Engineering wizardry, once again

[Fox Mike]

Some may remember my post a while back concerning the idiot that designed the left headlight socket assembly. Well today I had to replace the right headlight bulb. Once again an engineering marvel. There is the assembly, in clear view. . .except. . . they placed the hood prop bar and hinge right behind the assembly. I had to dig through various and sundry tools to find one that would remove the cover then more to actually remove the bulb. I am certainly glad that I don't drink.

 

[redhawker]

Yup, that's what happens when engineers don't have to work on the stuff they design. I remember years ago there was a car that, if you got the big v8 engine in it, if you wanted to change the spark plugs to get to the back two you had to unbolt the engine mounts and lift the engine part way out of the engine bay.

 

[arfmel]

I was at the nearest Ford dealership in the service department a couple weeks back and they had the cab taken off the frame of a Super Duty pickup to do some kind of work on the engine. ridiculous.

 

[wolfsong]

It's necessary to dismantle the air filter assembly in order to reeplace the passenger side headlight bulb on my Silverado. The other side can be changed fairly easily if you have the arm length of a full grown octopus and the hands of elf. Grrrrrr..

 

[caryc]

I was at the nearest Ford dealership in the service department a couple weeks back and they had the cab taken off the frame of a Super Duty pickup to do some kind of work on the engine. ridiculous.

I guess that makes things easier for them and more expensive for you.

 

[Rick Courtright]

I remember years ago there was a car that, if you got the big v8 engine in it, if you wanted to change the spark plugs to get to the back two you had to unbolt the engine mounts and lift the engine part way out of the engine bay.

Hi,

A co-worker and one of our supervisors each had early Fox body Mustangs and both mentioned that procedure for one of the plugs. And these were 302s, not exactly massive in their space requirements. In HS, a buddy's older sister had a 64 1/2 with a 260, and it was fairly easy to get around. Wonder what was going on in their heads with the later ones?

"Dungeoneering" was the term my neighbor used "back when." He'd worked for a few years as a mechanic, and claimed the car companies locked their engineers in dungeons to do their work, and they never even saw the light of day, let alone got dirty, or worse, bloody, working on the stuff they designed.

Rick C

 

[contender]

I've mentioned it often.
"One of these days,, I'll be in a social setting,, when I ask someone what they do for a living. They reply; "I'm an automotive engineer." And when the silly SOB wakes up in the hospital,, I'll be there to show him what happened,, AGAIN!!!!!!!"

I've said that for over 30 years now. And,, it finally happened. Sadly,, it was in just about the worst place in the world for it to happen. Blackjack table, Las Vegas, just two years ago. When this young man of about 28ish,, about 6'1", Fairly solid looking said he was an engineer,, and lived in New York, I didn't dream he'd be in the automotive industry. Then when asked,, he said; "I work for GM." My very FIRST thoughts were; "Too many cameras & not enough bail money & I'm in the wrong town w/o any friends."
So,, I had to ask him what he owned,, and if he did any mechanical work on his own vehicle. He replied,, that he owned a p/u truck, and he did change his own oil. I replied,, "No,, I mean REAL mechanical work." He said he didn't,, so I gave him my spiel of how I felt about automotive engineers. About 2-3 hands of blackjack later,, he got up & left.


I ALMOST followed him,, but I figured there would still be too many cameras around.

 

[Dan in MI]

We've had this discussion before so I won't get into the why's again.

I will say this, long, no, I mean LONG (15-20") extensions and QUALITY universal joints are your friend. When used properly much of what you complain about is a non-issue.

Regarding fox bodies with 302's/351's, your friend needs training. I worked on those when they were new and that was never the case. Read the above paragraph and try it.

 

[Fox Mike]

We've had this discussion before so I won't get into the why's again.

I will say this, long, no, I mean LONG (15-20") extensions and QUALITY universal joints are your friend. When used properly much of what you complain about is a non-issue.

Regarding fox bodies with 302's/351's, your friend needs training. I worked on those when they were new and that was never the case. Read the above paragraph and try it.

I turned wrenches for most of my life. I can guarantee you that no amount of extensions OR universal joints would have accomplished what was needed in my particular case. A very large Vanadin Super slot joint pliers removed the cover and a set of angle needle nose pliers accomplished the removal of the bulb and socket.

 

[DeletedMember275]

Someone told a story about the Lear Jet company requiring all of their engineers to work in maintenance (actually working on the aircraft) before they were actually allowed to design anything, back in the day. An excellent policy, and one that should be mandatory in any industry.

