Replace BH captive base pin and lock?

[broknprism]

Can the captive cylinder base pin on a new BH be replaced with an old style removable pin? Granted you have to remove the ejector to get it off, but will it work?

Does anyone make a part that replaces the lock while supporting the hammer strut and spring -- an aftermarket part, like the shims that turn Colt Series 80s into Series 70s?

Thanks. Clearly I missed my era on the Blackhawks, since I'm trying to turn new stuff into old stuff.

 

[mhblaw]

Not sure what you mean by "captive" base pin, as I have severl NM and OM Blackhawks and the base pin is removable on all. Check out Belt Mountain Enterprises of Belgrade, MT. They make a lockable base pin for both Old and New model Blackhawks, blue and stainless. NM has the plunger and spring to hold the transfer bar. There are others as well, Bowen etc.

 

[broknprism]

My NM, made this year, has a base pin that does not come all the way out. It strikes the ejector button and stops, as if it is longer than there is room to move it outward. It has a round flange that butts up against the frame. The cylinder rolls out though, so the gun shop owner and I speculated that it's a new captive design, not intended to come out.

 

[flatgate]

Can the captive cylinder base pin on a new BH be replaced with an old style removable pin? Granted you have to remove the ejector to get it off, but will it work?

Does anyone make a part that replaces the lock while supporting the hammer strut and spring -- an aftermarket part, like the shims that turn Colt Series 80s into Series 70s?

Thanks. Clearly I missed my era on the Blackhawks, since I'm trying to turn new stuff into old stuff.

The only difference between the Old Model and New Model base pins is the spring loaded plunger that pushes the New Model's transfer bar to the rear so it doesn't hang up on the firing pin. The early Old Models had "non-collared" base pins that could be removed w/o removing the ejector assembly.

I don't think you'll find a "commercially available" replacement main spring seat that'll replace the lock. Liability and Lawyers!
The ingenious "gun tinkerer" will make his own......

flatgate

PS New stuff into old? Oh, yeah baby, been there/done that. Lots of my New Model shooters have half cock loading and retimed lockwork so the cylinder latch drops into the "leedes" to the latch slots on the cylinder. Voila! No cylinder ring! Slim trigger set to the rear of the trigger guard, as well.

Something old, something new. Blue and brass sure have class.....

 

[broknprism]

Judging from the rollmarks alone, those both look old. Did I miss an entire generation? I thought we went from address rollmark to full barrel warning to nothing at all. My NM is completely blank except under the barrel. Why didn't they resurrect the Sturm, Ruger address and just change the city? Have they no regard for tradition?

So tell me how you got a NM to load at half cock. And how you even got the half cock. My NM had a pristine cylinder two days ago, but it's already showing a line. I tried polishing the bolt, but I guess metal rubbing on metal is going to do something. So yeah, my timing is off.

 

[Aggie01]

The Belt Mountain No 5 base pins for the large frame Rugers can be removed without removing the ERH.
I'm a fan - IMO, they excel in fit, form, AND function.

 

[broknprism]

The Belt Mountain No 5 base pins for the large frame Rugers can be removed without removing the ERH.
I'm a fan - IMO, they excel in fit, form, AND function.

I'm sure any 'normal' base pin could be removed without removing the ERH. They all used to do that. I was saying that Ruger has done soemthing different -- made it longer so it can't be removed without taking off the ERH. I would have been happy with the old style pin that comes out to get the cylinder off. Unless there's something I'm missing (and that could be a lot -- it's a whole new Ruger world for me at the moment, and my very first gun was a brand new Security Six in 1978) I would assume an old style pin would work in this NM, but the ERH would have to come off once to get the current pin out.

Why in the heck did they do that, anyway? Was there a rash of cylinder pins disappearing when cleaning, so they made the thing harder to lose...?

 

[Swampman]

Why take them out?

 

[contender]

By making them a bit longer, and adding the tip required for the transfer bar, it makes totally removing them unnecessary. Besides, if you remove them completely, you can lose them.

 

[flatgate]

Judging from the rollmarks alone, those both look old. Did I miss an entire generation? I thought we went from address rollmark to full barrel warning to nothing at all. My NM is completely blank except under the barrel. Why didn't they resurrect the Sturm, Ruger address and just change the city? Have they no regard for tradition?

So tell me how you got a NM to load at half cock. And how you even got the half cock. My NM had a pristine cylinder two days ago, but it's already showing a line. I tried polishing the bolt, but I guess metal rubbing on metal is going to do something. So yeah, my timing is off.

One is an Old Model/Three Screw. The other is a New Model marked "Made in the 200th Year of American Liberty".

Half Cock on a New Model? Easy. Just weld up the hammer with enough material to cut in a half cock notch. You'll have to slim down the trigger's sear section so it'll fit into the half cock notch. Getting the timing just right is the crux. Cylinder "ringing" is cured via welding on the NM's cylinder latch "leg". Extend the length of the leg so it delays the dropping of the latch until the lead in section of the "bolt cut" is under the latch.

flatgate

PS Ron Powers/Powers Custom makes some of these parts, as well.

PPS I would imagine SR&Co. just "cringes" when they see "what fools we Mortals be"!

 

[rugerguy]

Just shorten the one in the gun to allow it to "clear"..they made 'em longer so YOU wouldn't lose it if it fell out during its 'use' ,saying hunting in the woods?? whatever.......they do fall out and at the 'wrong' time, thus Belt Mountains work........me' I leave it alone, but we have polished and shortened them for others over the years.......

 

[broknprism]

The big flange is a new thing. I had an OM a few days ago, and the pin on that was just a pin. I like that style. Why would I mess with a design that was intended to help me not lose the pin? Old school appeal, that's all. Guess I can look for an OM, or an earlier NM.

So nobody makes an aftermarket part to replace the lock? Whoever made the shim that defeated the Colt Series 80 firing pin block did it openly and without apologies, marketing the thing commercially. I saw a pic of something someone here made that supported the strut and spring without the lock. I'd like to find that guy and make an 'inquiry' because I don't have the tools.

 

[Hondo44]

The big flange is a new thing. I had an OM a few days ago, and the pin on that was just a pin. I like that style. Why would I mess with a design that was intended to help me not lose the pin? Old school appeal, that's all. Guess I can look for an OM, or an earlier NM.

So nobody makes an aftermarket part to replace the lock? Whoever made the shim that defeated the Colt Series 80 firing pin block did it openly and without apologies, marketing the thing commercially. I saw a pic of something someone here made that supported the strut and spring without the lock. I'd like to find that guy and make an 'inquiry' because I don't have the tools.

I make this titanium spring perch to eliminate lock (shown on my Montado).

I shortened my collared pin to the 1st groove and rounded the end while chucked up in a drill press. It can be removed with ERH in place:

 

[Hondo44]

Can the captive cylinder base pin on a new BH be replaced with an old style removable pin? Granted you have to remove the ejector to get it off, but will it work?

Thanks. Clearly I missed my era on the Blackhawks, since I'm trying to turn new stuff into old stuff.

The only Ruger pin long enough for the New Model large frames came on the earliest of the old model flat top 44 Mag. but it won't work in a new model because it doesn't have the plunger in the rear to keep the transfer bar from hanging up on the firing pin when cocking the hammer. Belt Mtn makes an excellent Colt style pin that works in new models and can be removed.

Here's one on a New Vaq: