While shooting this morning, I spoke with a shooter who was, like me, shooting an SR45. He said that he was having failure to enter issues and had 150 rounds through it. I watched him for a few magazines of American Eagle FMJ and he had two failures on the first mag and one on the second. Both malfunctions were near the end of the 9 rounds loaded in his mags. Seemed like an experienced shooter and had good form. I asked him if I could try 2 of my 3 mags loaded with Speer Lawman TMJ in his gun. It chugged out all 18 without issue. By then he had loaded his 2 mags with American Eagle. Again, this time after the first round, he had one sitting partially on the ramp and the action open. He did the tap/rack and finished the mag. I asked him to shoot my gun and let me shoot his gun with 9 rounds of American Eagle. I had a failure to go into battery on the 3rd round. He emptied 2 mags through my SR45 (Speer) cleanly. Now I decided to swap ammo. My SR45 with my magazine and 9 rounds of American Eagle had 2 failures to go into battery. Anyone have issues with American Eagle 45acp? Hope not, I bought 200 rounds of it and it's at the bottom of my rotation in the ammo cans. When my SR45 was new I had a few failure to feed issues, but I don't remember what ammo. Seems strange both guns with different magazines would have failures on the same ammo while the Speer worked fine.
SR45...Ammo failure?
- Thread starter Conn AK
- Start date
Oldillini
Bearcat
I have run American Eagle FMJ through mine wiht no issues. So far loves everything I put in it.
much like the gas one puts in their car, same for ANY firearm, ,gun to gun ,may be "picky" may , may work , may NOT , you have to find and use the ammo that YOUR gun "likes", and works ALL the time...........
Cheesewhiz
Hunter
rugerguy said:
I wholeheartedly agree with this and will only add that after some serious quantities of ammo run through a semi-auto, it will normally become less balky when using weaker rounds.
snowdevil23
Bearcat
- Joined
- May 23, 2013
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That's funny that I had the same exact issue last weekend. With mine. Had about 100 rounds in gun prior to last week. Took it saturday and put 250 more rounds. Thru it. And still getting failure to feed issues. Using American beagle and pmc also and at least 1 failure per mag if not 2. (230g) Thought it was either mags or ammo Did shot also 100 rounds of pmc jhp at 185 grain thru my sr45 and my sr1911 with not even a hic-up. I'll try another type to see if it make a difference. Hope so. Don't want to send a gun back
Its funny how people spend $500 on a gun, a hundred or two on upgrades and accesories. And then use the cheapest and crappiest ammo on the planet earth .... as if it DOESN'T matter. Then they complain about groupsize and functionality issues.
Buy good ammo .... or better yet .... make your own and your problems will be over in most cases.
Its no wonder most people can't shoot well considering the garbage they run through their guns ....
REV
Buy good ammo .... or better yet .... make your own and your problems will be over in most cases.
Its no wonder most people can't shoot well considering the garbage they run through their guns ....
REV
snowdevil23
Bearcat
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- May 23, 2013
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unfortunately with the climate of ammo hourding by the feds, there is limited brands that stores are getting. here in ct theres not many places that are getting different brands. hoffmans guns , cabelas, dicks sports are all getting the same garbage..i would prefer remington , winchester, ect....so i dont prefer to shot garbage ammo thru any of my guns...
I have yet to have a failure in 700 rounds with my SR45. I have only been using my super generic 230 RNL reloads (5 grains Win231, Winchester LP primer), nothing special there.
Yeah, it's also funny when you can pay $200 for a used Sigma that has put thousands of rounds of cheap ammo through it without any issues. Or my SR9 that can shoot Wolf or American Eagle all day long.revhigh said:
I do enjoy. And you enjoy your superior ammo and "quality" handguns, sir. A lowly commoner, I enjoy hitting the target all day long @50 feet (even with Wolf ammo) or planking the steel plates with my SR9. I don't really care if the 3rd,4th and 7th round are touching on paper-but that's just me. I wouldn't lose sleep over it, my good man.
snowdevil23
Bearcat
- Joined
- May 23, 2013
- Messages
- 11
Like I said if I could of bought better ammo I absolutely would. But there wasnt It always makes me think about joining forums when I have to read opinions from people who have nothing to say except garbage Next time I need an opinion from anyone it won't be u rev. Been on this site just a few days and the b.s has started. Didn't take long Conn ak. Hope we find an answer having same issue with the new 1911. Both bought at the same time. But not enough rounds thru it yet
You can believe whatever you want. Clearly your inexperience in diagnosing a simple feeding and chambering issue show that you don't understand that the inconsistency in cheap ammo can cause these symptoms. Do you think for a minute that when you send a gun back to Ruger, that they use garbage $10 a box ammo to try to diagnose issues ? No ... They don't. The gun works flawlessly at Ruger, and then the customer gets the gun back, feeds it garbage, and the problem returns, leading the customer to think that Ruger didn't resolve the problem. News flash .... There never WAS a problem in most cases.
