Lead bullet advice

[duct tape]

I've posted this on both ruger sites hoping to find some advice before I start loading:

Help a new member with some reloading questions. I have two .44 mag SBH's and one Ruger .44 special that I'd like to load some target/plinking etc loads potentially with lead bullets. I'm not new to reloading, with thousands of .38 super comp and .40 S&W rounds for IPSC and plenty of rifle loads. But I've never loaded lead bullets before.

1. Lube - is this something that comes with new bullets that are bought from say Montana Bullets or Oregon Trail, or part of the casting process if made at home, or is this something I need to buy and add to each bullet before seating? I've read Lyman, Hornady and other manuals and looked through several searches here but nothing's really answered this basic (and probably obvious) question.
2. Crimp - I'm assuming these .44 cal cartridges headspace on the rim rather than the end of the case, unlike my IPSC loads where the crimp has to be fairly light to not affect the headspace - so I'm assuming a good medium crimp to hold bullet against recoil, etc.? Can you overcrimp and significantly increase pressures?
3. Plated bullets - prices for Berrys and Xtreme are not too far off bulk LSWC bullets, and eliminate any leading problems. Since I have no interest pouring and moulding my own, which would certainly be the cheapest route, what are downsides to plated bullets? Is accuracy worse than with lead?

Thanks to all for any advice.

 

[Flash]

Most commercial cast bullet suppliers sell their bullets already lubed but when you cast yourself, you'll have to apply it. For the beginner, liquid alox works fine and your bullets can be shot as cast without sizing.

Crimping with cast bullets should be just enough to firmly grip the bullet and since you have to bell the mouth of the case to accept a cast bullet without damaging it, too little crimp might not reduce this bell enough to allow chambering. Oh, and don't create too much bell because you'll just over work you cases since it must be crimped closed.

I shoot plated bullets in my 9MMs and don't see a downside.

 

[mraywi]

missouribullet.com
inexpensive and great quality,especially for plinking,

 

[GP100man]

As reloading is a different aspect in the shooting sports so is Casting Bullets!!!!

For a World of info GO here !!!!

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/

 

[Paul B]

I believe most, if not all commercially cast bullets come with lube already applied.
With the type of loads you're looking at a moderate crimp should be more than sufficient.
Dunno about the plated bullets. I cast my own so I don't use them.

My personal loads for the .44 Spl. use 7.5 gr. of Unique and a 250 gr. cast bullet. (Either the Lyman #429241 Elmer Keith's bullet or the Lyman #429244, a similar bullet with gas check. This load was the late Skeeter Skelton's favorite load for the .44 Spl.

For light load in the .44 magnum, try those same bullets with 8.0 to 9.0 gr. of Unique.

Neither load would be considered a heavy load but will have enough power to let you know you're shooting a real gun and not some lightweight load.

Elmer Keith said he used 5.0 gr. of Bullseye wwith his bullet for practice. he said it would hit to the same point of impact as his full power 22.0 gr. 0f #2400 load with that bullet. (Considered to be too hot these days according to the manual. The #2400 load, not the Bullseye load.) The 5.0 gr./Bullseye load do what he says but in that big cartridge case, I always worry that I would miss a double charge so I don't use it. I would imagine the same charge with W321 would work but haven't tried it.
Paul B.

 

[Scott]

I roll my lead bullets in liquid alox before loading them, even though they have that crayon type lube on them already. It's helped decrease leading in my blackhawk considerably.

 

[duct tape]

Thx to all for info.

Paul, The Skeeter load was one I was looking at. It's interesting however that the max load in Lyman's #49th is 6.9 grains of Unique for #429421 SWC at 767 fps. So the Skeeter load is above max?

 

[Bucks Owin]

http://www.lasc.us/ArticlesFryxell.htm :wink:

 

[Paul B]

Thx to all for info.

Paul, The Skeeter load was one I was looking at. It's interesting however that the max load in Lyman's #49th is 6.9 grains of Unique for #429421 SWC at 767 fps. So the Skeeter load is above max?

