Handguns in the $3,000 dollar range

[Kevin]

I was in a gun store yesterday, and it didn’t really even hit me until today, but they had a nice selection of guns in the $2,000 and $3,000 dollar range. One AR15 was almost $3,500 if I remember correctly, marked down from around 4 large. I wasn’t looking for a particular gun, that’s why I just now considered their prices.

What gives? Have gun prices gone up that much? But a better question, are they worth it? I don’t think these were custom guns, just the expensive brands. Wilson, NightHawk. I think STI was there, it was one of those funny looking “race guns.”

I know there is inflation, and guns will continue to increase in price. But say after a year, and several thousand rounds down range, will those $3,000 dollar guns still be worth it, compared to an $800 Ruger?

 

[Rook]

I would stay away from that store. They're living in a dream world...AR-15 for $3,500 :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[GunnyGene]

LSA makes those hi-dollar AR's also. Here's a glowing report about them, and how they are made.

https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2019/12/12/lone-star-armory/

 

[bogus bill]

If they were worth it, seems to me the store owner would keep em. Like those ad`s trying to sell gold and silver.

 

[RoninPA]

For AR's, check JP Enterprises, their AR's start at a pretty penny and go up from there. One of my Chinese nationals (going to Penn State) bought one as his FIRST EVER firearm (I had to do a lot of teaching with him) and it was $2500 and it's not the most tricked out/expensive. It did npt even have optics on it (he was going to by an EOTech for me to put on for him).

 

[Kevin]

This particular AR15 was a Daniel Defense. It did come with a fitted case and a matching knife. I didn't ask to hold it, but it was looked really fancy. It was a blu-ish color, not black, SOCOM Blue perhaps? I'm not caught up on different cerakote colors.

 

[Kevin]

But if you closed your eyes and held two empty 1911's, could you tell the multi-thousand dollar variety from a gun costing only 800-900?

 

[Johnnu2]

Well, Kevin, we are in the world of "who's the biggest gorilla in the jungle"; and I suppose that those prices are for those larger gorillas. In my humble opinion, a firearm could be so finely made (remember the hand-made double shotguns from England) that, with labor and materials these days, a big $$$ value could be justified. Again, in my humble opinion, but a rifle that is made of sheet metal, plastic and paint should stay in the $600 range. Custom 1911's ?.... I certainly cannot tell a custom, from my Springfield Armory Range Officer; but then, I don't own a Porche or Ferrari so I guess I can't comment on the finer things in life. This should turn into a heck of a thread in a short period of time ))).
IMHO of course,
J.

 

[Pat-inCO]

IMO . . . . . . It is much like the price of cars. You can get a really nice one that is
comfortable, quiet, good fuel economy, starting at $25K. You can also get several
different manufacturer models that start at almost $100K. Are the ones at four times
the price actually worth four times the money? Sure as heck not to me.

Guns are much the same. There is the "one-ups-man-ship" or LOOK HOW MUCH I
SPENT FOR MY SUPER-WHIZ-BANG WHAT HAVE YOU! a.k.a. BRAGGING!

Similar to houses. Is a one point something million dollar house (really) worth several
times what a less expensive one is? Only if you feel the need to brag (about your
lack of intelligence).

 

[Mike J]

This thread has reminded me of a thread I read on another forum about the point of diminishing returns. What was postulated there was that up to a certain point you can perceive a significant difference in quality for the amount of money you spend. Once you pass that point you still get greater quality than you do at a lower price point but the differences are not as significant for the amount of money spent as they are at a lower price point. As an example that thread was about 1911 style pistols. The general consensus there was that the Dan Wesson line was pretty much the point of diminishing returns. The posters there seemed to believe that you could get nicer 1911's than them but you got less value for dollars spent once you went past that point. Of course the question is how much is that difference in quality worth to you?

 

[RSIno1]

I would stay away from that store. They're living in a dream world...AR-15 for $3,500 :lol: :lol: :lol:

It's all about personal ego. Otherwise how would Ferrari stay in business? A Ford Mustang has more performance than you can use on an American highway at a fraction of the cost. You could get 5 of the elusive $60,000 mid engined Vettes for less than a Ferrari Lusso Shooting Brake (their cheapest). ARs can be had sub $500 all day long. It Trump's fault. With seizure and AW ban off the radar prices have dropped. Watch Nov 2024 if a Dem gets elected demand and prices will take a big jump.