Read the SR22 threads .... Funny how almost all of them work OK with with CCI mini mags, but choke on junk 22 ammo.
If you know so much about what is BS and what isn't .... How come you're asking for help for such a basic issue ? The first thing anybody who knows anything about guns will tell you to resolve problems like these is ... 'try it with some quality ammo'.
I've only heard and seen about 5000 threads like these in the last 8 years or so ... But I'm sure you guys know more than the rest of us .... Which is why you're here asking these types of questions.
Good luck with your guns.
REV
Read the SR22 threads .... Funny how almost all of them work OK with with CCI mini mags, but choke on junk 22 ammo.
If you know so much about what is BS and what isn't .... How come you're asking for help for such a basic issue ? The first thing anybody who knows anything about guns will tell you to resolve problems like these is ... 'try it with some quality ammo'.
I've only heard and seen about 5000 threads like these in the last 8 years or so ... But I'm sure you guys know more than the rest of us .... Which is why you're here asking these types of questions.
Good luck with your guns.
REV
revhigh said:
I think you're overstating the importance of "quality" ammo. I had a Glock 20 that I bought with the express purpose of being able to use a quality brand, in this case Double Tap ammo. The gun wouldn't run on Double Tap, it ran on cheap, low power ammo. Sent it back to Glock. They returned it saying it ran just fine. I called and they said that they used the same low end Blazer aluminum for service checks that I used. Having a 10mm auto that won't run on full power ammo was a waste so I sold it. So, If a major manufacturer uses "cheapo" ammo, one would suggest it will work for others.
If you have such distaste for the new striker fired Rugers, why do you comment on this forum? My SR9C doesn't have but 400 rds through it but it hasn't choked on American Eagle, Blazer Brass or Hornady Critical Duty. Don
As the original poster of this thread, my only question was if other SR45 owners had issues with American Eagle because on the day in question 2 SR45s had issues with that brand and I have already purchased several boxes of said ammo, but haven't shot it yet. As the original poster, note that Speer Lawman TMJ ran fine. Note to the Rev, Speer Lawman TMJ was $5 less expensive a box when I bought it than the American Eagle FMJ I haven't shot yet- so by your logic I should have had problems with the Speer ammo because it, too, is "cheap" ammo big buck guys like you wouldn't even consider. I appreciate the response from Kevets and Oldillini. Hopefully the American Eagle issue was that particular box of ammo on that particular day. Snowdevil123, you pegged it. Every gun forum has a few mega posters who know everything, criticize everyone and change the thread with their own self-importance.
DonD said:
I didn't say you HAD to use nothing but quality ammo, I said that that would be the first step in analyzing a problem involving feeding and cycling. Many guns run just fine with the WWB level of ammo. It's unlikely that you would get optimum performance (group size) from the cheap ammo, though. I've NEVER seen Blazer, WWB, or other cheap ammo from a Walmart or Dicks yield the best results. Read any gun test. It's usually the premium ammo that yields the best results.
To be honest .... I have a distaste for pretty much ALL plastic guns. Ruger or not. The longer they're out, the worse and cheaper they seem to get. It's a race to the bottom lately with this new plastic junk. Look at the entire LC? Lineup. If you can handle one of these LC things and then say they're quality guns .... Well OK then .... We have nothing else to talk about ....
REV
Cheesewhiz
Hunter
I've seen about a hundred or so threads like this and the OP himself pointed to the Federal AE as the issue and as he later surmised, it could be a case were Federal had a bad run and he ended up with a bad box or more of this stuff. Factory range fodder ammunition in the last 5 or 6 years has gotten a bit hit and miss with quality and that goes to even the biggest manufacturers.
Most of us have seen pics of horrible looking WWB in various calibers, if they can't get the outside looking right, how do you think the inside is doing?
Federal Champion centerfire pistol ammo seems to have gotten the rep of being weak and it appears that is mostly true.
Remington UMC has been a bane with pistol shooters for a long time, it's loaded light and the flat nosed bullet used in 9mm presents feeding issues and also can end up into the rifling when chambered due to it's extended ogive.
It got to the point with me that the only ammo I could trust was Sellier & Bellot a good, inexpensive Czech made ammo. The problem, availability was and is an issue because I shoot a lot, I needed quantities and a source that stocked it always, that went away some time back. Before all this, I reloaded on a small scale with my friends equipment and two years ago I went out and bought my own press and now reload 100% of my centerfire pistol ammo.
I still test out some factory ammo, mostly off the wall stuff or something new from a known maker, I get asked to do this by people from time to time.
