Stolen valor

[vito]

I served for 24 years on active duty in the U.S. Army, including a year in Vietnam from 1970-71. I wasn't a combat soldier but was part of the medical services that took care of our troops when wounded or ill . It was a rough year for me, having to leave two weeks after my daughter was born, and leaving my young wife, whose mother had just passed on, to deal alone with a new baby and a two year old son. But I did my duty and then moved on. I recently have read that of the many who served in that war, only about 850,000 of us are still around. Yet surveys show that about 5 times that number claim to be Vietnam veterans. That means that 4 of 5 who claim to be such veterans are lying, and are guilty of stolen valor. Maybe it shouldn't matter to me since I know what I did and who I was, but it does bother me. So much of the country was against that war. Many did everything that they could to avoid having to serve, or served in a manner which "protected" them from having to possibly go to Vietnam. And some even fled the country. Yet now, apparently, many of these men in the 60's and older, falsely claim to be among those that actually went to that far off country on the orders of our government.

Its not too often that I encounter someone who tells me that they are a Vietnam Vet. But when that happens, I no longer just accept what they have said. I feel compelled to question them about where they served, with what service and unit, and I try to get a feel for whether or not I believe them. It certainly is not a hard thing to fake if someone takes even a bit of effort to prepare their lies, but it seems that some who practice "stolen valor" don't even bother to go to that effort.

Just on my mind this snowy winter morning.

 

[87flht]

I never did serve but I have never met a stranger that was not a crew chief . a pilot , a seal or some sort of special forces

 

[Tenbore]

Many who served were Vietnam "era" vets who might have served in Europe or other places at the time. Some just leave off the "Era" part to make themselves more look more, (I don't know what word to use), important?

 

[Mobuck]

^^ Not all 1960-1970 military Veterans were in VN.
I had an employee who was a Navy vet and had been on two 'cruises' to SE Asia theater. According to him other than being away from family and the constant noise, it was a better life than stateside or the North Atlantic.

 

[vito]

There is no shame in having been a veteran who did not serve in Vietnam itself. The military assigned people where they were needed. The only shame is in lying about their military service. I had a friend, a physician, who was with the Air Force and served as a Flight Surgeon based in Thailand during the Vietnam War. Every month he would go on a single B52 bombing run over Vietnam, for which he would then be entitled to both his "flight" pay and for the tax exemption offered for officers who were serving in Vietnam. I don't begrudge him any of that; he did what the service needed him to do and enjoyed the benefits of that role.

For a short time I was a member of two different Vietnam veterans organizations. One was for those who served during the Vietnam War era, and one was limited to those who had served "in country". Both included good people who did their duty to the nation. Personally I never felt particularly comfortable in these groups and didn't stay active for long.

 

[Kevin]

I've never served in the military, and being born in 1969, wouldn't have been in Vietnam at all. But I've found that people who did serve in Vietnam don't really like to brag about it. Right now, the contractor who is building our house was a Vietnam Vet. He's mentioned it a couple times, but I don't really ask him any questions. I get the feeling he doesn't want to talk about it too much. I think he did something with airplanes. Perhaps I will ask the next time he brings it up. He's a pretty good guy. I think around 75 years old or so.

On a side note. We have been watching the Mad Men TV series. They were at a Memorial Day BBQ and had all the Vets stand up and be acknowledged. They had one vet who was a Rough Rider. The show is set in the early 1960's. And this was an old guy. It really made me stop and think, that back then there were Vets from before WWII. And in thinking about that, during WWII, there could have been Vets from the Civil War still around. Interesting.

 

[contender]

I understand where vito is coming from.

I'm a vet,, yet, I'm just post Vietnam. (1976-1979.) It took me a long time to even feel as if I was as worthy of things as my fellow combat vets. But I was encouraged by Miss Penny & other Vets to accept the fact I had served, no matter when or where. So, I do wear a US Army Veteran hat. Yet,, when meeting other vets or anybody who thinks I may be a Vietnam vet, I quickly state that I'm post Vietnam. I never want to take away from those who did serve there. My brother,, (2) tours in country. HE deserves the respect.

The most humble part is when I do talk to other Vietnam vets & tell them I was post Vietnam. So far,, ALL of them have been kind, and thanked me for serving, and accepting me for who I was.

Those who "claim" to have been a Vet, or whatever,, well, they'd steal money from their momma's.

 

[dweis]

I always find it sad that some guys have to pretend to be a veteran. It must be out of some sense of insufficiency or maybe they just want some undeserved attention. I have the unpleasant experience of meeting a person who claimed to be a Marine. I asked him when and in what unit he served. He replied that he had been in the 8th Marines, an infantry latch-up. Then I asked where he had been stationed. He said he had been in Marine Base San Diego. Then I knew he was a fake because 8th Marines were and are out of Camp Lejeune, NC. I just looked at him and said: You’re pathetic.

