicle, domestic or foreign, probably for the remainder of my life. As long as they are making gas, I'll be burning it.
 
"I suppose a German auto engineer would have a good reason for what they did. Maybe?"

It's really very simple when you think about it. Think the original VW Beetle. For a long time you had to take it to a dealer to have the valves adjusted every 1,000 miles or as close to it as possible. Figure an average of roughly 19 to 12,000 miles a year at about $40* for parts and labor, and that was a nice cash cow fo the dealership. Now supposedly you had to wait until the engine was cold to do the job, year their mechanic did your VW bug with a still hot to warm motor. How many VW beetles were there on the road for a very long time? Millions Even if only half the bug owners went to the dealer that would bring in a very comfortable chunk of change.

* That $40 quote was what I was being hit for when I owned a VW convertible in San Francisco back in 1965/6.
Paul B.
 
I just Googled it and the best I could figure out is not to use any fluid that has Rain-X in it, and there are a lot of them. The Rain-X coats the sensor. There are plenty of sources. Here's just one:

Post 6:

There's a sticker next to the fluid fill cap that says not to use silicon based fluids.

https://g07.bimmerpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1959261
 
I don't know a thing about BMWs, but Grandson was happy with his. It had some pretty neat features on it.
Oh yea he wanted to mount the 30 CAL that I built to mount on the SNJ Texan.
1694020763616.png


1694020860946.png

1694020942718.png
 
You wanna play like the big boys, you gotta pay like the big boys. Special windshild washer fluid is just one of the many ways they "nickle and dime" us. All the luxury car builders know that people will pay ANYTHING to say they have an XYZ; they would be crazy not to capitalize on our weakness. Besides who's gonna pay for those commercials on TV (?). I have several acquaintances that have Bentley's (typically a $1500 oil change) and one who has a Rolls... the good news is that they are much cheaper to maintain than a Bugatti. ;)
p.s. I have never brought my Toyotas in for maintenance (including the free 2 years of oil changes). I don't worry about the "warranty" because I've never had a Toyota break ANYTHING.
J.
 
Last edited:
It’s not only the foreign manufacturers who overwhelm systems with gadgets. My 2019 Silverado High Country stickered at $72K. Was the biggest POS for a vehicle I’d ever had the displeasure of owning.

In short, it went back to GM and so far, I’m very pleased with a 2021 Silverado RST that was almost $18K cheaper.
 
Ain’t that the truth? I can buy a nice BMW lots cheaper than a new F150 or RAM 1500.

It’s not just the Germans that make expensive cars anymore.

One reason we bought the BMW is it’s got one of the better warranties out there, along with two years worth of oil changes.

That’s much nicer than the warranty on our RAM truck.
 
When some of the Euro companies started charging owners a monthly fee to use their vehicles' features like nav or heated seats, I decided they were a bit too "proprietary" for me. Of course, since I haven't paid for vehicle maintenance or repairs since I got my license (other than the deductible on my extended service contract), and since there's no way I could do much on today's autos, it's sort of a moot point what kind of fluid a new vehicle takes...I won't own one.
 
Most new cars are designed by engineers, without the input of mechanics or even owners. And it shows.

Dealerships don't frankly want anybody else working on them. And for some issues, local shops won't even touch them.

I found that out when the steering coupler - a plastic bushing inside the steering column - went out on my 2012 Elantra about a year ago and with just over 200K on the odo. It's a known issue, but none of my local shops would touch it as they'd have to take the column apart to get to it. So, off to Jefferson City Hyundai.

The part was $3.50.

Labor to install it was $250.

Hyundai extended the warranty on that particular issue to 10 years and 150K miles. So I was still SOL. Old car, what can you say?

Last month I took my mom's 2013 Elantra Limited up there for the same issue. Hers only has 40K on the clock, but was built ten years and seven months ago. So hers missed the warranty, too.

Part now costs $3.99. Still $250 for labor.

Next week I get to take mine back up there for a check airbag light. Another known issue - caused by a failed clockspring in the steering column triggering the sensor - but at least the warranty on this part is 15 years and unlimited mileage. So hopefully I won't be out of pocket again . . . especially since I've got to buy new tires this weekend.
 