The answer isn't that you have to reload to get it right, on the first page I gave a good opinion as to a way to look at it. The OP hasn't stated his round total thru this gun so far but weaker ammo tends to cycle better after the gun has been fired a good bit 500 rounds or so. Many times ammo issue isn't solely an ammo issue, new shooters or those with poor technique will always have problems with borderline ammo as the grip and hold structure will allow the guns slide to loss momentum and either it will not extract and eject correctly or feed the next round in a timed fashion.
Beating up my friend Rev won't help anyone in solving their problems or getting good advice. I give good advice on here all the time, some choose to listen and some may not, some want to argue with me about something they know very little about and that only makes me laugh at them and lead them into a forum thread oblivion.
Most of us have seen pics of horrible looking WWB in various calibers, if they can't get the outside looking right, how do you think the inside is doing?
Federal Champion centerfire pistol ammo seems to have gotten the rep of being weak and it appears that is mostly true.
Remington UMC has been a bane with pistol shooters for a long time, it's loaded light and the flat nosed bullet used in 9mm presents feeding issues and also can end up into the rifling when chambered due to it's extended ogive.
It got to the point with me that the only ammo I could trust was Sellier & Bellot a good, inexpensive Czech made ammo. The problem, availability was and is an issue because I shoot a lot, I needed quantities and a source that stocked it always, that went away some time back. Before all this, I reloaded on a small scale with my friends equipment and two years ago I went out and bought my own press and now reload 100% of my centerfire pistol ammo.
I still test out some factory ammo, mostly off the wall stuff or something new from a known maker, I get asked to do this by people from time to time.
The answer isn't that you have to reload to get it right, on the first page I gave a good opinion as to a way to look at it. The OP hasn't stated his round total thru this gun so far but weaker ammo tends to cycle better after the gun has been fired a good bit 500 rounds or so. Many times ammo issue isn't solely an ammo issue, new shooters or those with poor technique will always have problems with borderline ammo as the grip and hold structure will allow the guns slide to loss momentum and either it will not extract and eject correctly or feed the next round in a timed fashion.
Beating up my friend Rev won't help anyone in solving their problems or getting good advice. I give good advice on here all the time, some choose to listen and some may not, some want to argue with me about something they know very little about and that only makes me laugh at them and lead them into a forum thread oblivion.
Cheesewhiz said:
That about sums it up Cheese. And rather than discussing a point, resort instead to personal attacks, which means only one thing .... They have nothing of substance to say about the matter.
That's OK though ... Doesn't bother me at all .... Like water off a duck's back. LOL !
The biggest issue in most cycling problems .... Is ammo INCONSISTENCY ...which can complicate the analysis of the problem, sometimes it's the first round in the mag .... Sometimes the third round in the mag. As you mentioned .... Add cheap ammo to a newbie gun owner, and more and more cheaply made firearms, and you have the ultimate recipe for solving what is in essence a moving target. It must drive poor Ruger nuts getting all these guns shipped back to them that run just fine with quality ammo. And believe me .... Ruger uses absolutely tier one ammo when they test fire these guns. It's the only way to eliminate the biggest variable in cycling issues .... Period.
Funny how I absolutely NEVER have any problems like this with metal guns and my reloaded ammo. They just run .... And have never been back to the factory once. Lets connect the dots ....
REV
Regarding ammo quality, here is a quote from a friend who was quite high up in Ruger's Prescott, AZ plant before retiring a few years ago. He says things might have changed but they do use "cheap" ammo as his comment reflects.
"For the .22s we mainly used Federal bulk pack as it was the most common bulk ammo out there. We didn't use Remington's 'Golden Bullet' because it was strictly made for sporting chambers and often wouldn't go completely into battery in the modified target chamber we put into the guns. We also used very little Winchester as their bulk ammo had a flat nose on it and it wasn't very conducive for use in a semi-auto. When we targeted a pistol for somebody, we used CCI 'Green Tag' as it was the most accurate .22 ammo we found for our pistols. I have no idea what Newport used in their 10/22s and Single Six revolvers. Those guns had sporting chambers.
For the centerfire semi-autos (9mm, .40 S&W, .45 ACP) we bought various low-end ammo as that's what most people shot. We changed off everytime we placed an order to make sure we had all bases covered. A lot of Win White Box, Federal American Eagle, Blue Hills remanufactured, Independence, Fiocchi, CCI Blazer, both alum and brass cased, etc, etc, etc. For targeting we used whatever service ammo was requested by the customer. We had virtually every make, type, bullet weight, etc. out there on hand. If nothing was specified, we used CCI Blazer alum case as it was extremely consistent and accurate in our 'P' series guns. During the design stage, all types of ammo were tested, but for production function firing, we used the cheap stuff just like our customers did."
Good reason to use inexpensive ammo in your gun for practice/plinking if it functions properly.
