Conflicting trends that are hard to understand

[vito]

There appears to be little question that our society is becoming more and more firearm friendly, despite those states that are clearly out of the mainstream like NY and NJ. Every state now has some form of legal concealed carry. Open carry is becoming more and more acceptable (Maine and Texas just joined the list of states where it is legal) and polls show more people are concerned with protecting gun rights than with achieving "gun control". This would seem to indicate a movement toward a conservative political position, and yet the general belief among political commentators is that the U.S. is actually becoming more liberal. When even Charles Krauthammer takes it as fact that the population is becoming more liberal then I have to recognize that. Some say that we have more liberals now than a few years ago because there are fewer so-called moderates, but in any case it seems odd that we are seeing the acceptance of the gun culture growing, which is a conservative trend, at the same time we are seeing a growth in supporters of liberalism. I'll admit that I don't understand how both are happening at the same time. And while you might say that a pro-gun position has little to do with whether one is a conservative or a liberal, I would disagree because the very essence of our gun culture that says individual's are responsible for the safety of their families and themselves is the very opposite of what liberalism preaches, i.e., that it is the government's role to protect you and your needs are subordinated to that of the greater community as represented by the government.

 

[contender]

Miss Penny & I have had discussions along this very same thought process. It is an interesting topic. And I recently met a gentleman, who called himself a "Jefferson Democrat." He owns many guns, yet he also holds some different views on many things. A complex subject.

 

[bobski]

liberal young like video games because they get to kill things in fantasy land and they want to have real one just in case. sales go up, permits go up, gun industry is happy, and could care less which way it swings...and rake in the sales.
but like i always say....are we really making our country safer? have you ever seen some of those people who buy guns? this has always been the liberal argument. if those people who are stupid with guns dont protect them...the crooks will target them and get their guns for free, increasing the gun PROBLEM.
thats why liberals are going for the zero gun society.

 

[Pat-inCO]

Sales go up, permits go up, gun industry is happy, and could care less which way it swings...and rake in the sales.

My, what a positive attitude. :roll:

But like I always say....are we really making our country safer? Have you ever seen some of those people who buy guns?

Have you looked at AZ?
Law Enforcement in AZ figure a 90% chance that any given traffic stop will
have a gun in the vehicle. Yet they get along quite well. In fact, far better
than many of the states in the NE corner of our nation.

The "problem" is with what the individual does once he/she has the gun in
their hand. I've seen many responsible gun owners that I would hesitate
to take a drink at a water fountain, after they used it. But if they know how
to properly conduct themselves when they have a gun in their possession,
then who is it that says they should not have one?

 

[Critch]

I'm not sure that liberal equates to being anti-gun. I think you have a very vocal minority of liberals who are anti-gun, the rest are either ambivalent or afraid to speak up. I work with a lawyer who is a Clinton Democrat through and through but he is a life member of the NRA and has AR-15s etc...I'm sure him and I don't agree on everything, but he is very pro-2nd Amendment.

BTW, I know some very right wing types who are all for gun control..

 

[Kevin]

I was at the gun range yesterday. I saw a group of ladies out for some fun and two different groups one was a family with a son and daughter on the young side. The other was a dad with his teenage daughter. I think society is becoming more accepting of guns.

When I first moved to Texas from Jersey I was aprehensive to talk about guns in public, but heck some gun stores here keep a jar of lollipops behind the counter for kids like the banks do. What fun! Now I bring my daughter with me when I go to thr gun store or to buy ammo etc.

I think the acceptance does depend a lot upon the region of the country.

 

[Kevin]

And Critch, I definitely agree with you. I don't think being liberal equates with being anti-gun at all. In fact I'm not sure where (or why) that started.

 

[Jim Puke]

I don't think the gun trend has anything to do with the country becoming more conservative...I have seen NOTHING else to support that premise.

 

[Zorba]

Its called "Libertarianism" - in other words, "as much freedom as possible without your freedom trampling mine". I'm a good example, pro gun, pro choice, pro small gov't, pro "mind your own damn business", pro freedom of religion - AND - freedom FROM other people's religion, pro so-called "marriage equality", etc, etc. Anti Socialist, Anti Theocrat.

 

[BucolicBuffalo]

Only a small number of fridge liberals are anti-gun. There is however a large group of right-wing conservatives that would take our guns in a heartbeat if they could. Many are the same folks thumping Bibles about anti-tobacco, anti-drink, anti-you-name-it.

I see these political threads with someone ranting about liberals this and that. How only conservatives are our friends. I think, they could not be more naive. The enemy is among us.

 

[Colonialgirl]

And Critch, I definitely agree with you. I don't think being liberal equates with being anti-gun at all. In fact I'm not sure where (or why) that started.

Well, Then you have people like the one down south of here that MAY BE "pro-gun" but then ALWAYS votes for ANTI-GUN politicians** that WANT to take his gun rights away.
Talk about not bright !!

** Obama,
Nelson
Lefty Dem Governors
Lefty Dem Representatives for the State Legislature and the Congress.

 

[bogus bill]

I have noticed the same as the OP for quite awhile now and said similar on several gun sites. It seemed to be no one wanted to hear what I said and the posts were totally ignored. Kind of like if we acknowledge that, people might slack off giving to the NRA and similar. I think what has happened here is that this country has been in a nose dive for quite awhile and we are actually getting close to Armageddon. The people are beginning to see it and are starting to choose sides.

 

[blume357]

That's me for sure:

A conservative Republican's worse nightmare... A gun tot'n Liberal.

I have this discussion often with my liberal friends.... never try to change them but just try to plant the seed. Personal freedom.... I think we all put too many labels on folks.... it just ain't that simple.

Oh, and I do the same with my Conservative friends....

 

[SAJohn]

Compared to me, Gengis Khan was a liberal but I make up my own mind on all of the issues and sometimes actually agree with the libs. However, I don't vote for them.

 

[Jimbo357mag]

Being a pro-gun democrat has made me a pariah in the political section where I have been called every name in the book and the enemy of many on this forum. While I am pro-gun I just don't generally subscribe to the republican point of view on most topics. I would not vote for any politician that was anti-gun but many here seem to think it is all or nothing when it comes to gun politics; you are either with us or against us, so to speak. I don't follow that reasoning because there are so many other issues out there.

 

[GunnyGene]

I've never met anyone who, when asked, replies; "I don't think for myself." Every single person will claim they are "free thinkers", but very few actually are. :roll:

 

[Colonialgirl]

Being a pro-gun democrat has made me a pariah in the political section where I have been called every name in the book and the enemy of many on this forum. While I am pro-gun I just don't generally subscribe to the republican point of view on most topics. I would not vote for any politician that was anti-gun but many here seem to think it is all or nothing when it comes to gun politics; you are either with us or against us, so to speak. I don't follow that reasoning because there are so many other issues out there.

OH; So you voted for Romney and Against Obama and Sen Nelson; I SEE , UH HUH.

 

[wolfsong]

EGO can't keep track of his lies, he's uttered so many. He thinks that we have forgotten his consistency of supporting anti-gun politicians, his many public statements supporting more "sensible" gun laws and restrictions, and his unwavering devotion to the biggest and most dangerous gun grabber of them all - his hero Obama.

He is considered a pariah by many because he has shown time and time again that he IS an EGO.

 

[6gun]

If liberals aint all anti gun then they are sure voting like they are, the Dim representatives they vote for represent them, if the representative is anti-gun so is the Dims for voting for them, no if's ands or buts about it.

 

[6gun]

Being a pro-gun democrat has made me a pariah in the political section where I have been called every name in the book and the enemy of many on this forum. While I am pro-gun I just don't generally subscribe to the republican point of view on most topics. I would not vote for any politician that was anti-gun but many here seem to think it is all or nothing when it comes to gun politics; you are either with us or against us, so to speak. I don't follow that reasoning because there are so many other issues out there.

Can't have it both ways, you voted for a anti-gun president and claim to be pro-gun in the same breath :roll:

 

[FastEd]

American Citizens of all kinds have finally realized that they are responsible for their own protection.
They have expressed how they feel and it is so overwhelming that even the politicians know they can't fight it, now.

 

[mohavesam]

today in this society we've built, I'd opine how a person votes defines whether they are one "media-defined leaning" or another.

So I don't put much credence in how one defines him/herself; rather their vote is what utterly defines how much they support a Constitutionally-compliant future, or a future with nothing to promise but departure from freedoms and liberty which our fathers and grandfathers lived within. Not much else has relevance

Simply put, Evil requires more departure from the Constitutional Republic which is our nation.

One either votes for and actively supports politician(s) with a history of gun Rights support, or they are part of a very large problem.

 

[Paul B]

I'm probably suffering from some sleep deprivation but an idea just occurred to me. WE all know there are anti-gun liberals and we all know there awesome anti-gun conservatives as well. Considering the present political climate, what would happen it one party or the other got complete 100 percent control of the house and Senate? Add insult to injury with a President belonging to the same party. Would/could that party declare complete control and get away with it? Granted, so far none have dared try but "what if"?
And while I'm think political parties, why are they called parties anyway? My thought is they're having such fun screwing over we the people. :x Of course a true Libertarian government would probably end up being nothing but anarchy and chaos in the long run.
Stop the world. I want to get off.
Paul B.

 

[GunnyGene]

I'm probably suffering from some sleep deprivation but an idea just occurred to me. WE all know there are anti-gun liberals and we all know there awesome anti-gun conservatives as well. Considering the present political climate, what would happen it one party or the other got complete 100 percent control of the house and Senate? Add insult to injury with a President belonging to the same party. Would/could that party declare complete control and get away with it? Granted, so far none have dared try but "what if"?
And while I'm think political parties, why are they called parties anyway? My thought is they're having such fun screwing over we the people. :x Of course a true Libertarian government would probably end up being nothing but anarchy and chaos in the long run.
Stop the world. I want to get off.
Paul B.

Humanity has always oscillated between absolute tyranny of one sort or another, and total anarchy, with a few short stops somewhere in between. Enjoy the ride. :wink: