Sturm Ruger & Company Reserve SN# Program ???
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El Numero Uno
Buckeye
I think it may have been the Single 10.
chet15
Hawkeye
Yes...I think El Numero Uno is correct on that.
Chet15
Chet15
Wherein/Wheninhell is the official factory letter on this debacle? :roll: 
chet15
Hawkeye
HAWKEYE#28 said:Wherein/Wheninhell is the official factory letter on this debacle? :roll:
Par for the course, don't you think?
Chet15
There's no money in sending out letters ! I gave my number up when the screwed me out of my Gold Label SXS. They just don't care any more unless it puts lots on money in their pockets. Bill must be turning a mile a minute in his grave.
chet15
Hawkeye
Ruger168 said:
Which is why I can't figure them out...there should always be $ in PR and other customer service
Chet15
Chet15, I really think they just don't give a crap anymore. They are just like the current administration in Washington, they do what they want, when they want and don't think about the outcome. The board and officers are making money and that's what matters. The thing that gets me is their complete disregard for Bill Ruger's legacy !
chet15
Hawkeye
Well...one could think they could make more $ if they looked at all areas to promote their product. Collectors don't do that? Last I knew, collectors usually have more than one Ruger. Collectors actually buy lots of Rugers. If it weren't for Rugers being purchased out of the secondary and primary markets, there wouldn't be a substantial need to replace a dealer's stock.
Chet15
Chet15
I really not a Collector, more of an Accumulator, However I have always looked to the Collector for knowledge.
I agree it's disappointing Ruger has gone away from this base. One has to think this hurts the history of the company in many different ways.
This thread keeps kicking along in an interesting direction, I sure appreciate the thoughts posted, thanks guys, and feel free to keep em coming.... :wink:
I agree it's disappointing Ruger has gone away from this base. One has to think this hurts the history of the company in many different ways.
This thread keeps kicking along in an interesting direction, I sure appreciate the thoughts posted, thanks guys, and feel free to keep em coming.... :wink:
I, as well as identified others, am still waiting for Mr Fifer's responses to our notes, letters and calls. He seems to be responsive and available to nearly everyone else...........Totally unacceptable. :roll:
sadly?? but truthfully they are not any different than the "old man " was, I recall conversations with Mr Ruger at I think it was the Salt Lake City, Utah ,NRA convention,My wife ,who at the time was a RCA Field rep ,Mr Ruger, Hank Williams Jr and Mr Roy Jinks were discussing 'various things, (mainly children if I remember right, Hank Was a recent "new" Dad then in the very early 1990s)), and anyway "collecting" was brought up and Mr Ruger flat out stated that the collectors did him NOTHING, his goal was to built , sell, have folks buy them ,use them, wear them out and buy MORE,yes, the "collectors" are a secondary market and mainly buy and sell between themselves, think about it....yes, the caveat to this was Mr Jinks and his noting is, was, the "history" was of importance to him, still is to this day, where is ANY "history" in regards to our Rugers, ?? heck we cannot get a simple shipping answer, let alone ANY "proper provenance of what was built ,how and when, aside from a few "select" ( and opportunist??) authors of ONE or TWO books?????? Heck, if Chad does not continue his rooting out any and all info, what would we know today???? stories, and 'lore' handed down piece-meal, amongst anyone who listens or cares to hear whatever............sad but true, it is NOT in their current plans, NO money in it
and some of us continue to flog a DEAD horse....... :roll:
and some of us continue to flog a DEAD horse....... :roll:
RPM Enterprises
Buckeye
Here is a letter I wrote on 5/6/14. How it started I answered questions from a survey Ruger sent me that I get every year. I then emailed Mr. Fifer and told him that it would be in his best interest to read it. I then received an email from Mr. Murphy (you can see his response below). We later talked on the phone and he asked I would write a letter (also shown below). Tim had told me that he would talk about it at the next Ruger meeting they were going to have. He also asked for the serial number of the gun I received from the program and let me know if it was a remanufactured gun or not (it has a "R" stamped on the bolt). Till this day I have not received and answers or even a response on any of the issues. You would think he would send me out some rear sight blades for the lites to replace.
In a message dated 5/5/2014 7:47:04 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [email protected] writes:
Rick
I read your e-mail and want to ask you what business practices from Ruger are not to your liking.
Tim Murphy
Sturm Ruger
=5/6/14
Mr. Tim Murphy,
Thank you for you quick response regarding my email survey and concerns about the Ruger Company. This letters content is what we talked about on 5-5-14.
I also wish that concerns be shared with Mr. Mike Fifer and Ruger's Board of Directors.
First a little about myself, as you know I am a FFL dealer in Washington State. My inventory of firearms is about 99% Ruger and I keep an inventory of about $35,000.00 + of firearms and accessories. As of my business I also consider myself as one of the largest collectors in the country collecting Ruger Firearms and Memorabilia. I have been collecting for about 30+ years and my personal collection consists of over 600+ Ruger firearms and I have about the most complete set of Sturm, Ruger Memorabilia from 1941 to 1999. This includes Ruger Corp. tools to Sturm books and fox figurines as well as employee gifts starting from about 1955 to current items. I know you have seen the Ruger Firearms and Memorabilia Calendars I have done for the last seven years. I also promote a Ruger display show "Rugermania" that is in its 7th consecutive year this year. (And Tim thank you for the support you have given in the past for those shows it is gratefully appreciated) I also am a life member and am part of the leadership team of the R.C.A "Ruger Collectors' Association". I also sit on the Washington Arms Collectors Board of Directors and am their Operations manager along with running their awards and display operations. This club "W.A.C." is one of the largest gun club organizations in the Pacific Northwest with about 20,000+ current members. I also am a life member of the local shooting range "Upper Nisqually Gun Club" and life member of the NRA. Just an added note I purchase 3 to 4 old model and/or new model guns for my personal collection each month. Not only am I a customer I am also a share holder in Ruger. As you can see I am very dedicated to Ruger firearms as a business and a hobby.
Tim in our conversation one of my concerns was the Ruger gun promotions. As I explained these I choose not to participate anymore due to bad experiences. The example that we had talked about was the promotion that was introduced at the 2013 Shot Show where the dealer purchased a set amount of guns for a particular package and would receive a free limited edition firearm. In this case the dealer was to purchase fifteen SR9's and receive a carbon fiber grip frame SR9C. Please see attached copy below and note 2013 sales promo. In my case this did not happen. I received a stainless SR9C that just came with 3 magazines or let's say one extra magazine. I did not receive this till 1-31-2014. I did however get a carbon fiber grip frame SR9C for my personal collection but I had to buy it off Gunbroker and paid over $550.00 for the gun. As a collector these guns mean a lot to me. Also with the 2013 sales promotion I had agreed to enroll on several other packages, and this is what I am going to refer to as bad business practices from Ruger. I deal with Davidsons, Sports South and Lipsey's. I had several packages that I had one or two guns left to fill to complete, and of those I did not get the opportunity to complete. As I explained I took every gun that was offered to me and never turned any down I even took guns I really did not want but bought them just to help complete these packages. Just to clear the air I understand sales were through the roof and Ruger had trouble filling those orders but that is not my problem. I feel that if the dealer had for instance 3 SR9 packages and filled one and started to fill the next package whether it is one gun or one gun left to complete Ruger should had honored that to be completed and toss the package out the window that had not even been started. In my case I bought more inventory that what I really needed and ended up with nothing. And trust me I am not the only dealer who felt this way. I have had several other dealers complain to me about Ruger and the promotion programs.
Next is being a collector of Ruger firearms in the past us collectors could call the Ruger records department and verify when a gun was shipped and confirm it left the factory as lets say being a factory second, duplicate serial number or special type gun. This service was free of charge. Ruger then later decided to charge 10.00 for each letter and most collectors do not have a problem with that but, it would be nice to be able to call and talk with a person to find out the information on a particular gun before the collector purchased it and confirm it is what it is and not a fake then decide to purchase or not a factory letter. And from what I have heard you can't even begin to get a letter from the factory if you pay for one or not. My opinion this is something Ruger really needs to examine and re-evaluate. It's all about customer service whether it be an old model gun or a brand new gun. A solution to this issue is maybe provide a copy of the records to the RCA and let us deal with the factory letters.