By the way, I'm not "newly registered" something crashed and the site didn't recognize me. Don
"For the .22s we mainly used Federal bulk pack as it was the most common bulk ammo out there. We didn't use Remington's 'Golden Bullet' because it was strictly made for sporting chambers and often wouldn't go completely into battery in the modified target chamber we put into the guns. We also used very little Winchester as their bulk ammo had a flat nose on it and it wasn't very conducive for use in a semi-auto. When we targeted a pistol for somebody, we used CCI 'Green Tag' as it was the most accurate .22 ammo we found for our pistols. I have no idea what Newport used in their 10/22s and Single Six revolvers. Those guns had sporting chambers.
For the centerfire semi-autos (9mm, .40 S&W, .45 ACP) we bought various low-end ammo as that's what most people shot. We changed off everytime we placed an order to make sure we had all bases covered. A lot of Win White Box, Federal American Eagle, Blue Hills remanufactured, Independence, Fiocchi, CCI Blazer, both alum and brass cased, etc, etc, etc. For targeting we used whatever service ammo was requested by the customer. We had virtually every make, type, bullet weight, etc. out there on hand. If nothing was specified, we used CCI Blazer alum case as it was extremely consistent and accurate in our 'P' series guns. During the design stage, all types of ammo were tested, but for production function firing, we used the cheap stuff just like our customers did."
Good reason to use inexpensive ammo in your gun for practice/plinking if it functions properly.
By the way, I'm not "newly registered" something crashed and the site didn't recognize me. Don
Hey Don,
Well ... That is certainly contrary to what people have reported that Ruger used after getting their guns returned to them recently. Even for the 1911 broken sight changes they were using premium ammo.
I'd be very interested to confirm that. I know when I returned a P series gun years ago, they used what was, at the time, about the most expensive ammo on the planet, it surprised the heck out of me.
I'd be very surprised if your friend was correct.
See the 4th page of the thread below ..... I don't see anything about WWB or Blazer aluminum in any of those posts .... Black Hills 230 FMJ is about $1 a round in boxes of 20, as shown in the second link. I'd say your source doesn't know what he's talking about, especially since he quotes Blazer Aluminum as the most consistent and (LOL) accurate ammo of all. That is just absurd ....
http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=140830&start=45
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/132874/black-hills-ammunition-45-acp-230-grain-full-metal-jacket-box-of-20
REV
Well ... That is certainly contrary to what people have reported that Ruger used after getting their guns returned to them recently. Even for the 1911 broken sight changes they were using premium ammo.
I'd be very interested to confirm that. I know when I returned a P series gun years ago, they used what was, at the time, about the most expensive ammo on the planet, it surprised the heck out of me.
I'd be very surprised if your friend was correct.
See the 4th page of the thread below ..... I don't see anything about WWB or Blazer aluminum in any of those posts .... Black Hills 230 FMJ is about $1 a round in boxes of 20, as shown in the second link. I'd say your source doesn't know what he's talking about, especially since he quotes Blazer Aluminum as the most consistent and (LOL) accurate ammo of all. That is just absurd ....
http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=140830&start=45
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/132874/black-hills-ammunition-45-acp-230-grain-full-metal-jacket-box-of-20
REV
Cheesewhiz
Hunter
I just took a picture of some factory WWB from a fresh box that a guy at the range gave to me this morning. The crimp on 9mm should be of course a taper crimp that just kisses the bullet. The 9mm Luger headspaces on the case mouth, so the case mouth needs to present an edge to chamber properly. As you can see these won't headspace at all and the overcrimp will make accuracy with these rounds impossible. Guys, there is some real crap ammo being made out there currently.
Here is one of my 9mm reloads, on the left, as you can see the case mouth is not overcrimped. I load most of my stuff to a higher end of the scale, that way it will function in just about any of my guns.
The one on the right is one of my .41 Action Express reloads, interesting round for sure.
Here is one of my 9mm reloads, on the left, as you can see the case mouth is not overcrimped. I load most of my stuff to a higher end of the scale, that way it will function in just about any of my guns.
The one on the right is one of my .41 Action Express reloads, interesting round for sure.
revhigh said:
You'd be surprise if he was correct? Among other things he was in charge of all customer service operations. He was also a designer for Bill Ruger back in the day. It certainly reflected what was going on when he was there. As he said, things could have changed but I doubt it would be to use a continual stream of significantly more expensive ammo when cheaper ammo sufficed. Don
Forget it, Don. You can't possibly be right. There is only one opinion in this thread. This thread will end up being 34 pages long. Sorry I started this thread. Again, thanks to the forum members who actually responded in any coherent and relevant way to my original question.
snowdevil23
Bearcat
- Joined
- May 23, 2013
- Messages
- 11
the issue can be garbage ammo , but i shot 3 different types . pmc 230 grain , eagle 230 grain , and the pmc 185 jhp. the only one that did not screw up was the 185 grain jhp..
