UAW Strike

[Captain America]

From a dealership perspective, after one week, this strike seems to be ill timed at best. The parts warehouse is running with management and non-union staff, and the trucking company isn't honoring the strike so our parts deliveries have not been affected at all, also it's September which is by far the slowest time for auto sales(Spring is by far the busiest) so sales hasn't been affected. With the amount of cars sitting in port and car sales lagging for the last two months it looks like availability will not be an issue for a while. It'll be interesting to see how this plays out in the long run.

 

[dannyd]

I have a friend on strike in St. Louis, this looks more like the manufacture's saving money on payroll instead of anything that's going to benefit the workers in the run.

Here in Florida car lots are full for the most part because most people can't afford a 90,000 vehicle

 

[hittman]

And someone told me workers are demanding a pay increase to $130 an HOUR. Surely that can’t be correct, right?

 

[Jeepnik]

Let’s face it, with the availability of imports should one want/need a new vehicle the UAW strike won’t have any meaningful impact.
As to current availability of parts and vehicles you won’t see any impact until the supply chain starts to run dry.
What the strike may do is push more folks out of American made vehicles and into imports. Which in the long run weakens the UAW,s bargaining position.
I’ve watched two industries basically die because workers demanded more than businesses could afford at a time when foreign competition was on the upswing.
Remember when foreign cars were a distinct minority? And some a rarity. Look around today. If the tide hasn’t completely shifted the strike, if it last very long, will hasten it.

Now before anyone accuses me of being anti union, I’m currently drawing a, albeit small, union pension. Unions have a place. They’ve made significant improvements in safety and compensation. But they simply don’t have the bargaining strength they once had.

Heck, take a look at the entertainment industry right now. You may not like Hollywood, but it’s an example of the loss of union impact on an industry.

 

[dannyd]

And someone told me workers are demanding a pay increase to $130 an HOUR. Surely that can’t be correct, right?

That maybe with wages and benefits.

Teamsters driving Shell tanker trucks in and around St. Louis made 35.00 dollars an hour in wages and benefits in 1978, that would be 164.00 dollars an hour today.

So, one never knows.

 

[Colonialgirl]

I was in a management position (Quality Control Lab Mgr) for a paint company when a union convinced the employees to demand a vote on going union. Sad to say they voted for the union. It wasn't until later that several employees discovered that thanks to the pay scale the union negotiated they would be ineligible for a raise for about 3 years because their current pay was above the union scale.

 

[87flht]

I think unions did some good in the past but I don’t see a need for them anymore , not in fields I’m familiar with

 

[hittman]

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/...m-scott-for-suggesting-auto-workers-be-fired/

 

[contender]

Here in NC,, it's a "Right to work" state, and only some industries are union.

I'm fully aware & appreciative of the early years of unions where they pushed for safer workplaces, and child labor laws etc.
But in recent decades,, after all that was made into laws etc,, it seems to me, IN MY OPINION,, that their demands often do nothing but increase the cost of goods & services, as well as often degrading the workplace.
In the few times I've been directly exposed to a place that was unionized,, I was shocked at the attitude by workers. The common phrase I heard more than once was; "That's not in my job description. Besides, if I did ,,,,,,,,,,, it would take away work for somebody else." The first time I heard that was when a worker, at a machine,, dropped a piece of trash. He refused to pick it up, using this excuse.
Another time,, I did a contract job, and when I was done, a guy who knew me, quietly asked me about my fees. When I told him, he said; "You are way too low. You need to add $$$ to your bill. This is a Union place & they expect to pay big bucks." (That place finally closed it's doors in June, and put 900 people out of work.)
Also, in recent time, a local hospital was bought out by a different company. Soon after,, the staff pushed for a vote to unionize. It passed. Ever since,, the quality of care has greatly diminished and is getting noticed by various State agencies. Yet,, the staff insists upon more, more, and more,, saying they aren't being treated fairly.

A company is in the business to make a profit. Often, they also have to answer to stockholders. If you can't turn a profit, AND offer dividends to stockholders,, a business will fold.
As noted above,, with the "Big 3" striking,, AND the huge amount of imported vehicles,, the workers demands may be the death of much of the auto industry. It's my understanding that the UAW wants a 40% increase in wages over 4 years, a reduction of the work week to 32 hours, increased pension plans, as their top demands.

