Red Eagle found

[martyj]

I got this from a guy in WI and I don't usually buy sight unseen but it turned out good this time.
By My standards it was fairly inexpensive too. Serial #0256
Even had the correct mag. Now need to find a grip medallion for it.

Copy the IMG code link over on the right side of the page and paste it here instead of the page's URL. flatgate

 

[rugerguy]

nice one, don't forget to replace that front sight blade, they're still the same, the early ones were just a bit "cruder"???
good find, tough to get ones hands on any of them REAL low numbers......
the early 'two-piece' medallions will be about impossible to locate, most likely have to find another set of the early grips and swap 'em out....you can find some "beater" grips from time to time, but alas, if 'beat' that bad, those medallions break off real easy, as the do stick up, above the grips surface,not 'set in' like the later ,one piece medallions..........

 

[SteveRuger]

Great find! Trying to find those in better condition is real hard since they were made in 1949-50 for $37.50 & most everyone bought it to use! J/S

 

[radicalrod]

Hey that looks GOOD compared to the way 0265 looked when I "rescued" it.... good find that needed a good home :lol: :lol: :lol: see ya RR.

 

[seeemmiss]

Hey Rod, what about #187 red eagle? You still got that one? If I remember correctly, it was in need of lots of TLC.

Jody

 

[radicalrod]

Jody, that was 0603 that we made a deal on in Nashville.....heck I think I talked you into buying it at the pawn shop for 150 or something like that and offered you a finders fee if you would sell it to me.....you decided to keep it......at the show you wanted to buy a cut down 10 inch 44 Ft from Bill H and that's when we did the deal on the RE....we both went home HAPPY :lol: :lol: :lol: and I am still happy, thanks again....RR.

 

[Ale-8(1)]

Neat old gun.

I believe I'd try shooting it before I replaced the front sight blade. It may have been filed down for a reason.

Or do we think this one's too old/rare to shoot? Concerns about the early design of bolt & firing pin?

 

[seeemmiss]

I guess you are correct Rod. It was too long ago. Maybe I paid $187 for it. Either way, I was very new to Ruger collecting and should have let Dan take it home as a project for me. Oh well, bet I can find another!!

Jody

 

[radicalrod]

Hey I bet you can TOO.....660 out there minus the 6 I have and a few others I know of.....leaves a few to be found 0603 lives with his brothers 0155, 0265, 0383, 0448, 0449, and 0552.....just need a 2 digit gun to end the hunt :roll: :roll: :roll: see ya RR.

 

[Three50seven]

Doesn't that rear sight look a bit odd? Or did the oldest ones have a thicker sight like that? My dad has #13870, and it has the normal thinner rear sight.

 

[chet15]

Doesn't that rear sight look a bit odd? Or did the oldest ones have a thicker sight like that? My dad has #13870, and it has the normal thinner rear sight.

All the early rear sights on the Red Eagle Standard were like that pictured, kinda like a Colt Ace rear sight, until about #12200 where they changed to the 1/2" dovetail type.
Chet15

 

[Ale-8(1)]

I repeat my previous question . . .

Considering the known shortcomings of the original bolt and firing pin design, should this old jewel be fired, or just cleanded up and displayed for its historical significance??

Yes, I know the old bits can be replaced with newer stuff, but that's another question.

 

[radicalrod]

Ale I say save em lots of cheap RST4's to use.....only the first 2k had the early bolt.....buy a later Red Eagle and blast away......JMO and it is worth exactly what you pay for it.....NOTHING :lol: :lol: :lol: see ya RR.

 

[SteveRuger]

I agree with RR!

 

[chet15]

Yep...don't shoot those early bolt guns. If you had a firing pin break, you could always make another one, but why go to the trouble.
Chet15

 

[street]

Yep...don't shoot those early bolt guns. If you had a firing pin break, you could always make another one, but why go to the trouble.
Chet15

I had the firing pins made for the bolts of two of the first model guns. They are not cheap, and the gunsmith said they are not easy to make. They needed to be hand fitting. The gunsmith used the firing pin out of Rugerguy's bolt as a pattern and he said the pin out of that bolt would not fit in either of my bolts. "THEY NEED TO BE HAND FITTED" I guess that was another reason that Ruger re-designed that bolt.

Shoot it if you like but if that pin breaks, you are in a lot of trouble. If you want to shoot it just use a later model bolt. After all that's what Ruger did when they received a 1st model gun with a broken firing pin. They replaced the complete bolt with a newer type bolt.

 

[T.A. WORKMAN]

This gun #2806 was in worse shape than yours.
Rugerguy did an outstanding job of restoring her, she sleeps
in a one piece hinged box. :wink: I do not shooter her, she's retired.

