chosing a 1911

[Anthony Williams]

Well I might as well throw my hat in with everyone elese's. I suppose a man has a right to spend his money as he sees it. When it comes to 1911's I tend to like mine in plain ol' vanilla. By that I mean as close to stock as possible. That's why this ol' Injun has his sights set on this pistol that Jeff did a review on not too long ago. http://www.gunblast.com/ParaUSA-GIExpert.htm ... :wink:

 

[revhigh]

You know? I never really cared for that trigger, but since that's one of my primary carry guns I've tried to avoid doing any mods to it. It works fine the way it is so I haven't felt any need to change anything.

Here's a shot of my old Colt, with my preferred trigger (long, solid, smooth face):

-- Sam

That's better YS. You're forgiven !

I'd still buy a tube or two of JB Weld ...

REV

 

[Snake45]

I'd still buy a tube or two of JB Weld ...

REV

You'd better buy two, if you intend to accomplish anything. :lol:

Here's another bare-bones, old-school Colt:

And here it is with the kid's Kimber. His is newer, tighter, and shoots better, but I still prefer mine:

 

[Yosemite Sam]

Thank you both. I'll have to carry my P220 for a while until I can get that unmanly trigger changed out of the DW...

Seriously though, I do believe the Dan Wesson guns are really good values. Well, maybe "were". I just took a look online and man have they gone up. Not only that but they seem to have gone "model crazy", and even discontinued my CBOB in favor of an even more expensive model. Geez... Shows you how fast the market changes.

Edit: Apparently, the price jump is due to DW's parent company, CZ, which now thinks all their guns are worth serious money. What used to be a bargain is now more expensive than the competition. $800 for a CZ97BD? GMAFB! For that money I'll buy a Sig, thank you. Don't even get me started about $1200 SP101s...

-- Sam

 

[recoilguy]

Most 1911's are very nice weapons and the price vary greatly. Personally I am a giant fan of the Dan Wesssons. The trigger ....gay...I would not know how to tell. I also like the STI weapons The trojan is one I have shot and like very very much. Looked at a Taurus at the LGS this afternoon. Easy on the wallet and nice looking to. Felt nice in my hand. I have heard the RIA's are nice but have not held one. The spanish 1911's are said to be inferior quality, but again only hear - say. It is a very personal thing it is good to have 1500 to spend. good luck with what ever you end up with.

RCG

 

[revhigh]

Yup, YS, the 1911 market is just crammed with companies trying to sell $700-800 guns for $1800, and Kimber is the main offender (sorry Snake). That's why I always just recommend a good ole Colt Gold Cup for $900 brandy new. It's really all most people will ever need for a target/range gun.

It's a rare 1911 owner who only has one ... so you can have a dedicated target/range gun with an awesome trigger, and a nice rugged carry piece as well.

Springfield runs the inexpensive to very expensive gamut the best. From bottom to top, their offerings are excellent.

REV

 

[revhigh]

His is newer, tighter, and shoots better, but I still prefer mine:

And it too, has a GAY trigger LOL.

It's a nice gun Snake (both are), I like the flat MSH's and the long triggers on all my 45's as well.

REV

 

[Snake45]

And it too, has a GAY trigger LOL.

It's a nice gun Snake (both are), I like the flat MSH's and the long triggers on all my 45's as well.

REV

It ain't mine. If it were, that trigger, hammer, and grip safety would all be hitting the junk-parts box, replaced by more normal parts.

Actually, I might keep that hammer--the trigger pull on that gun is just SO sweet.

Most of my 1911s have flat MSH and long trigger, but I did build up one Colt 1911A1 with arched MSH and short trigger, just so I could get familiar with how they felt (it took a while). This 1966 Commander has its original short trigger but I replaced its arched housing with an old (OOP) Pachmayr semi-arched housing I had laying around, just for giggles.

 

[revhigh]

THe hammer's not bad, but the trigger .... not my cup of tea. The most I can tolerate is the 3 hole triggers, although one of my GC's has one big oval hole in it ...