 

[bogus bill]

I was sixteen in 1957 when I started driving (legally). Back then you could get a fairly dependable car for $45 to $65. I did. Now that`s a tank of gas! In today's money that would be $400 to $600`s. Some of those jalopy's I had would bring plenty today if I had stored them in a barn. It is a lot easier to store a gun. The vehicles would need a lot of rubber seals and upholstery replaced though under the best of conditions. As time go`s on the younger generations are into new, not the old stuff that turned on us old guys. Witness the plastic fantastic hi cap autos. Kids now like old Honda car`s with loud pipes on those 4 bangers. I think I am in a normal takeoff from a light in my 20 year old truck and they sound like they are doing 200 mph trying to get pass me at maybe + 5 mph more. Ya see nothing but knuckles and eyeballs. My most expensive revolver is a 2 1/2" nickle python that would bring a easy $3,000 plus. I bought it for half price new on some sale in 1970 for $165`s! I doubt that or similar is possible in the years coming up.

 

[Rook]

It's all about personal ego. Otherwise how would Ferrari stay in business?

I think you are exactly right.

My Windham AR-15 that I bought at Walmart for $350 bucks when they were going out of the black gun business will do everything I need. I added an old el cheapo Windfield scope that I had laying around and an old laser with a push button on the forearm that I used to have on a Desert Eagle that works just fine.

At 100 yards my 70 year old eyes can put every bullet in an 8" circle which is smaller than a man's head. I doubt I could do any better no matter how much I spent on a gun.

 

[Mike J]

But if you closed your eyes and held two empty 1911's, could you tell the multi-thousand dollar variety from a gun costing only 800-900?

Not by simply holding them with your eyes closed you couldn't. My only 1911 is my SR 1911. It works fine & always has other than needing an extractor adjustment when it was new (simple enough for me to do after reading a brief online tutorial). There are other things that matter to those 1911 enthusiast. Many of them don't want a pistol with MIM small parts. They want all parts to be forged. They don't want a cast frame-they want a forged frame. They also set a lot of store in guns being hand fitted instead of parts being just pulled out of a bin & installed. How tight the gun is fit is a big deal to them. And on and on. Not all differences can be perceived just by looking. Not saying I would spend 3500 dollars on a 1911 but if I had the spare change I might be tempted to pick up a Dan Wesson (they can be found between $1000-$2000).

 

[TRanger]

Unless it was once owned by John Wayne or Elvis Presley, there isn’t an AR15 on this planet worth $3000. Most aren’t worth $300. We have a local store that carries such high dollar merchandise. I get a chuckle out of it. Same with the four-figure 1911s. I’ve tried all the top dollar brands; Nighthawk, Wilson, Brown, and Baer. The best 1911 made is a Les Baer, which generally costs less than the others. Most people can’t shoot well enough to tell a difference and are just as well served by a mass produced model.

 

[Valmet]

Unless it's an unfired 1964 Colt SP-1, no AR-15 is worth $3500 IMO.

 

[Kevin]

Very interesting perspectives! Thanks.

There is another gun store up in Frisco. (The high rent district of Dallas) maybe I’ll go up there and see the average price on their guns. I haven’t been there for a couple years now.

 

[tunnug]

This pretty much goes for everything, it's only worth what someone is willing to pay for it, you can put any price on it but will someone buy it, that's the question everyone is betting on.

 

[Ale-8(1)]

. . . it's only worth what someone is willing to pay for it . . .

This ^^^ is the bottom line.

:wink:

 

[GunnyGene]

This is a humorous thread.

Yes, there are rifles and handguns that are steep in price. People used to say about the makers of such high end guns "they are really proud of these, aren't they?"

Yet, how many here have fired, let's say, any of Les Baer's 1911s, and not been forced to admit that they were firing a superior handgun. Come on, you guys. How many of you have EVER heard of the front sights falling off a Les Baer, as so many buyers of Ruger's 1911 experienced?

Yes, there are sometimes unrealistic prices attached to higher end rifles and handguns. But the overwhelming majority of these weapons are superior weapons. That's all there is to it.

