Unexpected penetration

[61Winch]

I recently acquired a Early Bisley in 45 colt off Armslist from a frequent participant hear. This is slick little gun with 5.5 barrel, free spin cylinder , and a light trigger, maybe too light. Looked good upon receiving it until I cleaned it. The PO punched a hole into the bore when installing the full length ERH. This was of course not disclosed by seller. Two questions - Who does this and lies by omission about it? Is this a killer and should I have it repaired, e.g. shorten barrel or replace it. Ido rather not go shorter on this piece. Penetrating hole is obviosly very near the muzzle.

I've heard of this being a problem with the same screw hole on a 6.5" 357, but those are much higher pressure and closer to the breech. I don't need a projectile coming off the side at the range.

Thoughts from those who know more?

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[Highstandardguy]

Welcome to the forum but sorry for your problem.

I suggest that you discuss this with the seller if possible. It's always a good idea to give them a chance to make it right.

I had an Armslist purchase that had a problem. Contacted seller and he was unaware of the issue. Offered me my money back.

 

[61Winch]

Yes. I have tried contacting the seller. He is no longer responding to my inquiries.

 

[GunnyGene]

Good luck with this. This kind of thing is exactly why I never buy guns or most anything else on-line.

 

[Slenk]

I think I would shorten the barrel. Have it done right . And not deal with the seller again . Some internet sellers a just bad apples.

 

[61Winch]

Yes, well I spoke to this guy, and again a frequent poster on this site, and he seemed very knowledgeable and a genuine person. Goes to show my character judgement! Now he wont reply to texts. :evil:

I suppose a 5" barrell would not be too bad, go back to the standard ERH etc.

Just sucks to pay for one thing and get another, especially something as grievous as this. Another lesson learned, and already known to others Gunny! Never buy site unseen!

 

[NikA]

I think this problem is solvable with a threaded plug and some hi-temp solder or welding. I have read that people who drill gas ports on semi-auto rifles use threaded plugs welded into barrels to fix their goofs. Given that you are dealing with much less pressure in this situation, I think hi-temp solder or perhaps even permanent Loctite might be sufficient. The key would be determining the exact dimensions of the plug so it did not end up in the barrel. Luckily, your hole is near the end so you can easily reach it for measurement and touch up if necessary. Sorry you ended up with somebody else's project gun.

 

[TinkerDave]

I bought a single-shot Savage Model 220 from a seller on this forum and it was not what the seller said it was. The gun has issues, and I am most dissapointed with it. Perhaps one day, I will be able to get it fixed. In the mean time, I have no shotgun to teach my kids with and have no money to fix the thing or to buy another gun to replace it - and the worst part is, my kids have lost out because their father was just a bit too trusting. TD

 

[61Winch]

I have bought and sold online before with no issues, most folks in the shooting community are upstanding people just doing good business, but there are always those out there who want to take advantage and miss represent things they know they could not sell locally if inspected well enough. Now I am stuck with their junk and that part pisses me off the most. Lost money is one thing, but there is nothing like the feeling of being taken advantage of!!

Hopefully there is Karma in this world of some kind for those folks of low character!

Wish there was a review process for sellers on here so things like this could be posted and save others similar grief. Maybe that just turns into a pissing match and the purpose of the forum would be lost.

Thanks for the replies!

 

[Chuck 100 yd]

I think this problem is solvable with a threaded plug and some hi-temp solder or welding. I have read that people who drill gas ports on semi-auto rifles use threaded plugs welded into barrels to fix their goofs. Given that you are dealing with much less pressure in this situation, I think hi-temp solder or perhaps even permanent Loctite might be sufficient. The key would be determining the exact dimensions of the plug so it did not end up in the barrel. Luckily, your hole is near the end so you can easily reach it for measurement and touch up if necessary. Sorry you ended up with somebody else's project gun.

I agree with NikA , this is not a real issue as far as shooting goes. And it does allow much more thread in the hole to secure the ERH.
I believe I would chase the threads clear through into the bore and custom fit (make) a screw that ,when tightened down,just ends up short of the barrel grooves.
Next, I would shoot the heck out of it and forget that little hole is there.

 

[61Winch]

Being a type A and knowing that is there will bug the crap out of me I know it. That and I paid a certain price for one thing and got another. Resale value, not to mention resale ability, went out the window on this thing. I would not buy a hack job, makes you wonder what else was done to poor standards as I wonder now about the action job, site mounting, etc.

Part of the beauty of guns is well cared for value is retained and often increased over time. I take a cpl hundred dollar hit for this to get it corrected. Not cool! Thanks you know who you are!!!

I forgot he posted it on Gunbroker as well. http://www.gunbroker.com/item/560983948 No mention of a messed up barrel there either. At least he is consistent with misleading descriptions!

Armslist ad - http://www.armslist.com/posts/5534206/murfreesboro-tennessee-handguns-for-sale--custom-ruger-bisley-sold-pending-funds

 

[gtxmonte]

Are you going to keep and shoot it...........or try and sell it? If I was just planning on shooting it, I would install a longer screw in the housing that comes near the inside of the barrel and call it a day. It will not change the performance one little bit.

If the guy HAD the work done, he may not have even known and it falls on his smith..........but since he stopped responding, well that's not a good sign

 

[5of7]

When I buy on-line, I buy either from GB or here. Here I can look at the number of posts that he has and even read some of those posts to get a little feel for the kind of guy he is.

On GB, I just check his feed-back record to see if anyone has posted any negitives on him.

So far, I've not had a problem like this, but who knows what the future might bring? :roll:

 

[win1894s]

Every one I have dealt with here has been honest and straight forward.Same with Gunbroker. and Auction arms. I would contact the site you bought it from and let them know.

 

[61Winch]

I was planning on shooting it and I know it may not kill accuracy, but if needed I like to get my money back out of guns later on. If I kick over tomorrow I want my wife to be able to sell all these things and make some more cash for the kidos!

This individual as I said appeared stand up, has a good GB rating, and spends some time on here and probably no doubt has read this string by now. All that said, this is something that should have been 100% disclosed, and he failed to do so. At first the work was done by a well known smith, then after I received the gun and found no smith markings on it, not completely unusual, the story changed to the work was done by himself as he apprenticed for this well known smith. Note the Armslist ad says professional work!

Just a another story I suppose of human nature and greed letting someone else down, nothing new there!

I figure I paid about $250-$300+ too much for this as that is the price of a new barrel at most legit shops with the site installed, bluing, shipping, etc.

You never know he could change his mind, let me know he messed up and shoot me a partial refund, and or 100% refund and get his gun back. But after four days and three messages with no response, I wont hold my breath. He is alive as I have seen his posts her on this forum.

 

[golferboy426]

He needs to be outed if he continues to fail to respond.

 

[PotatoJudge]

I know it may not help, but if it's any consolation I bought a Gallagher gun on here with a custom barrel and it had the same. Didn't notice it until the ERH got a little loose and I pulled the screw to locktite it. With a the ERH screw cut just the right length and a tiny bit of fouling, I never would have known had not the ERH loosened.

The gun has a great action and I shoot it better than almost any other gun I own.

Were I to sell the gun (which I never would) I'd disclose this but would't drop the price for it. Neither your gun or mine is a collector item and this has zero effect on accuracy.

BTW, I like the look of your gun and would be happy to own it- extra hole in the barrel or no.

 

[61Winch]

I guess I clean mine a bit more meticulously as I noticed the dark patch in the bore immediately, so not sure I would have been oblivious to it until the screw came loose.

Regardless, should have been disclosed and I have a hard time believing a reputable Smith would ever send something out the door like this. Isn't John a one man show for that very reason, quality control.

 

[daveg.inkc]

I sent him an email asking why he didn't disclose. Wait and see what he says

 

[daveg.inkc]

I'd say its a rare Ruger and shoot it. It is a nice looking Blackhawk. Bet it shoots great!