REV

 

[ADP3]

If you are looking at Kimbers my advice is to go with a Series I. They do not have the firing pin safety. For an all-around gun their Gold Match is everything that you could ask for. The Gold Match gives you about every feature that you could want at a decent price. Collectors Firearms in Houston http://collectorsfirearms.com/ has a NIB Kimber Gold Match .45 ACP caliber 25th Anniversary pistol for $1299. If I didn't have a 1961 Colt Government and two P90's I would be on the phone to them myself. They have had it for a while and may dicker on the price.
Examine new Colt's carefully before you put your money down. They make a hell of a gun but there is often an offset between the frame at the dust cover and the recoil spring tunnel on many of the newly manufactured ones. Check Mr. Kamm's (user name DSK) list of what to watch for on new Colt's at
http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread. ... =Stainless

Hope This Helps.
Best Regards,
ADP3

 

[Yosemite Sam]

Guys, I've got a question on hi-cap 1911s:

I've been looking at the SA hi-cap GI model #PW9701LP, and it looks pretty good. My question is on the frame. I understand the low end SAs (including the regular GI model) are built on forged frames that are made in Brazil. I'm wondering if this is true for the hi-cap frame too.

Thing is, there's also the RIA/Armscor 1911-A2, a hi-cap version of their standard 1911 made in the Philippines. It has a cast frame, but their castings are supposed to be better than Para Ordnance, for instance.

I'm wondering: How many manufacturers of hi-cap frames can there be? If it turns out the SA is built on the same frame as the RIA, would the RIA not be a bad place to start, too? This gun is basically going to be the chassis to start on; Even the SA will end up with a majority of its parts replaced.

Blind brand prejudice would lead me to the SA, but I've heard of some pretty happy RIA customers. With both companies outsourcing production it seems a moot point. I've had good luck with SA service in the past.

The other issue is availability: Nobody has the SAs in stock, and it appears they're out at the distributor level as well, but I held an RIA in my hand today (and it wasn't bad!).

-- Sam

 

[Snake45]

The other issue is availability: Nobody has the SAs in stock, and it appears they're out at the distributor level as well, but I held an RIA in my hand today (and it wasn't bad!).

-- Sam

Then buy the RIA and drive on, says I. :wink:

 

[Yosemite Sam]

More info: I learned that SA has stopped selling their hi-cap in the "Loaded" series, and the only one they still offer is the low end "GI" model. They apparently do have cast frames, as their website specifically mentions "forged" on the other models, but merely "steel" for the frame on the GI hi-cap. Still no idea who makes the hi-cap frames for them. This doesn't give me a lot of confidence in SA's hi-cap frames. OTOH, they do still have a forged slide.

I got one report that says Armscor/RIA uses extruded steel, not cast, in their frames. In any case it's supposed to be a 4140 chrome moly steel, which is pretty good, and their metallurgy is supposed to be better than Para, at least. There's definitely a contingent out there that likes to slag on these as being too low end for consideration, though. Of course, these same types dismiss anything that's not a $3500 Baer/Brown/STI/Wilson, too... I tell you, the 1911 market is right up there among the worst for snobbery among owners.

-- Sam

 

[Snake45]

There's definitely a contingent out there that likes to slag on these as being too low end for consideration, though. Of course, these same types dismiss anything that's not a $3500 Baer/Brown/STI/Wilson, too... I tell you, the 1911 market is right up there among the worst for snobbery among owners.

-- Sam

Sam, you'll like this story:

About 20 years ago when I did Mas Ayoob's LFI-II, I took along a homebuilt LW Commander clone I built on a $55 Fed Ord Ranger frame and a $100 Essex cast slide. Most of the rest of the parts were either from my castoff parts box or common, garden variety, low-end, generic mail order parts--all carefully hand-fitted and polished, of course. I didn't have much more than $200 in the whole gun, if that.

Another guy at the course was there with a brand-new (it had just been returned to him the day before and he hadn't even test-fired it before the class began) Colt that had been put together by one of the top "name" gunsmiths in the bidness. I think he said it cost him $1400 at the time (you could prolly double that and be close in today's prices). Guess whose gun began doubling on the morning of Day One, and guess whose gun (which hadn't even been cleaned for at least 500 rounds of lead-bullet handloads before the class) ran flawlessly for the whole course? :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[tplace]

If you're looking at Kimbers why not take a look at Les Baer? I bought a PREMIER II with the inch and a half option, I absolutely love that gun.

 

[Yosemite Sam]

There's definitely a contingent out there that likes to slag on these as being too low end for consideration, though. Of course, these same types dismiss anything that's not a $3500 Baer/Brown/STI/Wilson, too... I tell you, the 1911 market is right up there among the worst for snobbery among owners.

-- Sam

Sam, you'll like this story:

About 20 years ago when I did Mas Ayoob's LFI-II, I took along a homebuilt LW Commander clone I built on a $55 Fed Ord Ranger frame and a $100 Essex cast slide. Most of the rest of the parts were either from my castoff parts box or common, garden variety, low-end, generic mail order parts--all carefully hand-fitted and polished, of course. I didn't have much more than $200 in the whole gun, if that.

Another guy at the course was there with a brand-new (it had just been returned to him the day before and he hadn't even test-fired it before the class began) Colt that had been put together by one of the top "name" gunsmiths in the bidness. I think he said it cost him $1400 at the time (you could prolly double that and be close in today's prices). Guess whose gun began doubling on the morning of Day One, and guess whose gun (which hadn't even been cleaned for at least 500 rounds of lead-bullet handloads before the class) ran flawlessly for the whole course? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Well, we'll find out soon enough. An Rock Island Armory/Armscor M1911-A2 followed me home today. As soon as I clean all the Cosmoline out of it I'll get to the range an issue a report.

I tell ya, the 1911 market is getting crazier and crazier. It's like all the rich guys in the world decided they needed one of these things, so we've got numerous people out there making $3000-5000 custom guns, with the buyers seriously looking down their noses at anyone who would even discuss anything less. There's (at least) one place making a full custom, from the ground up, for something like $30K. I've run into far less snobbery at the trap range with people shooting $15,000 shotguns.

It's good to see someone offering affordable guns. Now I just hope it holds up, and they stick around.

-- Sam

 

[revhigh]

PICS !!!!!!!!!

REV

 

[Cheesewhiz]

It's good to see someone offering affordable guns. Now I just hope it holds up, and they stick around.

Sam,
as you know, Springfield Armory makes lower priced and somewhat higher end guns and it is nearly impossible to get one of the lower end guns right now but it really isn't that easy to get one of their high end guns either.

I see a lot of Colts and Kimbers at the shops around here but that's about all I see in any quanity.

I've had a SA Mil-Spec (lower end) on order for about 'ever and still no word on a due date.

 

[Yosemite Sam]

It's good to see someone offering affordable guns. Now I just hope it holds up, and they stick around.

Sam,
as you know, Springfield Armory makes lower priced and somewhat higher end guns and it is nearly impossible to get one of the lower end guns right now but it really isn't that easy to get one of their high end guns either.

I see a lot of Colts and Kimbers at the shops around here but that's about all I see in any quanity.

I've had a SA Mil-Spec (lower end) on order for about 'ever and still no word on a due date.

When I couldn't find a hi-cap Springfield around to save my life (except for the guy on GB who's been trying to get MSRP for his since Oct -- assuming he actually has one, that is...) I sent their sales dept an email and asked. I was quoted 6-9 months on the GI hi-cap.

This "staged" production of guns is driving me nuts. In the last year I've looked for several pieces that were just simply unavailable. I canceled an order for a Sig Elite P228 after waiting for 6+ weeks. New Buckmarks weren't available for the longest time, over a year for some models. It's crazy making. Especially when you have no patience, like me...

In my case the only thing the Springfield had over the Armscor was a forged slide and the name on the side. The SA's frame is cast (as are all the PW series guns), they stopped making the "Loaded" hi-cap with the forged frame (it tended to crack), and I wasn't about to wait or pay MSRP.

Oh, there are those that say the Armscor is too cheap, that master smiths won't work on them (the same "master smiths" who refuse to work on Taurus, Uberti, or pick-your-favorite, but no one can actually name them), or whatever, but we'll see. It'll be a learning experience.

I already ordered a couple of extra mags. Pictures later. Woo-hoo!

-- Sam

 

[Snake45]

I tell ya, the 1911 market is getting crazier and crazier. It's like all the rich guys in the world decided they needed one of these things, so we've got numerous people out there making $3000-5000 custom guns, with the buyers seriously looking down their noses at anyone who would even discuss anything less.

-- Sam

Yeah, and I run into those guys at my club two or three times a year. And I can almost always outshoot them with whatever junk I happen to have brought that day. I say "almost always" because one of them might have outshot me once, but if it happened, I honestly can't recall it.