Terry

 

[martyj]

Nice looking gun TA wish all mine looked like yours. That is a type 1A I take it.
How bad does that hurt the collector value after they are restored?

 

[T.A. WORKMAN]

Nice looking gun TA wish all mine looked like yours. That is a type 1A I take it.
How bad does that hurt the collector value after they are restored?

It would definately affect (lower) its collector value to most collectors. I just decided to restore her and give her to one of my granddaughters to go with her Red Eagle Target gun. I did not have alot in the gun and Dan did an outstanding job. My buddy has a 95% Type IA and if you handled both guns you would not know which was restored. Big difference between restored and reblued IMHO.
I didn't retsore her to make money or trick anyone I just wanted it to look nice!!! :wink: :wink:
Terry

 

[chet15]

To me, refurbishing a gun makes them look nice, but collector value drops way off I.M.O. because to me is the same as having a gun with zero original blue, which would only be shooter grade and not put into a collection.
Of course, there are always those who would rather have a reblued example of something they need in their collection just to fill a hole, but resale later is absolutely horrible.
Then...for those that are reblued and done right (right color blue, no polishing/buffing issues...looks factory) I guarantee that not even two to three generations from now somebody will be peddling them as a factory finish. That is the slippery slope and I'd just as soon see Ruger collecting be unadulterated. Unfortunately there are already a lot of nice guns in well-meaning collections that have been redone, but purchased as factory. Guaranteed it will cause a lot of tough feelings down the road. Just glad I don't have to experience it.
To put this in perspective with another hobby, coin collecting, just ask a seasoned collector what he things about "cleaned" coins..to make them look like new. To me is the same difference rebluing a gun, the shooter value remains the same but it is completely lost its collectibility.
I look at it like this, if one has the patience and the $, if somebody wants to add a collectible Ruger variation to his collection, just have the patience to wait....there are a lot of 95%+ "ORIGINAL FINISH" guns out there, you just gotta get out and find them. In the long run, you will be glad you waited.
Chet15

 

[radicalrod]

So when an old Winchester is redone buy one of the BIG NAME restorers it is worth less than if it hadn't been touched.....how do those guys stay in business ???? Or is it just RUGERS that lose value....I DO realize that a 100 % untouched gun is worth more than a restored gun all being equal....BUT once again there is a lot of difference in the words RESTORED and REDONE or REBLUED.... I am with TA on this...I have a few RE's that Rugerguy has painstakingly RESTORED for me.....Dan did this as a favor to me AND the pistol ........why leave them in a state of disrepair with no real value....how can making them look original make them worth less.....an everyday model is not a candidate for a restoration but early numbered and or rare variations are another thing........of course if I happened upon # 15 Single Six I think I would leave it in it's beat up, well used shape....so there are considerations for everything.....nothing is ever clear cut :lol: :lol: :lol: JMO and once again it is worth what ya paid for it
see ya RR.

 

[chet15]

Yeah...Colt and Winchesters are different I guess from "their" perspective, I.M.O.
I don't have nearly the pucker factor those guys do for restored stuff.
And anyway, you should see all the near mint to mint Colts and Winchesters that were available in the old Shotgun News's I have from the 1950's and 1960's. That stuff is out there, its just salted way in expensive collections.
But can everybody tell the difference between a "restored" 1886 Winchester and one that has its original minty finish? Which one is worth more? So potentially one day Winchester collecting could possibly see more mint 1886 Winchesters for example than guns that are well used?
Just tough for me to see the fun in that (maybe I compare too much with coin collecting because most of the "GOOD" coins have been cleaned in some way to the point that there are very few that have been left in original condition).
Don't get me wrong, there are a few rare Rugers out there like guns with holes in topstraps, etc. that look much better with a plugged topstrap and good refinish. But hopefully my grandkids won't be in the Ruger collecting hobby a few decades from now with a wad of cash burning holes in their pockets for those Rugers which you can't tell.
J.M.H.O., but some of you guys are getting burned today by reblued stuff.
Chet15

 

[radicalrod]

Hey Chet, they aren't getting OLDER......JUST BETTER :lol: :lol: :lol: RR

 

[street]

I would rather have a very well done Factory re-blue or a Rugerguy restored gun in my collection then a 50% gun. But I would rather have a mint untouched example then either of the above.
This is the order I would like:
#1--- Untouched example in mint shape.
#2--- Factory re-blue or Rugerguy restoration.
#3---50% gun.


If you guys don't like a gun that's been re-blued, which means not original. How do you feel about a gun that has a box that is not original to the gun. :wink: That package is not factory original. Yes you can't tell the difference between boxes, but the bottom line, It's not original. If you don't like a gun that's been re-blued then you shouldn't have a box that's not original to the gun!!! :lol: :twisted: :lol:

 

[chet15]

I would rather have a very well done Factory re-blue or a Rugerguy restored gun in my collection then a 50% gun. But I would rather have a mint untouched example then either of the above.
This is the order I would like:
#1--- Untouched example in mint shape.
#2--- Factory re-blue or Rugerguy restoration.
#3---50% gun.


If you guys don't like a gun that's been re-blued, which means not original. How do you feel about a gun that has a box that is not original to the gun. :wink: That package is not factory original. Yes you can't tell the difference between boxes, but the bottom line, It's not original. If you don't like a gun that's been re-blued then you shouldn't have a box that's not original to the gun!!! :lol: :twisted: :lol:

Yeah, like taking an abused pair of grips or ejector housing with light pitting off a gun and putting the same type parts back on that are much nicer. Or replacing a boogered screw...same difference really, and one can't tell once its done. I know, is the same thing, but to me is much different than putting a "non-original" finish back on a gun, and that is the key to me anyway.
As to boxes, there are so many that have been separated from their guns that I don't think there are too many collectors that care one way or the other whether the box has the original numbers on the gun or not, at least there doesn't seem to be any price differential with collectors between guns with original box and guns with original "type" box.
But one day...somebody will start printing OM Ruger SA boxes, and lets all hope they will be somehow different than the originals.
So to me a reprinted box would be the same as a reblued gun, with neither being "original era production"
Chet15

 

[martyj]

If you guys don't like a gun that's been re-blued, which means not original. How do you feel about a gun that has a box that is not original to the gun. :wink: That package is not factory original. Yes you can't tell the difference between boxes, but the bottom line, It's not original. If you don't like a gun that's been re-blued then you shouldn't have a box that's not original to the gun!!!

Very good point! Never thought of it that way before.
Its all on how you perceive it I guess. A shinny firearm doesn't necessarily shoot better than a rusty one.
I myself never figured out why most people prefer a 3 digit single six over a red eagle when if it wasn't for the success of the red eagle the single six would of never came into existence.

 

[street]

Yea! We collectors are a strange bunch. We will accept replaced parts different grips, different boxes and paperwork the same as if those parts were the original parts that came with the gun. But come Hell or high water a re-blued gun is only good for a boat anchor. It's got to be something wrong with us gun collectors and the way that we think. :roll:

 

[HAWKEYE#28]

Yea! We collectors are a strange bunch. We will accept replaced parts different grips, different boxes and paperwork the same as if those parts were the original parts that came with the gun. But come Hell or high water a re-blued gun is only good for a boat anchor. It's got to be something wrong with us gun collectors and the way that we think. :roll:

Yes, however, a rust bucket of a GTO(as an example; many others apply) can be off frame restored using all NOS parts and be worth just as much, if not more, than an original survivor.......Still haven't figured out that reverse "logic". :?
Second, one of my Friends and sometimes "Critic", notes that "something"(like3 a Ruger OM) well/superbly done(reworked, re-done, parts[un-numbered] and/or boxes replaced, ) is "just one owner or generation from factory original/minty"........" Ala, silence is golden....Pays to be very careful, questioning and always observant, BEFORE reeaching into your pocket for the $'s. 8) And Yes, I know who the SILENT re-workers are, or at least, SOME of them...... :roll:

 

[T.A. WORKMAN]

I truly believe that a Ruger factory re-blue, or a professionaly Restored
gun deserves to be rated at 80% not 60%. Its not in the collector class of
95% or better but its damm sure one at the top of the shooter class.

The future of our hobby rests in the hands of the young collectors on this site and others. It is they who will establish values and prices paid and hopefuly they will revisit this issue. I fully understand and appreciate the Purist concept of as close to 100% as possible, but like grandma used to say "Theres more than one plate on the table"

Old Cars, Guns (Colt Win,Purdy, LC Smith etc), Antique Furniture, Documents etc. in poor condition and restored Increase in Value ???
Would you rather see an old gun Restored or parted out???? Once a
gun is parted out it is gone! A Restored gun remains as an example of what a gun of that era looked like.

My gun was lucky if you rated it 50% (grips were very good) and the guy I got it off of had it for sale for $300.00 and no takers (months), I bought it for $250.00. The grips alone are worth more than I paid for the gun so
I could justify having Dan Restore it. All Dans work is done by hand with a carefull eye to detail (lettering & numbers) with as close to an original finish as possible with all original parts. If I would have sent the gun to Ruger they would have changed out some parts I'm sure and used machines to prep the gun and the blueing would be whats currently used.

I have always been up front on this gun and as stated Its not for sale. To
me it is a Beautifully Restored 1950 example of a Type IA Red Eagle,Auto Pistol which launched the Ruger Firearms Company that we all enjoy today.
JMHO!
Terry

 

[HAWKEYE#28]

Terry, I like and enjoy your style and logic 8)