 

[turd]

Again, I would like to thank all who have served, in whatever branch or unit, and at whatever time. I am grateful for your service.

 

[dannyd]

^^ Not all 1960-1970 military Veterans were in VN.
I had an employee who was a Navy vet and had been on two 'cruises' to SE Asia theater. According to him other than being away from family and the constant noise, it was a better life than stateside or the North Atlantic.

He was in the Blue Water Navy No matter where you are; everyday is the same. Only time the Blue Water had almost as many casualties has other services was in World War 2 mostly because of the Kamikaze's.

 

[fiasconva]

I am one of those that served during the Vietnam war but never was sent over there. If asked when I served and if I was in Vietnam I always tell the truth. I don't need to lie and disrespect the ones that did serve. I did have orders to go over but they got canceled both times. Never did find out why.

 

[Colonialgirl]

I served 66-68 in the Army; Pneumonia gave me a "B" physical profile and kept me out of Vietnam. I DID serve 16 months in Korea and was there when the North took the USN Pueblo; Also a time when 20 infiltrators came down from the North to assassinate the South Korean President and the last was killed on the outskirts of Seoul. I was Hq, Hq Btry 38th Arty Bde (AD) on Osan AFB in the commo section. I'm proud to have served but DO NOT claim anything about Vietnam.

 

[gramps]

I never did serve but I have never met a stranger that was not a crew chief . a pilot , a seal or some sort of special forces

Or sniper!
gramps, who didn’t serve due to being in nursing school.

 

[dannyd]

I joined the Navy because of economics; 17 years old, no money and very little education. Clean place to sleep, good food and new clothes.

 

[Pps1980]

Many who served were Vietnam "era" vets who might have served in Europe or other places at the time. Some just leave off the "Era" part to make themselves more look more, (I don't know what word to use), important?

Can't tell you how often that was the case when I did residency at the VA. Bouy tender in Nantucket Sound 1970-71 and they are a "Vietnam Veteran". Heck I once heard one Vet telling another (I was outside eating my lunch on a nice day and overheard them) how to answer the questions to get PTSD status and the vet being coached said "But I never saw combat". The answer was that it didn't matter.

Service is service but some had riskier deployments than others.

 

[Fox Mike]

I have met a couple 'Nam vets' that I would love to see their 201 jacket and see just where they actually were stationed. This is like a PX warrior, that buys all sorts of awards and decorations, that were never earned.

 

[87flht]

Yes , thanks to all that served , there are no unimportant jobs in the military
I came from a military family and should have enlisted but that’s a story why I didn’t and as of now my only regret is not doing it

 

[eveled]

I stopped wearing bdu hats when someone thanked me for my service.

I was horrified to realize that was even a remote possibility that people thought that.

I tried to enlist, but my hearing kept me out.

Stolen valor is despicable.

 

[lipofsky]

To all the Veterans who have served and continue to serve, Thank You for your Service.

 

[Tenbore]

I served 9 years, 1980-1989 in the Army National Guard, and worked full time for the guard for a while (until the funding ran out). I was never activated, and the government does not consider Guardsmen to have any veterans status unless they were on active duty. The only benefit is for veterans home loan (after 6 years' service). My certificate says that I am Honorably discharged from the Armed Forces of the United States and the State of Oregon, but seem to be invisible in the eyes of the government. I do not need or want any government benefits, but it would be nice if those who gave up much of their time and always stood ready, to have a little more recognition.

Rant over.

 

[Fox Mike]

I served 9 years, 1980-1989 in the Army National Guard, and worked full time for the guard for a while (until the funding ran out). I was never activated, and the government does not consider Guardsmen to have any veterans status unless they were on active duty.

I was full time Army National Guard from '60 through '93. Obama signed into law that Guardsmen and Reservists that served 20 years or more a are honorably retired are considered veterans. My DD Form 2 (retired card) simply says "US ARMY RETIRED"

 

[Jeepnik]

Not sure if other services have it, but mine has a box that’s checked if you were in Southeast Asia.

 

[Ordguy]

I met a character who claimed to be a Special Forces sergeant. okay, cool; what E Grade I asked. His reply he didn't have no fkin E Grade he was a Sergeant. hmmm okay. Met others but not like him. Me, retired 55Z, & retired DAC.

 

[Dimitr]

Combatant or not, Thanks for your service.

 

[Dan in MI]

I too want to thank all who have and are serving.

I was a kid delivering newspapers during Vietnam. Even then it angered me how returning vets were being treated.

My only true regret is that I didn't serve. I tried, but the Amy recruiting process made me soooo mad (long story of a very long day) I just had them take me back home. Sadly, the Navy called the very next day and I was still way too mad and let them know where to go.

