.44 mag vs special weight difference?

[sheep.dog]

Just some random, bored musings from a place with no guns and lot of free time. I was thinking about this last night. Disclaimer: as a back packer I tend to be a gram counter. I've done research on the net but I need a little help from some forum members.

What is the total weight savings of packing a .44 special vs magnum while traveling on foot in the bush. Let's do a lot of assuming: Firstly, the carrier does not actually need the added power of the magnum. The gun will be a Ruger BH or SBH. The carrier will be in the bush for a while and wants to be overly prepared and therefore will carry the revolver fully loaded and an additional 50 rounds of hand loaded cartridges using 250gr cast Kieth bullets, CCI 300 primers, and Unique powder loaded to manufacturers specs.

The Gun: (from Ruger)
NM Blackhawk, .44special, 4.62" = 42oz
NM Super Blackhawk, .44mag, 4.62" = 45oz

total weight savings = 3oz.

The ammo, From Alliant Powder:
Using a 250gr, cast, Kieth bullet and CCI300 primers.

.44special = 6.9 grains
.44 magnum = 11 grains

Total weight savings= 4.1gr (x 56)= 229.6grains= .52oz

OK, well here's where I need the help- how much does the clean, unprimed brass weigh?

I'm guessing it'll be another .5oz of weight saved for the 56 cartridges. Making the total weight savings roughly 4oz or .25lbs. Not that much, really.

 

[pisgah]

Since I can imagine only one reasonable scenario in which a guy would spend so much thought on the subject, I have to ask -- when are you getting out of prison? :wink:

 

[varminter22]

A quarter pound (or so) doesn't sound like much, but it is quite noticeable.

 

[sheep.dog]

Since I can imagine only one reasonable scenario in which a guy would spend so much thought on the subject, I have to ask -- when are you getting out of prison? :wink:

Ha. Not prison, China. I'm here teaching English to kids. One thing I was told before coming here was to spend lots of time reading and writing English because most of the English I'm speaking is very simple and hearing is very poor.... and it can rub off. Also I have weird hours. Also missing shooting a lot so I spend a lot of time thinking about it.

 

[Sugar River]

If you want serious weight savings get yourself a 357 3 screw and convert it to 44 Spec.
The one I have with 4.75 barrel comes in a hair under 35 oz.

Pete

 

[contender]

To those of us who have backpacked & lived out of a pack for more than a day or two, we understand the calculations of weight savings. When you spend 2 or more weeks living out of a backpack, all while hiking in steep, rough terrain, you want EVERY ounce knocked off you can get.
I have calculated, studied, & parred down a lot in a backpack when I've taken extended trips. I have chuckled at weight of some of the people going with me.
Example; BSA, & a group doing a 10 day trek at Philmont NM. We do "shakedown" trips prior to the actual trip. I work with my boys to help them take out unnecessary items & cut down on weight. When we get to Philmont, the staff their does a "pack inspection" as well, trying to reduce unnecessary items & weight. Still, I see boys hitting the trails with 50-60 lb packs. My last trek, my pack weighed 32.7 lbs. Most of my boys had packs in the 40-45 lb range. One boy beat me with a 30 lb, 14 oz pack.

Granted we were not carrying any firearms. (Not allowed at Philmont by hikers.)

So, to the OP, I suggest you study how you can cut down your actual needs when it comes to the 44 you plan on packing. For instance; Why do you need 50 extra rounds? Will the firearm be used for hunting & gathering while hiking? Or, is it just an emergency item? If it's an emergency item, I'd cut back the number of rounds I'd carry. Say, 6 in the gun, and maybe 20 rounds as reserve.
Next, as suggested, maybe a different caliber & type of firearm can fill the needs?
Once you start seriously studying this, you can realize a lot more weight loss for a backpacking trip. And I can promise you, after a few days of daily hiking, your back & shoulders will appreciate the lighter load.

 

[sheep.dog]

So, to the OP, I suggest you study how you can cut down your actual needs when it comes to the 44 you plan on packing. For instance; Why do you need 50 extra rounds? Will the firearm be used for hunting & gathering while hiking? Or, is it just an emergency item? If it's an emergency item, I'd cut back the number of rounds I'd carry. Say, 6 in the gun, and maybe 20 rounds as reserve.
Next, as suggested, maybe a different caliber & type of firearm can fill the needs?
Once you start seriously studying this, you can realize a lot more weight loss for a backpacking trip. And I can promise you, after a few days of daily hiking, your back & shoulders will appreciate the lighter load.

Do you seriously think i would spend the effort working this out if i wasn't always thinking about weight? As mentioned in the original post when it comes to backpacking, I'm a gram counter- that means I work to cut my pack weight by every gram I can. Try ditching your tent and carrying a silnylon tarp, shortening your toothbrush will save you a few grams. Do you know how much lighter a 1 liter Pepsi bottle is when compared to a nalgene bottle?. I can easily do a sub 30lb pack for 6-7days. I'very been close to 15lbs for 4 day AT hikes and i'm living comfortabley on the trail. I invested have a lot of time and money to a solid ultra light backpacking set up

The post was simply an exercise in crunching numbers . I chose to use 50 rnds because it leaves us with a relatively round number of close to .5 oz, I chose to compare .44 mag to special because its been on my mid a lot lately. Like the post said it was bored musings.

btw I dont always carry on the trail but if i do its my 3.75" SBH .44 mag with 6 in the cylinder and six in my pocket, which I think is more than enough for a week or 2 on the trail.

 

[woodperson]

so when do you get released?