 

[61Winch]

LOL ........If I toss my other guns on the garage floor, they will be unique too, too unique to sell anymore!

 

[gtxmonte]

This is just me, but seeing as the hole doesn't hurt anything, nor does it alter the performance of the pistol, I personally wouldn't care. Being that boomers in these pistols tend to loosen up the ERH screw anyway, it might be a blessing, if you shoot it a lot. If I liked the pistol and wanted to buy it, this would not make it worth less to ME. Others may think different

 

[61Winch]

Yes it can be fired and could have little ill effect of the third hole other than another hole to dig lead out of. Who knows for sure and YES it looks good!

Problem really is the lack of disclosure so that I could have made the choice of if this effects accuracy and safety. I'm not aware of anyone testing a gun with two holes, then again with three, to know for certain this is not an issue. If it's no big deal, why spend time drilling the site mount, or ERH screws so precisely, just bore a hole with the cordless and tap it through and through. How many folks have customized guns from a reputable shop with a additional hole in the barrel and who would be happy with that?

Update - The seller did attempt to call, I was in a meeting and could not answer at the time. I texted back, his preferred method of communication so far, requesting that I would like to only communicate in writing to avoid further confusion, no response. Not all that surprising......

 

[leemar28]

It pays to have an inspection period in the sale agreement. I sure would have been a mite ticked if I had found that hole in the bore myself. Give the seller a chance to make it right. If they don't then name him /her . I sure would not want to trade with them.

 

[61Winch]

Yes, lesson learned, I guess once more my confidence in people doing the right thing is gone.

Well RyanC.Ross has had two weeks to do the right thing, but is not interested, so all I can do is try to resell it for what I paid, disclosing the flaw and hope someone else is not put off by it as much as I am.

I would not recommend doing business with Ryan again, only because he didn't disclose the hole and knew it was there and would be a issue for most buyers. Probably look for this piece in the classified section soon.

BTW - Ran some 255gr and 300gr through it this afternoon and it is a fine shooting pistol for the dozen or so rounds I had time to put through it. Point of aim was a bit low, but I think that was the loads. Probably set for heavier loads.

 

[Cholo]

I see that ryanc.ross is a member here. Why not send him a PM with a link to this thread and see where it goes? This is a link to this thread so you can copy/paste it to the PM:

www.rugerforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=241250

I hope y'all can work it out...

 

[61Winch]

Well he is fully aware of what he did, and after shipment was received he no longer was in communication. Several texts, his preferred method of communication, returned nothing. He is fully aware of my issues and is not interested in doing the right thing, so buyer beware of lying by omission from this seller.

Happy 4th!

 

[snakeeyes4445]

I would say that it belongs back on the bench of the smith who did the work or maybe the seller did the work and that's why he won't answer back.

One thing that we could all think to ask is: Is there anything wrong with the gun?

It puts the seller in the legal position of mis representing the product and you would have a basis for a small claims filing. If the seller is not in your state, the possibility of having to defend themselves inconveniently will usually produce results.

Having to put a new barrel on would not bankrupt the seller. I would be leary of sending it back unless you have the money back in hand though. I also believe like several others that it "could" be repaired. I can tell you from experience that any small burr at in the barrel will disrupt accuracy with lead bullets, not so much jacketed.

Whoever did the work knows what he did and should pay for it, that's the only way he is going to remember the error. A person's reputation is his most valuable comodity.

 

[61Winch]

It puts the seller in the legal position of mis representing the product and you would have a basis for a small claims filing. If the seller is not in your state, the possibility of having to defend themselves inconveniently will usually produce results.

Sad if it came to this but Ryan clearly doesn't care about standing behind this or I would have my $$'s back and he would have this three eyed gun back. He could also send me $300 to have a new barrel replaced. Either way would be the stand up thing to do!

 

[ryanc.ross]

I have been on vacation in mountain country of deep western North Carolina. Internet/phone service is sparse. This is totally ridiculous.....He has not returned a phone call yet! I will continue to call him to resolve the issue. Which I am sure he will post a detailed description of the voicemails I have left him.