Clockspring is not a universal term and it doesn't connect a sensor to anything. It's the connection to the inflator (a GM word) that needs to stay constant while the steering wheel turns. GM calls it an SIR coil.

The car in question being German or foreign has no bearing. ALL engineers have lost their minds. I don't have enough fingers to count how many SIX DIGIT price tag trucks and SUVs we have sold this year and my store is a small rural dealership. We sold a 2023 Stingray for a price that starts with a 2.

A new Tahoe cannot be put into neutral unless the engine is running. There is no manual override on the shifter. If the engine won't run, the vehicle will not roll. So just pull the driveshaft, right? Nope. The electronic park brake system senses wheel rotation in park and applies the park brake.

The list goes on and ALL manufacturers have these "features". The car you drive is no better than your neighbor's on average. Manufacturers care ZERO about the dealers or the technicians that have to work on their nightmare inventions. They are in business to make money selling stock.
 
Kevin,

Thank you for supporting the Greenville S.C. economy.

(your car probably was not made here but we have a local plant and I think the last number I saw was one one car comes off the assembly line every two minutes.. 24 hours a day 7 days a week. BMW, stands for "Bubba Makes Wheels".

You probably need that special washer fluid for when you are doing 140mph on the Autobahn in the rain.....
 
The pay to use features that are already on your vehicle has even made it to motorcycles. KTM (more krauts) do this on their motorcycles. Want the heated grips to work? Pay a monthly charge. Want it to actually run like you expected it to? Pay a monthly charge.
 
  • Wow
Reactions: v35
I was an auto repair technician for 30 years. We used to tell people to take their German junk (sorry) somewhere else to be worked on.
Then we decided to work on them, but we charged a higher labor rate.
Then, we started scheduling them and working on them just like any normal vehicle.
They cram so much overly engineered proprietary technology into tiny little places where you can't even see it. Then they require a special tool to access simple things like belt tensioners and oil drain plugs. Of course, they only sell said tools at authorized service centers. I got tired of buying special tools for German junk when I started running into simple fasteners with ODD NUMBERS OF FLAT SIDES. Five sides bolts, seven point torx sockets and 15 point Allen type socket head bolts.
They should have welded the hoods shut after the drivetrain was installed.
 
I have a 2004 Dodge Ram 1500 pick up. I did not realize it had a low windshield washer solvent light until it went on this week. Usually I keep it near full but it was about 1/2 and it came on.
 
MHtractorguy said:
I got tired of buying special tools for German junk when I started running into simple fasteners with ODD NUMBERS OF FLAT SIDES. Five sides bolts, seven point torx sockets and 15 point Allen type socket head bolts.
Click to expand...
I serviced medical equipment for many years. There were so many odd fasteners and fittings that would drive you to drink or need a rubber room.... One company used a pipe fitting that looked like 1/8-27npt but it was 29tpi instead of 27... I am glad that I don't work on that stuff anymore.
My 2020 Chevrolet Colorado Work Truck is the best vehicle I have ever had. It's 2wd with a 2.5L 4 cylinder engine. It carries me and my tools with no problem and gets good gas mileage. My neighbor works at a Chevy dealer and I have him do the work on it. It works out well for me and the kid is honest
 
MHtractorguy said:
I was an auto repair technician for 30 years. We used to tell people to take their German junk (sorry) somewhere else to be worked on.
Then we decided to work on them, but we charged a higher labor rate.
Then, we started scheduling them and working on them just like any normal vehicle.
They cram so much overly engineered proprietary technology into tiny little places where you can't even see it. Then they require a special tool to access simple things like belt tensioners and oil drain plugs. Of course, they only sell said tools at authorized service centers. I got tired of buying special tools for German junk when I started running into simple fasteners with ODD NUMBERS OF FLAT SIDES. Five sides bolts, seven point torx sockets and 15 point Allen type socket head bolts.
They should have welded the hoods shut after the drivetrain was installed.
Click to expand...
I hear ya. I have a C6 Corvette and a BMW 135i. The Vette is a piece of cake to work on, for example, to change plugs it takes me little over a half hour and costs me about $30 for the 8 plugs. The 135i on the other takes me about 2 hours to do and plugs cost me about $120 for 6. It also requires a special, deep, thin walled, magnetic socket to do them. Everything’s a pain in the neck and expensive to do on the BMW.
 
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