I have noticed within the last few years the quality has really suffered. I recently received 3 Ruger Lite's that the rear sight blade is broke in half and actually the broken piece is in the bag with the gun. I have also had several guns; blued 22/45's and single action revolvers that the front sight has rust on it and just received a 10/22 takedown NRA edition that the fiber optic rear sight keeps falling out. I understand good help is hard to find and when I talked with Mr. Fifer on some of these issues his explanation was is that he has hired everyone he could within a 50 to 60 mile radius that is not a drug abuser or convicted felon. I am sure you are aware that when rate goes up it most cases quality will suffer. I have seen this even in the company I work for. In addition people know me as a Ruger collector and often think I work for the company. They bring guns to me with issues and I continually help them by giving them the information of who to call at Ruger or where to mail it for repair. Most of these guns I never sold in the first place, but its all about customer service, Right?
The last question is what is going on with the subscription gun program. I have had several other subscription holders ask me if I have heard anything. I know when I last touched base with Mr. Fifer and Mr. Murphy who are also subscription gun holders there was never a strait answer. Rumor has it that the program is done with. I have also heard that the guns are held up in the warehouse and waiting to be shipped when things slow down for the company and another rumor is that the serial number range begins at 500 thus eliminating the low numbered guns. We holders have never received any formal information regarding this, like I stated it's all been rumors. Just for argument there are guns I would have never purchased if it was not for that program. Two guns I can use as example are the SR22 rifle and the Scout rifle. The way I see it is that these are guaranteed sales and even though the program may not be a very profitable program it is a small price for Ruger to pay to reward those who have supported and helped Ruger prosper in all its years of business. As a dealer at times I have used those guns for display and taken orders from my customers, my opinion a small price for marketing. Another solution maybe just charge a $20.00 processing fee for the labor to cover the cost. This is something Ruger leadership needs to take a long look at and consider continuing this program.
Sad to say but when the SR was dropped from the logo and Sturm, Ruger Corporation went to the hard R the company seems to care most about the share holders and how high they can get the stocks and dividends. Corporate greed and money seems to have taken over. In talking with some other collectors feel that we have been pushed off to the side. It certainly is not the company we knew loved in the past. I often ask myself what happened to the loyalty. The last couple years when the guns (Ruger's) were hard to get I could have purchased other brands just to have inventory but I chose to stay loyal to Ruger and only purchase Ruger firearms.
In closing I am not sure who makes a lot of the decisions at Ruger whether it is Mr. Fifer or the Board of Directors, but if they have to make an executive decision and continue not fulfill the promotional sales packages that were started, the factory letters and discontinue the subscription guns program then I guess I need to make and executive decision about my business and broaden my sales and start carrying Glock, Springfield Armory, Tauras, Smith and Wesson and other manufactures.
Again Tim for your fast response and concerns about the issues I had brought to attention. Your one of the best sales representatives I have ever dealt with and hopefully we can continue to have a great business relationship. Please take this information to Mr. Fifer and the Board of Directors and maybe we can together resolve some of these issues that concern me and other Ruger dealers and collectors. I hope some of these issues I bring up don't fall on deaf ears. If you have any questions about what I have written please feel free to contact me. Again thank you for your time and understanding.
Best Regards:
Rick Verzal
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/5/2014 7:47:04 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [email protected] writes:
Rick
I read your e-mail and want to ask you what business practices from Ruger are not to your liking.
Tim Murphy
Sturm Ruger
=5/6/14
Mr. Tim Murphy,
Thank you for you quick response regarding my email survey and concerns about the Ruger Company. This letters content is what we talked about on 5-5-14.
I also wish that concerns be shared with Mr. Mike Fifer and Ruger's Board of Directors.