While we're at it ... those who have caught the long range rifle bug (let's call this 500 yard targets and greater) ... you are seeing something big happening right now. Outfits like Ruger and Savage (to name just two) are opening the door to less expensive longer range shooting right now. The more makers who see this as a market worth pursuing, the better it is for all of us.

Competition is good! First it brought us rifles capable of even reaching out to these distances in a repeatable manner. Then the prices came down a bit. And now we're seeing smoother bolt operation in some of these more affordable weapons. The desire on the part of the bigger makers like Ruger to at least TRY to bring their customers what high end rifle owners enjoy benefits us all.

Funny, I haven't heard anyone mention the truly ridiculous prices found on a great many FUDD guns. You all know what I am talking about: $10 K, $20 K, and up for fancy wood on O/U shotguns for the elbow patches crowd. Want to see some real snobs? Well, there you go. Yet every one of them will tell you their overpriced shotgun was most certainly worth it.

Seems it's all in the eye of the beholder. - DixieBoy

You mean like the Purdy guns? (if you have to ask you can't afford it) :wink:

https://www.purdey.com/#section-0

 

[LDM]

My LGS has a couple of Korths in a glass case on the counter. They are impressive chunks of steel.

 

[vito]

The real question is: why do you buy guns? If you are buying them for their functional value, and you are not seeking to compete at the highest levels of marksmanship competition, than you quickly reach a point where more money does not really bring you more gun. If you are a collector, or someone that just enjoys owning the best, then you are in a different element than someone like me. I am fairly sure that I own very few guns compared to the average RugerForum participant. For years I owned a single handgun for home defense, and for years relied up a $300 S&W 357mag revolver, and later a $300 Ruger P97. When I could carry concealed legally, I added a few small guns that I was comfortable with. And I also bought a Mark IV and another 22 for inexpensive paper target shooting. I don't hunt, but I added a Mossberg 500 with a short barrel for home defense and if and when the SHTF. I think the most I have ever paid for a gun is about $700 and that was for a beautiful looking, but not beautifully working Kimber 45acp, which I later got rid of. So for me, even if I hit the lottery, I am sure I would never be spending thousands for a gun when I can get one for any conceivable need or want that I might develop for no more than several hundred dollars. Just my two cents.

 

[bobski]

my slant grip victors will pull 5,000 ea when I list them soon. less than 500 made and were the cream of the crop of the famous Hamden 22's. same hole 25yds all day. not bad for 45 year old guns.
rule of thumb is you pay for a gun to achieve a goal. during a match isn't the time to learn your gun wasn't worth the money you spent on it.
people buy expensive guns based on track records and word of mouth.
all one needs to say is (obermyer) when it comes to M1A's, and people break open the wallet w/o hesitation.
I lived and shot at this level of precision and cost was a moot point. today? not as much.
and unfortunately, most people I engage in about guns on the net are clueless to value and perfection, and for the most part are bargain shoppers for everything.
thus, its been a hard row to plow selling my guns.

everyone wants the best, but wont pay for it, or are waiting to steal it so they can brag and boast about it. :?

I have no desire watching and reading about people who buy less quality guns just to spend countless cash to make them better, when all they had to do was buy a gun costing more with all the extras on it from the factory already.

hacks in my opinion....and I lost interest sharing my knowledge due to it.
its one thing to have a hobby, but to reject answers and known knowledge and do what will just end up failing? I saw it all the time. im over that.

 

[Paul B]

This is a humorous thread.

Yes, there are rifles and handguns that are steep in price. People used to say about the makers of such high end guns "they are really proud of these, aren't they?"

Yet, how many here have fired, let's say, any of Les Baer's 1911s, and not been forced to admit that they were firing a superior handgun. Come on, you guys. How many of you have EVER heard of the front sights falling off a Les Baer, as so many buyers of Ruger's 1911 experienced?

Yes, there are sometimes unrealistic prices attached to higher end rifles and handguns. But the overwhelming majority of these weapons are superior weapons. That's all there is to it.

While we're at it ... those who have caught the long range rifle bug (let's call this 500 yard targets and greater) ... you are seeing something big happening right now. Outfits like Ruger and Savage (to name just two) are opening the door to less expensive longer range shooting right now. The more makers who see this as a market worth pursuing, the better it is for all of us.