We all know a lot of people work in jobs where they are already overpaid due to their lack of skills, or abilities. Heck, Miss Penny has a few folks in the company that she works for,, making a LOT of money, (non-union) yet can't write a simple report in a coherent manner. Or, they just refuse to actually do their job correctly. Her boss just fired one guy who was making almost $85,000.00 annually. He was one of (2) managers that was doing the (2) things I just listed. he was caught lying to his boss, and she fired him. She has another guy, who's a "protected" guy by a higher-up, who has royally screwed up a LOT of the safety stuff he was SUPPOSED to do. Yet, instead of letting him get fired, (the records prove he's not doing his job,) his "protector" had him moved to a different position. It's his 5th position within the company. And he makes over $90,000.00 annually.
But this company give an annual pay increase of 3%-5% to all employees as a way of adjusting to inflation. Plus,, they get an annual bonus,, IF,, IF,, the company meets certain goals. No union is necessary and this company actually pays fairly well. If it went union, I can see all kinds of issues, ESPECIALLY if the attitude is; "Not my job" were to prevail.

But the UAW strike,, I heard on the news, they get a $500 "strike pay" weekly. That's $26,000.00 annually. While it's not a lot,, I know a LOT of people who'd ENJOY making that money to "do nothing" but walk around & complain.

I'm not anti-union, but I am more "pro-business" due to the things I've experienced. Must be why I own my own business, and refuse to add too many employees. I make my rules, I make my wage scale, and if I do a good job, I make a profit. It's worked like that for centuries for many small businesses. A big business is just wanting to do the same thing.

I've often spoken with a few of my relatives, (one who retired from GM, and was union,) and several friends about HOW an employee could make more money, and NOT have to pay a union to "represent your interests." It's simple.
Work hard, buy stock, and you are investing in yourself. You'll get the dividends, AND have a say-so in the company at annual stockholder meetings. Plus,, hard work, will get noticed and rewarded by the companies.

We already see the cost of new vehicles being absurd & over-priced. If the UAW gets half of what they seek, they will be pushing more people AWAY from the "Big 3" to foreign makers products.

 

[volshooter]

I'm not ain't anti-union but my experiences with them have been negative. Was a union member twice. Even went through a strike once. For them it's all about getting as much money from the company as possible, regardless of the the company's ability to stay profitable or fair wages.
I wonder if the union is willing to give up wages when the company is losing money as quick as they jump on the company is making money. Or better yet when the company gets government bail outs.
In this case they have a few legit issues. I feel like the democratic supporting unions are flexing their power under a corrupt incompetent administration.

 

[cowboycopus]

Here is my conspiracy theory.

Unions love Democrats and whoever is pulling the strings in the White House. BHO
If they put this on as a "show" and Brandon goes to Detroit or wherever UAW is,
and puts on his little show to bring them together and end the strike he becomes a hero,
right before election year.

Lets go Brandon.

 

[Captain America]

And someone told me workers are demanding a pay increase to $130 an HOUR. Surely that can’t be correct, right?

That's correct, plus they want to be paid for 40 hours and work 32, if you think cars are expensive now just wait until this strike is over. My guess is they'll get most of what they want and then over the next couple of years their jobs will be outsourced or replaced by robotics.

 

[vito]

Growing up in a union household, one of the most sacred rules was "Never, ever cross a picket line". My life's experiences over the last 70 years or so has made me less and less a supporter of unions. My many years in management probably plays a role in my attitude. I own three cars right now: two made in America (a Dodge and a Subaru) an one made in the Netherlands (a Mini). My guess is that my future cars will be made outside of this country due to cost.

 

[gjgalligan]

A company is in the business to make a profit.

True. But do they have the right to trample people in order to do that?
Look back at the so-called bankruptcy, I say so-called because many thought they were not really broke, including Ric Wagner the then CEO who was soon forced out for saying that.
Thousands of stock holders lost thousand of dollars of stock, including me. I had 40 yrs of seniority at GM with several thousand dollars of GM stock in my 401k.
At that time the UAW works already had a good pension plan, COLA, and good pay. Since I retired in 2012 I haven't kept up on details but things went down hill badly for auto workers. Hardly any pay increases, cuts in the pension plan, loss of COLA, ect.
But yet the execs are doing pretty good. I see a figure of $26,000,000.00 of pay for Mary Barra The current CEO. Why so much? She doesn't "own" the company, she is still JUST an employee like the workers.
As the outlandish requests of raises and benefits the UAW is planing catch up for a dozen years of falling behind.
And explain this to me: all the contract workers that may be doing the same jobs as the UAW members but getting paid less. Isn't there a Federal that says equal pay fo equal work?