First a little about myself, as you know I am a FFL dealer in Washington State. My inventory of firearms is about 99% Ruger and I keep an inventory of about $35,000.00 + of firearms and accessories. As of my business I also consider myself as one of the largest collectors in the country collecting Ruger Firearms and Memorabilia. I have been collecting for about 30+ years and my personal collection consists of over 600+ Ruger firearms and I have about the most complete set of Sturm, Ruger Memorabilia from 1941 to 1999. This includes Ruger Corp. tools to Sturm books and fox figurines as well as employee gifts starting from about 1955 to current items. I know you have seen the Ruger Firearms and Memorabilia Calendars I have done for the last seven years. I also promote a Ruger display show "Rugermania" that is in its 7th consecutive year this year. (And Tim thank you for the support you have given in the past for those shows it is gratefully appreciated) I also am a life member and am part of the leadership team of the R.C.A "Ruger Collectors' Association". I also sit on the Washington Arms Collectors Board of Directors and am their Operations manager along with running their awards and display operations. This club "W.A.C." is one of the largest gun club organizations in the Pacific Northwest with about 20,000+ current members. I also am a life member of the local shooting range "Upper Nisqually Gun Club" and life member of the NRA. Just an added note I purchase 3 to 4 old model and/or new model guns for my personal collection each month. Not only am I a customer I am also a share holder in Ruger. As you can see I am very dedicated to Ruger firearms as a business and a hobby.
Tim in our conversation one of my concerns was the Ruger gun promotions. As I explained these I choose not to participate anymore due to bad experiences. The example that we had talked about was the promotion that was introduced at the 2013 Shot Show where the dealer purchased a set amount of guns for a particular package and would receive a free limited edition firearm. In this case the dealer was to purchase fifteen SR9's and receive a carbon fiber grip frame SR9C. Please see attached copy below and note 2013 sales promo. In my case this did not happen. I received a stainless SR9C that just came with 3 magazines or let's say one extra magazine. I did not receive this till 1-31-2014. I did however get a carbon fiber grip frame SR9C for my personal collection but I had to buy it off Gunbroker and paid over $550.00 for the gun. As a collector these guns mean a lot to me. Also with the 2013 sales promotion I had agreed to enroll on several other packages, and this is what I am going to refer to as bad business practices from Ruger. I deal with Davidsons, Sports South and Lipsey's. I had several packages that I had one or two guns left to fill to complete, and of those I did not get the opportunity to complete. As I explained I took every gun that was offered to me and never turned any down I even took guns I really did not want but bought them just to help complete these packages. Just to clear the air I understand sales were through the roof and Ruger had trouble filling those orders but that is not my problem. I feel that if the dealer had for instance 3 SR9 packages and filled one and started to fill the next package whether it is one gun or one gun left to complete Ruger should had honored that to be completed and toss the package out the window that had not even been started. In my case I bought more inventory that what I really needed and ended up with nothing. And trust me I am not the only dealer who felt this way. I have had several other dealers complain to me about Ruger and the promotion programs.
Next is being a collector of Ruger firearms in the past us collectors could call the Ruger records department and verify when a gun was shipped and confirm it left the factory as lets say being a factory second, duplicate serial number or special type gun. This service was free of charge. Ruger then later decided to charge 10.00 for each letter and most collectors do not have a problem with that but, it would be nice to be able to call and talk with a person to find out the information on a particular gun before the collector purchased it and confirm it is what it is and not a fake then decide to purchase or not a factory letter. And from what I have heard you can't even begin to get a letter from the factory if you pay for one or not. My opinion this is something Ruger really needs to examine and re-evaluate. It's all about customer service whether it be an old model gun or a brand new gun. A solution to this issue is maybe provide a copy of the records to the RCA and let us deal with the factory letters.
I have noticed within the last few years the quality has really suffered. I recently received 3 Ruger Lite's that the rear sight blade is broke in half and actually the broken piece is in the bag with the gun. I have also had several guns; blued 22/45's and single action revolvers that the front sight has rust on it and just received a 10/22 takedown NRA edition that the fiber optic rear sight keeps falling out. I understand good help is hard to find and when I talked with Mr. Fifer on some of these issues his explanation was is that he has hired everyone he could within a 50 to 60 mile radius that is not a drug abuser or convicted felon. I am sure you are aware that when rate goes up it most cases quality will suffer. I have seen this even in the company I work for. In addition people know me as a Ruger collector and often think I work for the company. They bring guns to me with issues and I continually help them by giving them the information of who to call at Ruger or where to mail it for repair. Most of these guns I never sold in the first place, but its all about customer service, Right?
The last question is what is going on with the subscription gun program. I have had several other subscription holders ask me if I have heard anything. I know when I last touched base with Mr. Fifer and Mr. Murphy who are also subscription gun holders there was never a strait answer. Rumor has it that the program is done with. I have also heard that the guns are held up in the warehouse and waiting to be shipped when things slow down for the company and another rumor is that the serial number range begins at 500 thus eliminating the low numbered guns. We holders have never received any formal information regarding this, like I stated it's all been rumors. Just for argument there are guns I would have never purchased if it was not for that program. Two guns I can use as example are the SR22 rifle and the Scout rifle. The way I see it is that these are guaranteed sales and even though the program may not be a very profitable program it is a small price for Ruger to pay to reward those who have supported and helped Ruger prosper in all its years of business. As a dealer at times I have used those guns for display and taken orders from my customers, my opinion a small price for marketing. Another solution maybe just charge a $20.00 processing fee for the labor to cover the cost. This is something Ruger leadership needs to take a long look at and consider continuing this program.
Sad to say but when the SR was dropped from the logo and Sturm, Ruger Corporation went to the hard R the company seems to care most about the share holders and how high they can get the stocks and dividends. Corporate greed and money seems to have taken over. In talking with some other collectors feel that we have been pushed off to the side. It certainly is not the company we knew loved in the past. I often ask myself what happened to the loyalty. The last couple years when the guns (Ruger's) were hard to get I could have purchased other brands just to have inventory but I chose to stay loyal to Ruger and only purchase Ruger firearms.
In closing I am not sure who makes a lot of the decisions at Ruger whether it is Mr. Fifer or the Board of Directors, but if they have to make an executive decision and continue not fulfill the promotional sales packages that were started, the factory letters and discontinue the subscription guns program then I guess I need to make and executive decision about my business and broaden my sales and start carrying Glock, Springfield Armory, Tauras, Smith and Wesson and other manufactures.
Again Tim for your fast response and concerns about the issues I had brought to attention. Your one of the best sales representatives I have ever dealt with and hopefully we can continue to have a great business relationship. Please take this information to Mr. Fifer and the Board of Directors and maybe we can together resolve some of these issues that concern me and other Ruger dealers and collectors. I hope some of these issues I bring up don't fall on deaf ears. If you have any questions about what I have written please feel free to contact me. Again thank you for your time and understanding.
Best Regards:
Rick Verzal
[email protected]
contender
Ruger Guru
Well put together Rick.
I do hope that you, and maybe the rest of us can get answers to a lot of what you asked.
You do make a lot of valid points.
I do hope that you, and maybe the rest of us can get answers to a lot of what you asked.
You do make a lot of valid points.
ubme
Bearcat
Well written Rick
RPM Enterprises
Buckeye
Thanks Words can be greater than a sword.
Words can be greater than a sword.circlergrugers
Vaquero
Rick, way to go! excellent, Hank
radicalrod
Hunter
RPM Enterprises said:Thanks
BUT they might pay attention if you used a "SWORD" :!: :!: :!:
I don't think WBR embraced the collectors all that much....
I think his son in law Steve Vogel was the driving for the factory and the RCA connection...
When Mr Vogel passed it seems things were never the same....
I was not involved then so this is only my own thoughts.....But look at the old Journals and see what an RCA meeting looked like then compare to now....AMAZING difference....YMMV....RR
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