 

[RSIno1]

You have to remember they are designed for ease of assembly not maintenance. The Ford Taurus was the first car the Detroit engineers invited mechanics to assist with the design process.
If you want fun try to get the right rear plugs out of a big block 67-68 Mustang. Even worse is a Sunbeam Tiger. To get those you crawl under the dash and pull out a couple rubber plugs then try to get the baked on wire off with no room for fingers or special spark plug boot pliers.

 

[SamV]

I suppose the positive view is that things don't need to be replaced as frequently as in the past. I seem to recall replacing spark plugs every year on my early 1970s cars. Plus rotors,points, caps, wires, etc. I used to do almost all of my own maintenance, and I know that today's cars don't seem to need anywhere near the frequency of repairs and maintenance of those 40 years ago.
Of course, it is true that when things do need to be done, it won't be easy. Occasionally, it is probably worth it to do a few other things when everything is torn apart for one repair.

 

[exavid]

One nice thing about modern ignition systems and the removal of lead in gasoline is that spark plugs seem to last nearly forever. I had a 1998 Grand Marquis that had almost 200,000 miles on it. Every time I had the oil changed they'd try to sell me new plugs. Just before I sold it I pulled a couple plugs and discovered they were hardly worn at all. All eight were fine wire plugs with very little erosion on the electrodes. Also very little carbon build up either. If that's how good they looked with 200k miles I decided to let them stay.

My test for spark plugs is if the engine starts quickly, idles smoothly, doesn't miss when you punch it and the mileage hasn't dropped the plugs are just fine.

A few month ago I had a slight miss in my 3.7L '07 Jeep Liberty. My diagnostic tool said intermittent miss in one cylinder. In the end I changed out all the plugs and spark coils. The miss was coming from a damaged coil.
$80 and an hour of easy work and I had new plugs and coils and all was well. The old plugs looked pretty good so I saved a few on them as well as a couple of the spark coils. The car has about 135,000 miles on it.

 

[Rick Courtright]

Regarding fox bodies with 302's/351's, your friend needs training. I worked on those when they were new and that was never the case. Read the above paragraph and try it.

Hi,

Thanks for the advice, Dan! Unfortunately we're 30 years too late for the two fellows I mentioned, but I'm sure somebody will come up with another Fox body housing a V-8 one of these days... and I can look brilliant when they start to complain!

Rick C

 

[Aqualung]

I was at the nearest Ford dealership in the service department a couple weeks back and they had the cab taken off the frame of a Super Duty pickup to do some kind of work on the engine. ridiculous.

I bought a 2018 F150 with the 5.0l V8. They're experiencing oil consumption issues with the 5.0s and mine is one of them.

Fix is replacement of the long block.

Though some dealerships don't, standard practice is to pull the cab. The tech told me that they need to pull the cabs to work on the diesel engines.

Aqualung

 

[woodsy]

How about the Buick Verano (four cylinder) where there is a stone (?) shield covering the oil-drain plug, eliminating the concept of a tidy oil change? I bet the Buick mechanics had a party once they learned that the model is no longer offered for sale.

 

[dg101win]

Any more if someone says "I am an Engineer", I ask them what kind of train they drive.

 

[Rick Courtright]

Any more if someone says "I am an Engineer", I ask them what kind of train they drive.

Hi,

Now I'm having an identity crisis! I've never said I'm an engineer. But I have driven a freight train... am I missing out on some braggin' rights?

Rick C

 

[exavid]

Maybe so. I have done a couple of sanitation engineering jobs in the past. One of my kids plugged up the john.

 

[caryc]

Any more if someone says "I am an Engineer", I ask them what kind of train they drive.

Hi,

Now I'm having an identity crisis! I've never said I'm an engineer. But I have driven a freight train... am I missing out on some braggin' rights?

Rick C

I drove an aircraft carrier.

 

[Fox Mike]

Any more if someone says "I am an Engineer", I ask them what kind of train they drive.

Hi,

Now I'm having an identity crisis! I've never said I'm an engineer. But I have driven a freight train... am I missing out on some braggin' rights?

Rick C

I drove an aircraft carrier.

Me too, if hauling an OH-6A on a 40' lowboy counts.

 

[Bull Barrel]

To change the oil filter on my moorsickles the oil sump must be dropped. The spin on filter is inside.

 

[6GUNSONLY]

I was at the nearest Ford dealership in the service department a couple weeks back and they had the cab taken off the frame of a Super Duty pickup to do some kind of work on the engine. ridiculous.

Yes, major engine work on the 6.4L diesels is a cab-off proposition. I think the newer 6.7L is better. Mines the older 6.0L.

I was going to replace a failed headlight bulb for a female co-worker a few years ago on her little Honda CR-V. Picked up a bulb (there were two types for the same model, you had to know which one you needed) and thought I'd just pop it in at lunch one day in the parking lot. Ha. It's a three-handed job for someone with hands the size of a 7 year old girl! 45 minutes, a YouTube video, and a lot of sweating and swearing later, I had it changed.

