June 6th

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Nov 15, 2005
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Greenville, SC: USA
Got home late last night and after washing came up stairs (from my man cave) and my wife was watching a program on PBS on D-Day.... sat down and watched probably the last half. I have to admit I get teary eyed every time I learn about things like this... This program followed several old American vets that were on different beaches and in ships that day.

Some of y'all like to put down the French but there is one thing mentioned in this program as they showed the American Cemetery of 9000+ crosses and stars... the French keep it up to a meticulous standard.
 
The 29th Division Association, which I belong to, generally has some members visit Omaha each year. I personally have never made the trip but have spoken with others that have and they say it is a sobering thing to view the grave site. Never forget their sacrifice.
 
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A friend of mine, retired military, posed the question "Why are military graves in foreign lands marked with crosses or star of David, while in the US, they are the rounded slabs?"

I couldn't answer him.

Bob Wright
 
June 6th was also Son's longest day. That was the day in 1990 that he went to Pensacola and entered the NavCad/Naval Aviation Cadet Program. There was a very friendly Marine DI there to greet him with a few kind words of encouragement. :D :D :wink:
Sure doesn't seem like it has been 27 years ago. Time flies :(
 
Lifting a jar tonite to Frenchie Dakota (sp?) who went in with the Rangers scaling the cliffs to take out German shore batteries on D-DAY -1. A Canadian citizen at the time and tough as nails even as an old guy -- he was a Golden Gloves fighter --, never bragged or showed his medals. A neighbor where I grew up in Detroit.

wunbe
 
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A story from my dad who landed on Omaha the day after.

He mentioned a lot of sad sights but never told anything much & I learned early in life not to ask a vet the "wrong" questions. He did mention seeing the tanks & other vehicles sitting in the ocean away from the shore. Not the bombed ones, but the ones that had been prepared to operate in several feet of water, or built to be amphibious. The unexpected rough seas on the 6th drowned them out soon after they left the landing craft. His Tank Battalion lost nearly 2 thirds of their armor that day, a lot of the loss was from the rough seas. I never doubted my dad, but many years later I found that Wiki has good info on it. The 741st Tank Battalion.
 
I actually have one complaint about the video we see EVERY time they
are doing a piece on D-Day. It is a clip of one guy that is killed about three
or four steps out of the landing craft. We see him hit and he goes down to
stay. I'll bet I've (and, I'll bet you have) seen that clip at least one hundred
times. In any video presentation they will play that clip four to ten times.

Granted, there is no "new" video available, but WHY the same clip over,
and over, and over, and over?

Now back to the thread subject.
 
Fox Mike, my father-in-law was in the 29th and was one of three from his LST that made it to the beach. He was a machine gunner and made it through that horror but was wounded twice in the following months. I can't even comprehend what a small town boy of about 300 people must have gone through that day.
 
blume357 said:
Some of y'all like to put down the French but there is one thing mentioned in this program as they showed the American Cemetery of 9000+ crosses and stars... the French keep it up to a meticulous standard.

Hi,

In talking about those cemeteries, did they show the school kids out decorating each one of them with both the American AND French flag each year? I watched one documentary where some D-Day vets actually went to a couple of the schools to thank the children, as well as their teachers for keeping the day alive for their students. This would have been probably the 65th anniversary in 2009. Any of those kids probably has better knowledge of what went on that day and in the days that ensued than 99 44/100% of OUR kids (all the way thru college!)

The kids were in awe of those men, standing right there in their classrooms, hugging and thanking each of them. Talk about blurry screens and old guys with dust in their eyes!

Rick C
 
Pat-inCO said:
Granted, there is no "new" video available, but WHY the same clip over,
and over, and over, and over?

Hi,

Maybe a little back story will shed some light for you, Pat. This came from a friend, whom I know as Brad, but posts as Hurtgenwald, who's involved with a WWII reenactment group called CHG, or California Historical Group. They have a few photos on their website: http://www.chgww2.net/ Brad's posted many more on another site: http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/193540-t4-walter-e-cummings-166th-signal-photo-corps/ It takes a while to get thru all of them, plus visiting all the links, but it's time well spent for anyone with an interest in this subject.