MOST complainers about the UAW have no real clue of the facts.

As to some comments that unions are not needed anymore: many cities use to be considered to be "safe" to live in so some thought we could defund the police.
How is that working out?

 

[hittman]

History repeating itself. I’d say UAW are slow learners but ….. there’s apparently so much money to be made by union bosses and their mafia partners, it will continue.

In the early 1980s here in my small town, Electric Wheel a division of Firestone, employed almost 2000 people. Interest rates were in the 20% range and plant closings were quite normal. Heck, we’d lost Motorola just a couple years earlier. Local union boss proclaimed a strike was on the way. Firestone replied that their best offer was on the table and if not accepted, they’d close the plant immediately. The union called Firestone’s bluff and found out within 24 hours that Firestone wasn’t playing. Firestone’s people showed up the next day with log chains and padlock. It was over.

Enter a Canadian company then called Can-Am. Now known as Titan Wheel they opened it back up in a couple years and flourish here.

So a big shout out to UAW and all the union enablers. Thanks for shipping more of what used to be the great American manufacturing / industrial complex out of the country to foreign interests.

Yes, unions need to be stomped out of existence. Their place was sorely needed before all the employment laws but not now, not for DECADES. They’re nothing more than a Ponzi-like scheme for those in control.

https://www.titan-intl.com/about

 

[Johnnu2]

Here's a sad, but very true story. Back in the mid-1960's, a relative of mine was a union shop steward; I should add that his personality left a LOT to be desired, and, he was by nature, an extremely aggressive person. I remember him complaining about management asking him to sweep-out a storage room and, of course he refused and made a big deal of it because this was clearly not his job as a skilled XYZ professional. Also, this was his normal way of interpersonal communications with mgmt. He told me that one of the newbies (let's call him Tom) volunteered to do the clean-up; my relative called him many derogatory expletives. Fast forward about 30+ years. My relative was on his way to visit his old friend Tom at his waterfront mansion on the "gold-coast" of Long Island, NY. It appears that Tom had been promoted several times over the 30 years at that very same company and was now a VP and a multi-millionaire. My relative? Well, he had been long fired from that company and had spent the next decades working menial jobs (several at a time) to survive. His car was a beat-up wreck, but he still had his equally old motorcycle that, at his age, he shouldn't have been riding. When I asked him if Tom, was the same "Tom" who had swept out the storage room, he replied "yes". So, I asked him if, knowing how Tom had succeeded (in comparison to how he had not), did he still feel that he had made the right decisions regarding sweeping out the storage room (and other 'storage rooms') of his life...(?) His reply: ABSOLUTELY, Tom was a p!@##y.
Granted, the union was not at fault in this story, but interpersonal relationships between employees and management can be a key to success. I've been told that some unions, by nature, don't allow these key relationships; this is sad if true.
J.

 

[gnappi]

I heard on the news that they want a ~30% pay increase and a four day work week and I read that Maximum average hourly wages are $31.77 at Stellantis, $32 at Ford and $32.32 at GM on NBC news.

With my retiring from a 67 Billion a year corporation as a worker bee, here's my honest perspective on the union and their "share the money" argument... and it's different for non-profit and for profit corporations.

Yes, For profit executives ARE paid a lot more (sometimes obscenely so) than the worker bee, BUT their decisions affect short term and long term profitability and sustainability. If they do poorly, the corporate profits, stocks, and stock holders are affected, AND executives can be removed.

Not for profit corporations only generate revenue by grants or contribution drives. The employees are generally paid very poorly while executive compensation is very high with little risk to the entity as there are few major decisions concerning the entity.

From my experience, my company tied salary increases and bonuses (if any) to yearly profit of the company and we did not have any unions to protect our jobs, or salaries. We were treated fairly and few resented the executive compensation. We had a fair retirement benefit with 401K and the remaining benefit package (health, vacation, sick time / PTO) was also fair. We never had a strike, nor sick out or work slowdown.

Now I gotta say that $30+ an hour for mostly unskilled workers (with some seniority) without degrees is pretty fair and adding on medical benefits etc is pretty darn good. I may be wrong but I can't see good in the long run coming out of this strike.

 

[gjgalligan]

Here is a little talked about fact, EPA regulations had as much to do, maybe more, with work leaving America then workers wages.
I was at the GM Tech center for the last 20 some years of my career and heard it time & time again, it would cost too much to produce many products in the US due to the EPA.

 

[gjgalligan]

Yes, For profit executives ARE paid a lot more (sometimes obscenely so) than the worker bee, BUT their decisions affect short term and long term profitability and sustainability. If they do poorly, the corporate profits, stocks, and stock holders are affected, AND executives can be removed.

It takes a lot for an exec to get pushed out. They are all board members (BD) on other corporations whose execs are on each other BDs. They are very reluctant to fire each other.
Even when they make a bad decision they often still get their bonus.

Talk about "a good ole boy (&girls now) club"!

I know not everybody could be an executive of big corps.
For every exec out there there other people as good to fill those positions. Nobody is irreplaceable. Sometimes a person "shines" at job by luck over talent.

Many are just over paid EMPLOYEES.

 

[Jack Ryan]

And someone told me workers are demanding a pay increase to $130 an HOUR. Surely that can’t be correct, right?

If must be a fact then if someone told you that.

 

[hittman]

See Post #12.

 

[BearBiologist]

If must be a fact then if someone told you that.

I think he was searching to find out if that was true or not. He wasn't presenting a fact!

I have never worked in a union industry. I've always been able to negotiate better salaries and opportunities/positions on my skills and knowledge (until I pissed off a Federal supervisor but I actually enjoyed where I was, except for her!).

I just remember eating lean when my dad (a Teamster) would go on strike or would be out of work to honor somebody else's strike.

 

[ProfessorWes]

I read somewhere that the girlbosses currently running GM thought the current awful economic climate was a great time to increase pay in the corporate boardroom by something like 40%.

And UAW thinks the current awful economic climate is a great time to demand a pay increase and strike their employers.

And the Democrats think this is a great time to force the auto industry to transition to even more unaffordable electric vehicles, when consumers can't afford to buy the existing gas-powered models and the grid can't handle the existing power load. Which insane regulations, among others, help explain why the current economic climate is so awful.

It's like they're all conspiring to cut the domestic automakers' collective throat, and further depress an already-struggling national economy. There aren't really any good guys here, although I feel sorry for all the blue-collar autoworkers who are going to be unemployed in the coming years once everybody involved in this farce gets their way. But the boardroom execs, the union bosses, and the lefty pols they both pander to and support, will get paid regardless.

 

[Ray Newman]

Another take on the UAW strike: future of EV and jobs --

https://dnyuz.com/2023/09/16/battle-over-electric-vehicles-is-central-to-auto-strike/

 

[wheelgun1958]

Is the auto industry under the RLA or FLSA?

 

[Jeepnik]

Over my working lifetime I regularly heard folks complain about their jobs/pay/benefits.Ihave always quoted my father at such times. "They outlawed slavery in 1863. No one forces you to work at any job. Quit and find another that makes you happy".

If the UAW workers aren't happy with their current pay and benefits, I suggest they find other jobs. I'm pretty sure there are some folks making much less than $30 an hours that would love to learn how to do your job.

 

[hittman]

Ronald Reagan was right.

 

[GasGuzzler]

Don't get me started on unions...and just because an exec makes too much doesn't mean the UAW workers with their very simple and well-paid jobs need more.

Funny how we're already seeing the affects, especially after the escalation Friday. We have a lot of vehicles in production at the nearby Arlington plant we may not see for months. Transport drivers will not cross picket lines to deliver cars even though they are not involved in the strike. Parts were already hard to get with about 80% availability. And parts is where the rats on strike are going to hit the biggest blow. Weird how the OP isn't seeing affects already.

We're a small family owned store in a town of 15K and we sell half a dozen $90K vehicles a week.

 

[eveled]

In a world that pays $15 to flip burgers, skilled trades deserve to be making more than $30 an hour.

Keep in mind they always ask for a lot more than they actually expect to get.

 

[GasGuzzler]

Thinking pay is relative is the issue with all the union choked industries. UAW workers do not carry out a skilled trade any more than a burger flipper does. Who here has toured a UAW assembly plant? I have and had to listen to the floor boss at the now defunct OKC plant run his head.