 

[bogus bill]

I am with the OP on this. First, I am a special nut as I own seven of them. Second, I packed on my simple job (s) as armed security over 35 years and many 12 and 16 hour days. Any extra weight and bulk does make a difference. I own a lipsey special, 2 colt single actions and 4 various smiths all in .44 special. I also own a smith 29-2 in a 5" barrel and some more N frame smiths to compare like a 4" 25-5 in .45 colt.
All the smith mountain guns have the pencil barrels instead of the straight heavier one. Only the model 24 doesn't because it already had it. I don't know the actual published weight differences but I can feel it. The 24-3 vs the 29-2 for instance, not only has the lighter barrel but the cylinder is shorter both the length on each end because the special is shorter plus it isnt recessed. The 24 has the standard trigger and hammer where the 29 is the wider target. On my 24 I also put on the magna service style grips. I have both to compare and even though the actual weight difference probley doesn't sound like much it DOES make a noticeable difference and much more so with the service grips. I recommend a 4" s&w 24-3 or a 624. Also my following choices would be any smith mountain gun in .45 colt or .44 mag. The colt saa is a lot lighter than the lipsey special too, as I have both to compare but it is pricey. Here are my seven specials. And the last one with the faux ivory is my favorite packing gun in the boonies. Trail rideing on atv`s is my favorite pass time. I also have a bunch of 357s, 38s etc.

 

[docbrazos]

since your number crunching try this.
drop down to 180 grain bullets.
That's 70 grains per bullet. since you've stated you will need 50+ rounds Ok.
50x70=3500 grains all else considered you just knocked off 1/2 pound.
drop to 20 carried rounds of 180's from 50 you save another 3/4 pounds in just lead not counting the brass.
Now if you in bear country maybe the first six rounds could be 250 Kieth's but if you have to use them you should probably go hiking some where else!

 

[docbrazos]

Dang, 7 44 Specials. Another died in the wool fan. I Only have 5, Colt SSA 5 1/2, 624 Smith, two Ruger New SS Vaqueros and a light weight Charter Bulldog Pug. I need to get it into gear!

 

[Bear Paw Jack]

Good informative thread.

Ty a few years ago a boy scout troop flew up to Alaska for a hike. NO guns IIRC, there was a bear attack. Been a while so I don't remember all the details but I know at least one kid got hurt. Seems like it wasn't real bad but since it didn't happen to me, it's easy for me to say. I think in some places they need to rethink the no gun deal. In fact, bear attacks on boy scouts aren't really all that rare. news.cincinnati.com/article/20100707/NEWS01/7080354/‎
http://www.newsminer.com/teen-s-father-hikers-had-little-chance-to-react-to/article_7995ecd8-83d1-5968-ac9c-ecc3b2cd9f1b.html

 

[gramps]

For backpacking my Charter Arms Bulldog Pug (28 oz)will get the nod with 5 in the gun and twenty extra cartridges. Summertime 5 of the extra cartridges are shot shells. On horse back, or ATV's, day trips, the Rugers ( SBH or Redhawk) work fine!
gramps

 

[BlkHawk73]

From all 127# of little ole me, if a few ounces, even a pound is such a big deal, I'd be looking more at fitness than anything else. Use a GOOD holster and a GOOD belt and that weight practically is negligible. Little me can carry a SBH, one of the Bisleys, or BH's all day in the woods and never feel weighted down or fatigued. Use cheap gear that allows sagging, and drooping, pulling down on the belt and you and it's all together different.
Crossing over to long guns…. Same thing, if I gotta have a ultra light model rifle 'cause a regular alb one is too much of a burden, I best be thinking gym membership and finding new folks to praise and look up to.

 

[contender]

sheep.dog, if I upset you, that was NOT my intent. I was trying to post info to give you, as well as many others things to think about. I figured you were truly trying to seriously cut down on weight. Sorry if I offended you.

 

[shaffe48]

From all 127# of little ole me, if a few ounces, even a pound is such a big deal, I'd be looking more at fitness than anything else. Use a GOOD holster and a GOOD belt and that weight practically is negligible. Little me can carry a SBH, one of the Bisleys, or BH's all day in the woods and never feel weighted down or fatigued. Use cheap gear that allows sagging, and drooping, pulling down on the belt and you and it's all together different.
Crossing over to long guns…. Same thing, if I gotta have a ultra light model rifle 'cause a regular alb one is too much of a burden, I best be thinking gym membership and finding new folks to praise and look up to.

I second that motion. Your own body weight varies more than you're talking about throughout the day but you don't notice because (some of us) carry this weight evenly. Same way with a revolver in a good holster and belt.

To answer your question, my .46 second google search turned up the following:

380 150/lb
9mm, 117.7cases/#, 8.5#/1000
38spl, 102.8cases/#, 9.7#/1000
.357 Mag 90/lb
40s&w 99.9cases/#, 10#/1000
.45acp, 89.58gr/ea, 78.1cases/#, 12.8#/1000
.44 Sp 83/lb
.44mag, 114.38gr/ea, 61.2cases/#, 16.3#/1000
.223 75/lb
30 Carbine 110/lb
30-30 54/lb
.308 42/lb
30.06 38/lb
50bmg, 8.1cases/#, 123.5#/100

Now, there's 16 oz the pound, so you can do the math.

Since you're being so precise, you should also eat exactly what you will be eating on the trail and weigh your dumps for at least a week and average them so you can approximate how much lighter you will be on average afterwords. As you suggest, it's best to weight them in grams. I didn't want to do a web search on that one, and since it varies from person to person, I would highly recommend personal experimentation on this highly important matter.