Competition is good! First it brought us rifles capable of even reaching out to these distances in a repeatable manner. Then the prices came down a bit. And now we're seeing smoother bolt operation in some of these more affordable weapons. The desire on the part of the bigger makers like Ruger to at least TRY to bring their customers what high end rifle owners enjoy benefits us all.

Funny, I haven't heard anyone mention the truly ridiculous prices found on a great many FUDD guns. You all know what I am talking about: $10 K, $20 K, and up for fancy wood on O/U shotguns for the elbow patches crowd. Want to see some real snobs? Well, there you go. Yet every one of them will tell you their overpriced shotgun was most certainly worth it.

Seems it's all in the eye of the beholder. - DixieBoy

You mean like the Purdy guns? (if you have to ask you can't afford it) :wink:

https://www.purdey.com/#section-0

I was privileged to hunt with a Purdy side by side a long time time back. Around 1982 as I recall. My dad's girl friend worked for a lawyer and I went to pick her up because her car was in the shop. She introduced my to her boss and told him I liked to hunt. He owns a ranch in the Sacramento Valley and breeds quail and pheasants and sets them out to hunt. Due to that policy there are quite a few coveys of quail on the spread and plenty of pheasants too. I showed up for the weekend with my old M97 Winchester pump gun and he told me that would never do. I said it was the only shotgun I owned. He had a literally wall to wall room filled with expensive shotgun, Boss, Purdy, H&H and some I've never heard of. He looks over the guns and hands my the sweetest 20 gauge side by side shotgun I'd ever seen. It was a Purdy. Bore IC and modified. Talk about feeling spoiled. I'm not all that much of a shotgun shooter but that gun just seemed to point as if radar controlled and it did a number on some very fine eating quail and a couple of pheasants to boot. It literally broke my heart to have to give it back to him when that weekend came to an end. I really wanted to ask what it cost but my better judgement told I'b best not do that.
I did come into a fine shotgun years later at a gun show. A Ithaca 20 gauge over and under IC/ Modified. Funny thing in all the years I've owned that gun I've never shot it once. Not once. Pretty wood, nice engraving and the receiver is silver plated. We have quail here but they're ground runners and it take a darned good dog to get them to flush. I couldn't afford the darn good dog so the gun stays in the back of the safe.
Paul B.

 

[Rick Courtright]

At 100 yards my 70 year old eyes can put every bullet in an 8" circle which is smaller than a man's head. I doubt I could do any better no matter how much I spent on a gun.

Hi,

Rook, nice shooting! And there are lots of trigger fingers associated with 20-something year old eyes that can't do any better.

I saw a comment on a photography forum recently, that said essentially "there has never been a photographer who's as good as his camera." I think we hear the same thing being said in the gun world when someone tells us "this gun will out shoot me" or variants of the same idea.

So there's probably no need for most of us to buy guns priced beyond a certain range for most of our own uses.

However... there's some kind of a desire inherent in the human race to have something that's "exclusively ours" and that's where a lot of the truly high dollar guns fit in. A guy has the money, and the desire, to buy something nobody else has, and he's the guy that market caters to. I could spend the rest of my life hanging out in Purdy's, Holland & Holland's, and the variety of other bespoke English gun makers' show rooms admiring the beautiful work, and art, involved with the guns adorning their walls. Yet I probably don't have a credit line high enough to afford a cup of tea in one of those shops. Someone else walks in, lays down the cash to order a gun to be built for him, and is prepared to wait the several years it will probably take to get it made. Good on him!

When that gun is ready, it will be his and his alone. And if he shows up at my range to shoot it, all eyes will be on the gun, as others, like me, admire it. Nothing wrong with that! And, chances are he's NOT the snob another poster mentions, and he'll hand it to someone who could never afford it and say "Here, try this!" I've been privileged to shoot a couple such guns that way. As Paul B has described, it's truly an experience!

Rick C

 

[NH Rugerman]

How does Ferrari stay in. business??? Drive one and you will never ask that question again....and you know of any Ferrari that has DECREASED in value????

