The 7th Shot

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LAH

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Heard of this but never had it happen. And you guessed it, no cleaning rod.

Primer


Removed the cylinder & found this


Sure enough a bullet in there
 

427mach1

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I had the same thing happen to me with my 44 mag SBH using factory ammo about 30 years ago. After noticing the gun didn't fire, I pointed it toward the ground and powder poured out from around the front of the cylinder. The scary thing is you could have easily pulled the hammer back, lined another one up, and pulled the trigger.
 

LAH

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427mach1 said:
The scary thing is you could have easily pulled the hammer back, lined another one up, and pulled the trigger.

That would be like your Mach1 going Mach2 into a solid hiwall. NO NO NO NO NO NO
 

Jimbo357mag

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Houston we have a problem!! Factory or reload? Do you have any idea what might have caused the squib? I am going to guess 'bad primer' because it looks like there was powder in the cartridge. :shock:
 

ra

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Jimbo357mag said:
Houston we have a problem!! Factory or reload? Do you have any idea what might have caused the squib? I am going to guess 'bad primer' because it looks like there was powder in the cartridge. :shock:

The primer had to be good to drive the bullet into the barrel. I had a 357 158 gr. lead bullet slip thru without any powder and it barely started into the forcing cone, it had the cylinder locked up.

Roger
 

LAH

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Jimbo357mag said:
Houston we have a problem!! Factory or reload? Do you have any idea what might have caused the squib? I am going to guess 'bad primer' because it looks like there was powder in the cartridge. :shock:

Handload, Remington case, Zero 38-158-HP, Winchester small pistol magnum primer, & 12.5 grains of AA9. I loaded a 1000 of these to break in the Ruger. This round was 800 something or another.
 

Jimbo357mag

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LAH said:
Handload, Remington case, Zero 38-158-HP, Winchester small pistol magnum primer, & 12.5 grains of AA9. I loaded a 1000 of these to break in the Ruger. This round was 800 something or another.
Wow, that's hard to believe the Mag primer didn't set the powder off very well. I use 13.0gr of #9 with a standard primer all the time and they have always (knock on wood) lit off for me. I still think 'bad primer'. Must not have lit the powder very well. :shock:
 

paul105

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I can't discount the possibility of a bad primer, but the primer seemed to have had enough "ooph" (for lack of a better word), to drive that 158gr jacketed bullet into the barrel beyond the barrel cyl gap. I doubt you will ever know the reason.

Recently had a similar experience. It was my fault. I loaded a batch of 45 ACPs w/200gr LSWC and 5.0gr HP38, Win LP Primer. After loading, I put the batch in a big bowl filled with water, dish soap and vinegar and agitated by hand to clean them up a bit.

At the range, I was shooting a FA97 with a .45 ACP Aux cylinder when I got an unexpected misfire. Couldn't cock the hammer or turn the cylinder and knew immediately what had happened -- bullet stuck between face of cyl and barrel.

A long time ago, I bought a "squib load rod set" from Brownells. It was an easy task to move the bullet back into the cyl/case and the case out of the cylinder. It turn out that the case was split, and when immersed in the cleaning solution, it must have contaminated the powder.

Old "Murphy" is always sitting on everybody's shoulder just waiting to screw things up -- you need to be constantly aware of things that don't sound/feel right.

If you shoot enough, even the most vigilent will ultimately experience the unexpected.

FWIW,

Paul
 

Jimbo357mag

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paul105 said:
After loading, I put the batch in a big bowl filled with water, dish soap and vinegar and agitated by hand to clean them up a bit.

Old "Murphy" ...
I think that procedure is giving old "Murphy" more than a helping hand. :shock: :shock:
 

mr surveyor

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Jimbo357mag said:
paul105 said:
After loading, I put the batch in a big bowl filled with water, dish soap and vinegar and agitated by hand to clean them up a bit.

Old "Murphy" ...
I think that procedure is giving old "Murphy" more than a helping hand. :shock: :shock:


I agree :!:
 

Rusty W

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My guess, & it's just a guess, is neck tension. You load cast bullets sometimes? Check that case w/the expander your using and see what the neck tension is. .357 vs. .358 maybe enough difference for a lack of enough tension so when you popped the primer it pushed the bullet out w/o light off the powder. I ran into this once using H110 in the 45colt. Also using Remington cases.
 

Enigma

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I've heard of instances of slow-burning propellants not being ignited, even by magnum primers. Seems like it usually happens with reduced loads or in relatively cold temperatures. Glad you caught that one!
 

Jimbo357mag

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Enigma said:
I've heard of instances of slow-burning propellants not being ignited, even by magnum primers. Seems like it usually happens with reduced loads or in relatively cold temperatures. Glad you caught that one!
12.5gr of Accurate #9 with a 158gr jacketed bullet is just above a starting load in their online manual. http://www.accuratepowder.com/ A magnum primer is specified (WSPM) which is what was used. btw I have found no problems using standard primers with AA#9. The only reason for a squib could be a failure of the primer to ignite the powder for some reason. The primer might have been defective or the powder in that one cartridge contaminated but I would put money on a problem with that one primer. Remember he made-up 1000 rounds and had shot 800 of them. Perhaps the primer got contaminated somehow, maybe a drop of sweat fell on it. That is a constant problem and worry for me when reloading. :shock:
 

LAH

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The load is surely far from max. I thought maybe this might be the problem. Also contamination perhaps is possible. There was enough pressure to firmly seat the bullet in the barrel. The rifling covers all but 1/8" of the base.
 

mr surveyor

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could the flash hole have been clogged enough to block the primer flame, but still allow the pressure to unseat the bullet? The machining marks on the primer sure look like the primer made strong contact with the recoil shield
 

LAH

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That theory makes good sense. There was definitely pressure there but when I removed the case there was no sign that any of the powder lit.
 

#1rugerman

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Had a similar problem in the 70's when I started loading 45-70 for my Marlin 1895, I bought factory primmed brass loaded up 20 rounds with various amounts of IMR 3031 and stepped out the back door to test them. First round pop, no boom. Opened the action and brass popped out and the whole load of powder dumped into the action and the bullet was jammed in the barrel. I went inside nocked the bullet out of the barrel and cleaned the powder out of the action, went back outside and tried it again. Pop, no boom. This time the powder was fused into a lump in the case and the bullet was stuck in the barrel. Then I pulled all the bullets ,saved the powder and popped all the primmers by running them thru the gun. All the primmers fired but with a reduced report (checked this by firing a fresh primmer from a new box of primmers) I don't know what had happened to the primmers but I no longer even think about buying factory primmed brass.
 

mr surveyor

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I just can't wrap my head around the possibility of a "bad primer". Unless you had a 40 pound hammer spring that could turn your revolver into a kinetic bullet puller, the primer had to be what sent the bullet and powder into the barrel. And unless there was something in that single piece of brass that could contaminate that single charge of powder enough to keep it from lighting it up, there has to be some other answer.

Maybe even a drop of water/sweat/lube in the flash hole at the time of loading could have deactivated the tiny bit of powder in the flash hole enough to form a "plug"?

Just grabbing at straws.

surv
 

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