It would be above max according to SAAMI specs. I've seen the Ruger .44 Spl. and the cylinder walls are a bit thicker than my S&W 624 and a heck of a lot thicker than my Colt Single action in .44 Spl.
The sad thing about the .44 Spl. is when it replaced the .44 Russian, it was loaded to the same power level as the Russian. Skeeter's load is mild compared to what Elmer Keith did with the round prior to the .44 magnum in the old S&W Triple Lock handguns which BTW did not have a heat treated cylinder. That's probably why SAAMI decided to keep pressure on the very low side in the .44 Spl.
I have a Super Blackhawk with 4 5/8" barrel and a standard Blackhawk grip frame. For a short barreled gun it's quite heavy. When I held the new Ruger .44 Spl., I thought it weighed a bit too much considering the cartridge. Personally, I would have no qualms using Skeeter's load in that gun from now until hell froze over and the devil goes ice skating, but that's me. You'll have to make up your own mind on whether or not to use the load.
Paul B.

 

[pop-gunner]

I believe most, if not all commercially cast bullets come with lube already applied.
With the type of loads you're looking at a moderate crimp should be more than sufficient.
Dunno about the plated bullets. I cast my own so I don't use them.

My personal loads for the .44 Spl. use 7.5 gr. of Unique and a 250 gr. cast bullet. (Either the Lyman #429241 Elmer Keith's bullet or the Lyman #429244, a similar bullet with gas check. This load was the late Skeeter Skelton's favorite load for the .44 Spl.

For light load in the .44 magnum, try those same bullets with 8.0 to 9.0 gr. of Unique.

Neither load would be considered a heavy load but will have enough power to let you know you're shooting a real gun and not some lightweight load.

Elmer Keith said he used 5.0 gr. of Bullseye wwith his bullet for practice. he said it would hit to the same point of impact as his full power 22.0 gr. 0f #2400 load with that bullet. (Considered to be too hot these days according to the manual. The #2400 load, not the Bullseye load.) The 5.0 gr./Bullseye load do what he says but in that big cartridge case, I always worry that I would miss a double charge so I don't use it. I would imagine the same charge with W321 would work but haven't tried it.
Paul B.

I haven't loaded 5.0gr of 231 but I have loaded some light .44magnum cases with 8.0 of 231.
It's silly accurate in both my Smiths and my SBH.
I don't have data for the SBH but in a 4 inch Smith 29-2 it runs at 923fps over my chrony.That's on a 60 degree day sitting 109ft above sea level.

Bullets bought from most commercial manufactures will come lubed already but if there is any doubt just call them and ask.
I shoot Dardas' bullets which are lubed but I still give them a thin coating of Lee Liquid Alox. I don't know if it helps or not but they don't lead my revolvers.
I like the Dardas because I can order them as big as .432.
Penn bullets is another company I have heard good things about but have never used myself but I know you can order them in a few different sizes.

My Rugers have .430 chamber throats where my older Smiths have .432 throats. It's a good idea to measure your chamber throats before buying a bunch of lead bullets. The bullets you buy should match your throat size or be .001 larger to reduce or eliminate leading. The bullet itself should be a slip fit if you drop it into your cylinder.
Shooting undersized bullets will allow some gas cutting and cause some serious leading.

This is not an issue with jacketed bullets which is why Hornady XTPs which measure .430 work just as well as Speer bullets measuring .429 in guns with chamber throats as large as .432

Most of my load these days consist on 10gr Unique under a 240gr LSWC.
I use a medium crimp for light loads and a moderate/heavy crimp as I go up in power.

I do not use plated bullets but I have tried. I still have a few hundred Berry's Bullets plated 240gr HPs that I will never load. I have had no luck not having them separate. I use a Lee FCD and by the time I have just enough of a crimp that the bullet won't jump out of the case under recoil I have already cut through that thin plating. This may not be an issue using a taper crimp die but I'm not willing to buy a new die just to load 300 or so bullets. I do love plated bullets in other calibers and have shot tens of thousands of Berrys Bullets in .45acp. Just not for the .44s.

 

[WESHOOT2]

In my 44 Redhawk (also used for USPSA) I load lead; I crimp firmly with superior Redding Profile Crimp dies.
I crimp plated Rainiers with them, too.

I get better accuracy from lead than plated bullets in the 44. I have tested with lead, plated, and jacketed, but the expense of jacketed bullets (in 44 Magnum) is prohibitive FOR ME to use regularly for competition, even though my most accurate loads use them. Commercially purchased lead bullets come with lube already applied.

www.PennBullets.com (offers a superb 205g 44 choice good for multiple duties, AND a shape condusive for rapid speedloader reloading; IPSC concern).

I have crimped the tops off of bullets when experimenting with crimp affects.

Proper load process, bore treatment, and component choices can eliminate leading concerns.

A33102