 

[Daveboone]

I guess I have to compare the black rifles to bolt actions....
At one time, you could easily find a good bolt gun for a few hundred dollars, and further down the rack an upper end Browning/ whatever, for 3g easy.
Now the black rifles are popular...pricing works the same way. I sure as hell wont know the diff in a 500 dollar AR compared to a 3-4 g AR, but I guess there are plenty who can.

 

[contender]

Lots of interesting & fun comments here.

Comparisons with other expensive items is fun to consider,, and even valid to a point.

But having had the privilege to handle, & shoot many expensive handguns I can say I concur with a few posters above. First,, you get what you pay for,, and a lot depends upon what the use is for the firearm,, AND the abilities of the shooters.
A hand built,, quality firearm is not released until the manufacturer knows it's "right." Just look at Freedom Arms. The same goes for many of the current crop of custom to semi-custom semi-autos out there. I once had my Springfield 1911 .45 break during a USPSA match. A RO,, offered me his spare 1911 to shoot the match with. It was a Les Baer. WOW. While his grip was different than mine,, I found myself enjoying shooting it,, AND it was a more accurate & comfortable handgun to shoot.
In todays world,, there are many different reasons guns are built & cost more than similar ones of the same model.
As noted,, MIM vs. forged vs. milled parts. Mass produced, vs. hand built. And we all know that d people who can hand build quality handguns are working there because of their knowledge & abilities. And it costs money to pay these folks,, so the expenses go up for the manufacturer. Prices reflect these qualities.
That's not to say that a mass produced firearm can not be accurate or good.

BUT,, let's look at something I see here all the time. Complaints about a Ruger coming from the factory needing XYZ repairs or not up to the purchasers expectations. (The same is true for S&W & others.) I hear the comment,, and have made it myself; "If you want a high quality firearm,, buy a FA."
Often,, it's a trade off between affordable serviceable firearms vs. a flawless firearm.

And heck,, lots look at a different angle.
Look at the custom gunsmiths out there. Clements, Bowen, Linebaugh, Tyler, Huntington, etc. They make their livelihood out of folks spending big bucks to modify, customize, or even accurize a handgun. (Just ask our own Robb Barnes how much he's spent over the years building customs! )

Or, a different angle.
Kimber. Many years ago,, competition shooters,, as well as many average shooters wanted different features on their mass produced 1911's so they would send off new guns to the gunsmiths to "upgrade" their guns. Kimber came along & offered many "custom" features,, as standard items,, and their sales SOARED!

Lastly,, quite often,, a hand built, quality firearm will be more accurate than a mass produced firearm of similar caliber, size etc. And even an average shooter amazes themselves at the way it improves their scores, or how they can hit stuff at longer ranges. A quality firearm costs more & as such,, it usually performs better,, even in average hands. So,, we now see a lot more firearms that are better built,, using skilled labor,, and able to perform better than a mass produced firearm. BUT,, as noted,, there is a point of diminishing returns.
As noted,, a Ferrari retains it's value as long as it's maintained. A quality firearm maintains it's value if built by a quality maker. (But we all like to find the "DEALS!")

 

[bobski]

the 1911a1 that I bought from a good friend of mine and went distinguished with, is behind glass with my ribbons in my shadow box.
sorta like drinking a good wine and smashing the glass. it did the job for 2 men, and now it sits in honor.
it was built by the usmc quantico team for MSGT buel parker usa pistol team retired 1955, and maintained by the nws crane van for me usn pistol team retired. same hole 25yds. not bad for a 230 ball 45.
that gun was so sensitive, I had to install brand new wood checked grips every season or it would effect accuracy. batch numbers on ammo changed its point of impact.
worth every penny.

 

[Robb Barnes]

I’ve been following this thread with lots of interest and chuckles. Like mentioned, if you buy a gun simply as a tool to launch a projectile then you would best served spending your $400-$500 on a factory stocked gun and never look back. Chances are it will outshoot the person holding it. BUT if you look at a gun as a way to express ones personal tastes or to appreciate the talents and skills of armament artists like Hamilton or David and if that is how a person wants to spend their disposable income then paying $3000 or three times that much for a revolver or pistol easy to do. Fortunately we still live in a country where we each can choose which camp we want to be in. For me, I’ll keep my few customs I have, enjoy them as both refined shooting tools and pieces of metallic art.