 

[clintsfolly]

Don’t say that the old way was always better. My 49 Jeepster had the add on oil filter. Without it the manuals say to remove the pan a wipe the sludge out .

 

[caryc]

I was at the nearest Ford dealership in the service department a couple weeks back and they had the cab taken off the frame of a Super Duty pickup to do some kind of work on the engine. ridiculous.

Yes, major engine work on the 6.4L diesels is a cab-off proposition. I think the newer 6.7L is better. Mines the older 6.0L.

I was going to replace a failed headlight bulb for a female co-worker a few years ago on her little Honda CR-V. Picked up a bulb (there were two types for the same model, you had to know which one you needed) and thought I'd just pop it in at lunch one day in the parking lot. Ha. It's a three-handed job for someone with hands the size of a 7 year old girl! 45 minutes, a YouTube video, and a lot of sweating and swearing later, I had it changed.

I still remember the many times my Dad was working on something and he said, "you've got small hands, see if you can do this for me". The good old days. It was always great to help Dad.

 

[Paul B]

My late wife's 98 Explorer just past the 55K mile point and methinks is needs a tune up or something. Gas mileage just took a bit of a downfall and looking under the hood it'll take an act of God to even see the plugs. Wonder what that's gonna cost me? Before my stepson passed from cancer I could go to the dealership and get stuff done with the employees discount but not no more. Tail light lens $250 plus labor. Employees price, $125 plus tax and they put it on for free.

Same thing with my 2015 F150 4x4. Sticker price was $45K plus and I got it for $30,800. Those days are gone I looked under the hood and where in hell are the spark plugs. If they're in there, they're well hidden. The good news is they'll probably outlast me.
Paul B.

 

[Muley Gil]

I remember one of my mechanic buddies telling me about changing the oil on a now long forgotten vehicle. He said when you removed the plug on the oil pan, the oil hit a crossmember and went everywhere. He too hoped to some day meet the guy that designed that lash-up.

 

[exavid]

I think that guy is working for BMW in Germany. I have a 650cc BMW scooter that does just about that same thing during and oil change. It's necessary to make a aluminum foil spout to keep one of the three oil drains from drooling all over the center stand pivots.

 

[Rick Courtright]

I think that guy is working for BMW in Germany. I have a 650cc BMW scooter that does just about that same thing during and oil change. It's necessary to make a aluminum foil spout to keep one of the three oil drains from drooling all over the center stand pivots.

Hi,

For many years I've carried the idea in my head that each new vehicle designed and built in Germany (each new model, each new year) must entail the development of at least three new tools, without which, the job can't be done by mere mortals. By law!

A buddy has had, and/or worked on, quite a variety of motorcycles since the mid-70s. Hondas to Harleys, with Nortons, Triumphs, most of the other big Japanese names and a few others I've forgotten thrown in. A few years ago he retired, then did some consulting work, which enabled him to afford a new BMW, something he'd wanted since college. He came home with an RS1200T, which I gather is the civilian version of the popular police model. It was an addition to a Kawasaki KLR 650 already in the garage, probably one of the most "bubble gum and bailing wire will keep it going" bikes out there today.

Since he'd always done all his own maintenance, he bought "the book" and set about the first of a seemingly interminable series of "simple" routine maintenance jobs. He said he found himself chanting a mantra to himself after about the first hour, of a simple oil change: "Guys, it's ONLY a motorcycle, it's ONLY a motorcycle."

Some things have gotten easier after buying a special tool. Others? Well, we've both got a drop or two of Teutonic blood in us somewhere, which is his lead in to the question, "Have I ever told you why our ancestors lost the last two big wars?" I just chalk it up to the the myth of Teutonic engineering: "If ze rest of ze vurld can do it mit 4 bolts, ve vill use 20. Und if somezing doesn't verk, it's operator error (ALWAYS!") The Japanese probably love this mentality--it oughta sell a lot of THEIR bikes.

Rick C

 

[Mega Twin]

A few years ago,when I was working at a Suzuki motorcycle shop,a man came in on a new BMW,that was having final drive problems,leaking,and making a grinding noise.
The nearest dealer was still 60 miles away,and he wanted to know if we would add some gear oil so he could make it the rest of the way.I looked all over and could not find a drain,or fill plug,so we called the BMW dealer to find out.
He said there isn't one,they are filled at assembly,and you had to replace the entire unit if there was a leak or any other problem.
We loaded it on a trailer,and took it the rest of the way for him.It was fortunate for him that it was under warranty,but what happens after it expires?
BTW,the bike had a little over 1200 miles on it!