CHG's pictures come from many sources, while those on usmilitariaforum come from the 166th Signal Photo Company, the official unit of Patton's 3rd Army, 89th Div, which was with him from the beach at Normandy, to Berlin, with various stops, most notably at Ohrdruf, one of the first Nazi concentration camps that was liberated. When Ike first got to that camp, he ordered the photographers to shoot as much as they could of it, lest somebody should come back years later and and try to deny it ever happened! Was the General prescient or what? Anyway, somewhere in those pictures is one the photographer made a note on the back of, which in his own hand says something like "How can anyone deny now?" At least a couple of the unit's members went back home to Hollywood, where some had worked before the war, and earned a bit of fame and fortune. One was director Stanley Kramer, another was Russ Meyer, who is perhaps best known for putting the adult film industry on the big screen. Some of you may remember The Pussycat Theaters of the early '70s. Those were Russ' idea. Walter "Bill" Cummings, who's pictured in some of the pictures Brad posted, and shot many more of them, was a personal friend of both my friend and his Dad, and provided a lot of background stories for the photos when he was alive.

Among them is an explanation of the dearth of D-Day photos. As Bill told the story to Brad and his Dad, nobody upstairs realized how big a deal D-Day would be, how ferocious the fighting and how incredible the loss of personnel and equipment would prove to be, so the combat photographers actually involved in the first day's invasion weren't issued enough film to begin with. Many then ran out of film, and obtained more from captured Germans or their positions. As you look thru those pictures on the Forum, you'll notice some have a black border instead of the normal white one. These are photos taken on German film, which used a slightly different developing process from ours that yielded the black border.

A second bit of bad luck explains even more about the lack of photos. Apparently most of the film shot on June 6 was supposed to be transferred from land to a ship going back across the Channel to England. 100s of rolls of film were put in a duffel or other bag, sent out on a smaller craft, and were to go to the larger vessel. Somehow, that bag broke loose as it was being hauled up and went straight to the bottom of Channel, with the ensuing loss of most of our combat picture documentation of that day.

So, very little of the film and video footage actually shot on June 6 survives, including this famous scene we've all seen untold numbers of times. I understand most of the surviving video of that day, including that particular scene, was shot by Russ Meyer himself. He's also credited with much of the authentic footage used in the movie "Patton." We should be thankful even that little bit is still with us to help remind us of what happened that day. I know I am, as I've had the privilege of seeing those photos in person, and holding many in my own hands! It's hard to describe that feeling...

Rick C
 
Sounds like a prime example of not putting all your eggs in one basket. You would think who ever was in charge of the combat photographers would have known this. Then again, I'm still amazed at the Army committee that decided that the point man in an advance patrol should fire tracers at any enemy machine gunners he sees so that the others in his group can target it. Seems we lost a lot of point men before somebody figured out this might not be the best stratagem.
 
blume357 said:
Sounds like a prime example of not putting all your eggs in one basket. You would think who ever was in charge of the combat photographers would have known this.

Hi,

Blume, I agree, but at the same time, the very first example of an oxymoron I can remember learning is "military intelligence." ;)

In reading up on the 166th Signal Photo Company, it appears a lot of the combat photo groups were hastily tossed together at the last minute, and considering the chaos of all the rest of the operation with its changes and such, a story like this doesn't surprise me.

Rick C
 
I got a book I think from a karma here about a year or two ago about the mistakes that occurred after D-day and how the allies were suppose to reach Nice in like a day or two and it took well over a month and all the problems that caused... The Germans massed several divisions in that time and finally Eisenhower got the Air Corps to cooperate and the they obliterated something like 30,000 soldiers in a matter of several days.... there was a description of traveling through that area several days later... this was in August.

One of the parts I remember about that PBS program was while the film spent a good bit of time showing different 'drone' views of the 9,000+ american graves... just before that they briefly showed the German cemetery of the 'D-Day' casualties.... something like 21,000.
 
blume357 said:
........
One of the parts I remember about that PBS program was while the film spent a good bit of time showing different 'drone' views of the 9,000+ american graves... just before that they briefly showed the German cemetery of the 'D-Day' casualties.... something like 21,000.

Actually, the German graves are not just D-Day casualties (Nor are the American graves). The sad part is that the Germans didn't have dog tags - they had paper ID which, in many cases, was illegible or gone. A staggering number of the German graves are marked "A German Soldier".

Went to Normandy several years ago on a European vacation.... standing on Omaha Beach and looking up at the bluffs with the remains of the German bunkers gave me the chills. If you get the chance, it's well worth seeing.... there's a nice little hotel just east of Carantan near the little town of Isigny-Sur-Mer.
 
Being a war baby I grew up with most all of the fathers being war veterans. Once, and only once, I asked a relative about his war experiences. My mother took me aside and explained, in no uncertain terms, that the topic was never to be asked of a vet. If they volunteered any stories that was okay but never ask.

I now know why but we have missed out on a lot of great stories because of this rule. One of my uncles was a Mustang pilot and loved to tell stories. Part of the reason seems to be that the fighter pilots had a lot more humorous stories to tell than did the poor ground pounders who had never ending visions of dead bodies both friend and foe.
 
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