22lr carry for defense??

[kmoore]

Really? You DO know that Bella Twin killed a grizzly bear with proper placement with a single shot .22 rifle, right? That certain pro killers used .22 LR as their signature weapon?

gunpolicy.org/documents/5561-22-calibre-rabbit-rifles-kill-more-people-than-any-other/file

Yes really.
We are talking about SD handguns here not rifles. If I could walk up behind a person and put the barrel of a gun inches away from their head and pull the trigger. Yep, the tiny bullet normally will bounce around inside the skull and kill. The question is why it was used, it was used for the low sound level not because it's the best killing caliber. Many slaughterhouse animals have been killed by a .22lr into the brain.
I investigated a death of a person from a pellet rifle another from a butter knife. That does not prove those are good choices to carry and use to defend yourself. But if YOU want to carry a butter knife, have at it. There are far too many better choices in calibers and actual handguns on the market that are lightyears ahead of the .22lr in any bullet form or firearm to serve that purpose. Spend a few minutes reading the study and tests the FBI went through about handgun calibers and bullets. The FBI does make many errors in daily job performance but their firearms tests and studies are real in depth and for instance use hundreds if not thousands of cases to see patterns of what works and what doesn't. The report I am speaking of used years of ER data from the US on gunshot victims. Then moved into the test labs.

 

[GunnyGene]

Leroy Brown carried a .32 gun in his pocket for fun.

 

[Jeepnik]

But Leroy was the second baddest man in the whole dang town. And in the end having a .32 didn't work out so well for Leroy.

 

[Bear Paw Jack]

On the rare occasion that I do a gun show a woman will come by looking for something real light to carry. They seldom have any shooting experience so I point them to a lightweight 22 revolver , usually 8 shooters. I figure that's the painless way of getting the shooting practice and they can move up from there. I tell them start with the crotch and sew them up to the eyeballs. Might not kill the guy but it should make them think about their current plans!!!

 

[blume357]

I think the recoil and such is not an issue really ... of course 'some people are intimidated by it but if they are truly dedicated to honing their skill with a handgun then they will work through it and learn to get past it. I personally don;t like or have a need to go to the range and put hundreds of rounds through a gun.... I've done it over time and even paid for hundreds of hours of formal firearms training. I think any women who 'want to' can over come the recoil on any pistol. Now the real problem for many is actually racking the slide on larger semi-autos. Wife and I have a good friend who just can't do it on even a Ruger P-95. So she had a Beretta 22lr Bobcat, one of those that has the flip up barrel to load the first round. I thought this was not enough for her and so I gave her my Ruger Security Six in 357mag and a box of 38 Specials.

 

[Joe Chartreuse]

Leroy Brown carried a .32 gun in his pocket for fun.

Bad Bad,......... and I would take .22LR over a .32 any day.

 

[blume357]

To be totally politically incorrect... my late father acquired from somewhere a 32 cal revolver and carried it... he called it his Polock pistol... it was an 8 shot.

 

[sharpblade7777]

I carry one occasionally and certainly think they fill a role.

 

[kmoore]

As I have posted my opinion the .22lr as a selfdefense handgun round is not enough nor reliable enough to use/carry to save your life if shooting is required. It's an unusual story to read about a man that saved his life by shooting a bear with one. But after that story appeared did any hunting guides decide that's also the choice, they want to shoot a charging bear or moose and switched to carrying a .22lr. I think not. It's a novelty story or case and I am glad it saved that guy. It's not the norm. And it certainly will not make me a believer that I should also carry one as a SD weapon.
In my past job, I knew coworkers and the names of others who had been shot while on duty by handguns, rifles and shotguns that survived being shot, most in the vest. 2 that I worked with side by side at some point had been shot in the face. Both shot with .22lr handguns. I never asked if they were thankful the criminal shot them with that caliber or not. I think they both were since they survived. Both had been returned to duty when I met them. I don't remember all the facts; those cases were in the late 70s and early 80s. One the bullet entered his face below an eye and followed his cheekbone, exiting near his ear. The other was below an eye and exited back out through his nose. Those might also be novelty cases. But they happened.

 

[Mobuck]

I'll add a bit more: There is some confusion (IMHO) about stopping a fight vs a fatality. NOT THE SAME
Folks relate numbers of fatalities caused by 22LR but I'm not concerned about that as much as HOW QUICKLY THE TARGET WAS DISABLED OR STOPPED FIGHTING.
I related my personal experiences using a 22LR on small (ish) animals that often took a while to finally feel the effects of a fatal hit. Plenty of time for an assailant to cause severe injuries to the victim. This is NOT what I'd call effective self defense.
Another tidbit: Don't expect to maintain your 'pinpoint accuracy' during a self defense scenario. I'm a fairly good shot but there have been times when under some sort of stress, I had to ask myself "Where the heck did that shot go or how did that bullet hit there?". That TV western thing where the good guy stands firm and makes a perfect shot while bullets bounce all around him isn't true.
I don't deny that 'any gun is better than no gun' BUT a better gun is always an advantage over an inadequate gun.