Regarding stolen valor. I was an FFL and guy I worked with had to have a Ruger MK-II 22/45 as soon as they came out. He proudly and loudly declared he was a former Ranger all the time. Not long after I gave him his new 22/45, and had to teach him EVERY ASPECT of how it functioned. Someone may prove me wrong, but I cannot believe a Ranger couldn't operate a 1911 based firearm.

 

[Johnny-Baseball]

I used to eat Saturday breakfast with a bunch of Corvette owners (all over 70, like me). Four of them were F-4 jockeys during Viet Nam, and one of them had been shot down and was a POW. He was awarded a silver star. I told him I never described myself as a Viet Nam veteran, having served on Mindanao, PI (1970-71) and northern Thailand (1972-73). As a seismic analyst I did NOT serve in a combat or combat support role. The POW told me, "You were in Thailand. Far as I'm concerned, you are a Viet Nam vet." When I asked why, he said "Virtually all of the Air Force members in the Viet Nam War were stationed in Thailand, yet they supported the war effort. I see no difference between you and what you did versus an airman who served in a support role for fliers - payroll clerks, supply personnel, cooks, etc. You were there, so in my (the POW"s) mind, you are a Viet Nam vet.

Then it dawned on me...the only people who SHOULD care whether I claimed to be a Viet Nam vet are those veterans who actually served in combat roles. If they accept me, that's all that matters.

To this day I do not describe myself as a Viet Nam vet. I simply disclose the years I served, and the countries in which I served. That's all that matters. Someone else can fill in the blanks however they choose.

 

[Johnnu2]

I belong to a shooting club/range (since 1990); most are Vets of some kind and many display and talk NAM often.
One of the senior members came up to me one day a few years ago and said: "I've known you almost 20 years and had no idea you were in the Navy." I told him "yes" spent my active duty in Virginia....
I don't know how he 'heard', but my service was so long ago, I never thought it important to mention or discuss. I never felt ashamed that I didn't go to war; I only felt (and still feel) truly BLESSED. Perhaps if I had endured combat, military service would still be foremost on my mind; thankfully, it's not.

J.

 

[Johnny-Baseball]

My father served on a destroyer in the Pacific from 1942 through war's end. He died from liver cancer in 2017, and was told of this disease about 4 months before his death. So he and I had time to revisit his Navy years. He said his ship rarely saw combat...his 1939 vintage destroyer's 5" guns were not as efficient to operate as destroyers launched in 1942 and thereafter. So dad said his ship typically was ordered to pick up downed fliers and similar duty. Yet, this month I finally received dad's WW II military records...records that show dad was awarded three bronze stars (but with no description of his actions that resulted in those awards). Dad never mentioned these awards and now I'll never know why. I think that his generation was raised to NOT brag about themselves, and let the records speak for themselves.

My eldest son will complete 20 years in the Army in November 2023. His first 8 years were as an enlisted man (helicopter maintainer) and the rest are as a Blackhawk pilot. His last 6 years as an enlisted man were with the Army's 160th SOAR - special operations aviation regiment. During his 160th years, he was deployed to Iraq three times and Afghanistan twice. (During his final months in the 160th, he was responsible for preparing helicopters that participated in the bin Laden mission in Pakistan - an effort that caused him to receive personal thanks and a handshake from POTUS and VPOTUS.) He also was deployed as a pilot to Afghanistan (with the 101st Airborne). I asked him if he ever was actually involved in combat during those deployments. His answer was "No. I rode as a door gunner on several 160th missions, but we never received enemy fire. And when piloting my Blackhawk we received ineffective ground fire - ineffective because we were flying at too high an altitude for ground fire to pose a threat.' So, my son doesn't believe any of the actions during his Army deployments should be described as "combat."

So, who has been in combat? My father and my son each provided a very narrow definition - narrow enough to exclude their personal experiences. But too many people are at the opposite extreme - Senator Richard (Da 'Nang Dick) Blumenthal comes to mind.

 

[vito]

Some volunteered to go to Vietnam, most, like myself, were sent there by the service. I have no problem at all with those that served anywhere, whether in Vietnam or CONUS or anywhere else. The worst offenders of "stolen valor" are those that never served at all but want to claim Viet vet status, and as others have stated, always as some combat experienced individual. The liars never claim to have been a truck driver in Danang, or a cook at Bien Hua or a medic at Phu Bai or anything like that.

 

[Big Old Boy]

If you were in country combat was all around you whether you got in a fire fighter or not I was in the engineers we didn’t go looking for trouble but sometimes it just happened to find us, many thanks to all that served. also for many of us non combat troops B40 rockets landing outside of our bunker was never a fun wake up alarm.