Answer me this..............

[Bob Wright]

The thread on double action shooting..................


When did the term "double action" come into use?

I know double action revolvers have been around a long time. But seems to me "double action" is a fairly recent term. The older terms were "self cocking" or "self cockers."

Bob Wright

 

[bogus bill]

I am 77.7 years old and it was common as far back as I can remember. I would guess it became a common gun phrase at least since 1877 as I owned a colt 1877 model lighting and also a colt 1878 DOUBLE ACTION ARMY and it was advertised that way back then. Long enough I don't see any reason to go farther back and cut hairs over the terminology. Also owned a S&W DOUBLE ACTION .44 that was made in the 1880`s. A more pertinent question might be about when did double action auto`s come out? I aint so sure on that one. Maybe the German Walther P-38?? I just looked it up. The P-38 came out in 1938. I think that might have been the first double action auto.

 

[Bob Wright]

The Roth-Sauer pistol of World War I vintage was double action only. The action only ejected the case and chambered the fresh round. Cycling did not cock the action.


Bob Wright

 

[Bob Wright]

I am 77.7 years old and it was common as far back as I can remember. I would guess it became a common gun phrase at least since 1877 as I owned a colt 1877 model lighting and also a colt 1878 DOUBLE ACTION ARMY and it was advertised that way back then. Long enough I don't see any reason to go farther back and cut hairs over the terminology. Also owned a S&W DOUBLE ACTION .44 that was made in the 1880`s. A more pertinent question might be about when did double action auto`s come out? I aint so sure on that one. Maybe the German Walther P-38?? I just looked it up. The P-38 came out in 1938. I think that might have been the first double action auto.

As far as advertising was concerned, I don't remember seeing the term 'Double Action" being used, but these were somewhat more recent ads. I had an uncle, a WW I veteran, who called the Colt 1877 "the little birdhead Colt." He had a number of other revolvers from time to time, though these were referred to as "lemon squeezers" and "top break" revolvers. I never heard him use the term "double action." He was to tell me the first cartridge firing gun he ever saw and fired was after he entered the Army.

Bob Wright

 

[Paul B]

Keeping this simple, a single action revolver has to be hand cocked for each shot. A douple action revolver can be hand cocked just as a single action or just "self cocked" by squeezing the trigger. But then again, I bet you already knew that, :lol: So why is a revolver meant to be fired ONLY by squeezing the trigger called double action only? If you can't hand cock the thing, then is should be called a single action gun, right?

Same thing with semi-auto handguns. A 1911 is a single action gun and the Beretta M92 is a double action gun, yes S&W for example had a version that looked exactly like the 6906 was was double action only. (Sorry, I've forgotten the model number) When you shoot the 6906, the hammer stays back for the next shot but the DAO version the hammer follows the slide and does not stay back. Shouldn't that DAO version also be called a single action? The 6906 is a damn nice gun BTW.
Paul B.

 

[RoninPA]

I believe the "double action" was/is describing the action of the trigger. In a double action handgun, the trigger can perform one or two actions, either releasing the hammer or cocking the hammer and releasing the hammer. In a single action handgun, the trigger only performs a single action, releasing the hammer. In a double action only (DAO) since the hammer normally cannot be cocked manually by the operator, the trigger can "Only" be operated in the double action mode.

 

[Rancher Will]

If I may merely state what I have learned. As early as the 1930's, as a boy, I always heard the Colt and other black powder and ball loaded revolvers, plus cartridge loaded revolvers, Colt and others, called single action when each shot required the shooter to manually cock the hammer for each shot.

Cartridge revolvers that could be fired first by either manually cocking the hammer with a thumb, or firing the revolver by merely pulling the trigger to both cock the hammer and fire the gun, the shooter's choice, were called Double Action revolvers.

The only guns that I ever heard called "Self Cocking" were semi auto guns such as the Lugers, Browning types, etc., that automatically cocked the hammer after every shot without the shooter touching the hammer.

I think this still describes the terms.

 

[coach]

The only guns that I ever heard called "Self Cocking" were semi auto guns such as the Lugers, Browning types, etc., that automatically cocked the hammer after every shot without the shooter touching the hammer.

I think this still describes the terms.

Same here. Self cocking for me was a semi-auto where the slide cocked the hammer for the next shot. That made it a SA. Just a squeeze of the trigger to release the hammer to fire.

 

[RoninPA]

The only guns that I ever heard called "Self Cocking" were semi auto guns such as the Lugers, Browning types, etc., that automatically cocked the hammer after every shot without the shooter touching the hammer.

I think this still describes the terms.

Same here. Self cocking for me was a semi-auto where the slide cocked the hammer for the next shot. That made it a SA. Just a squeeze of the trigger to release the hammer to fire.

Agree, but now you also have semi-autos that can be DA for the first shot and then SA after that and there are semi-autos that are DAO, no SA at all (you see them typically being used by police forces)

 

[Wyandot Jim]

Don't know if the Colt was called a double action or not but probably one of the first..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_M1877
The Colt M1877 was a double-action revolver manufactured by Colt's Patent Fire Arms from January 1877 to 1909 for a total of 166,849 revolvers. The Model 1877 was offered in three calibers, which lent them three unofficial names: the "Lightning", the "Thunderer", and the "Rainmaker". The principal difference between the models was the cartridge in which they were chambered: the "Lightning" being chambered in .38 Long Colt; the "Thunderer" in .41 Colt. Both models had a six-round ammunition capacity.[1] An earlier model in .32 Colt known as the "Rainmaker" was offered in 1877.[2]

 

[Bob Wright]

For whatever its worth now:

The 1851 Adams revolver was advertised as "54 Bore Adams Self Cocking Revolver."

And:

Patent US933797A was applied for Sept. 14, 1909 by C.M. Stone, of Smith & Wesson, for a "Self Cocking Revolver."

Patent US778500A was applied for Dec. 27, 1904 by O.F. Mossberg for "A Self Cocking Revolver."

The term self cocking apparently pre-dates the term double action.

Bob Wright

 

[Paul B]

Seems like everybody has forgotten the semi-automatic Webly-Fosbury revolver. I bet they was fun to shoot. NOT!
Paul B.

 

[Bob Wright]

Seems like everybody has forgotten the semi-automatic Webly-Fosbury revolver. I bet they was fun to shoot. NOT!
Paul B.

No, not forgotten. It was just outside the realm of the original question.


Bob Wright