 

[Joe Chartreuse]

I'll add a bit more: There is some confusion (IMHO) about stopping a fight vs a fatality. NOT THE SAME
Folks relate numbers of fatalities caused by 22LR but I'm not concerned about that as much as HOW QUICKLY THE TARGET WAS DISABLED OR STOPPED FIGHTING.
I related my personal experiences using a 22LR on small (ish) animals that often took a while to finally feel the effects of a fatal hit. Plenty of time for an assailant to cause severe injuries to the victim. This is NOT what I'd call effective self defense.
Another tidbit: Don't expect to maintain your 'pinpoint accuracy' during a self defense scenario. I'm a fairly good shot but there have been times when under some sort of stress, I had to ask myself "Where the heck did that shot go or how did that bullet hit there?". That TV western thing where the good guy stands firm and makes a perfect shot while bullets bounce all around him isn't true.
I don't deny that 'any gun is better than no gun' BUT a better gun is always an advantage over an inadequate gun.

Again, TEN SHOTS in the gun ( I'm thinking LCP II or similar). If one can't stop an assailant with ten shots ( and virtually no recoil or need to re-aim), one should go find a grenade. No gun will do any good.

 

[PRichardson87]

Again, TEN SHOTS in the gun ( I'm thinking LCP II or similar). If one can't stop an assailant with ten shots ( and virtually no recoil or need to re-aim), one should go find a grenade. No gun will do any good.

If I can't stop an assailant with ten shots from my airsoft pistol will one shot from my 45/70 be effective?

 

[Joe Chartreuse]

If I can't stop an assailant with ten shots from my airsoft pistol will one shot from my 45/70 be effective?

Not if you don't hit anything.

 

[eveled]

Although .22 is not ideal, here are my thoughts:

- Nobody wants to get shot, even with a .22

- A lot of people have been killed with a .22

- Read about the assassination attempt on President Reagan - he was hit by a .22 ricochet; James Brady was hit in the head by a .22 round. Serious stuff.

- A gun your wife wants to shoot is much much better than one she doesn't want to shoot

Don't forget Serpico.

 

[Jeepnik]

Don't forget Serpico.

Serpico didn't die

 

[eveled]

Serpico didn't die

Neither did his other 2 examples at least not right away.

Reagan died of natural causes but his wound was from a ricochet.

Brady died from his wounds 33 years later.

I don't know if any of these are good examples of .22 lr effectiveness

 

[hike]

Yes it was. But when some say .22lr is a good choice or a choice for SD. Facts don't show that is.

Really??
"Facts don't show that os" makes no sense!
An SD weapon is chosen with an accurate assessment of the user. Some users can only use a 22. Based on the statistics (and personal experience) that the mere showing (not brandishing) of a firearms makes 100,000's, if not millions, of perpetrators stop and leave, your statement is just an opinion.
Sharing an opinion as facts is not a good thing.
IMHE/IMHO

 

[PaulSoCal]

my late father acquired from somewhere a 32 cal revolver and carried it... he called it his Polock pistol... it was an 8 shot.

I don't get it... but then again I am half Polish...

a) For protection against Poles?
b) Because it was an 8 shot and not a six-shooter?
c) Because only a Pole would buy a 32 cal?

Did it look like this?

I was a kid in the 60's. Back then they were jokes and I don't know a single Pole who actually took offense, except if the joke teller thought the jokes were true - and I met one of those in college. - Being Polish, I was the college janitor... hahaha ( actually I possess a doctorate - in Polish literature... )

Paul

 

[Joe Chartreuse]

Infinitely adaptable.

 

[Pál_K]

Reagan died of natural causes but his wound was from a ricochet.

Brady died from his wounds 33 years later.

I don't know if any of these are good examples of .22 lr effectiveness

Besides President Reagan, also hit were DC Police Officer Thomas Delahanty, Secret Service Agent Tim McCarthy, and White House Press Secretary James Brady. All of their wounds were serious at the time and all were incapacitated to a certain extent at that moment.

The .22 LR would not be my choice for a "one shot stop," but it likely would reduce the effectivess of a bad guy, depending on where you hit him.

Last year I got this chart from somewhere; my apology for not knowing the source nor the accuracy of its contents: