Rechambering Previously Chambered Rounds - Safe?

[NixieTube]

Compared to a lot of the people here at Rugerforum I'm still very much a newbie when it comes to pistols, particularly semiautomatic pistols like my SR9 and my S&W4040PD. The other day I read something that concerned me even though I should have thought of it before:

If you load and unload your semiauto fairly regularly using the same bullets without firing them, how much of a concern is it that the act of rechambering the same rounds can cause the bullets to be gradually rammed toward the primer, causing an an overpressure condition or some other dimension related malfunction?

I ask because I normally keep my SR9 loaded and chambered, but in the fullness of time as a result I've rechambered some rounds a few times. I've never had a problem with anything, but I'd like to hear people's opinions/recommendations.

After I thought about it, I decided to make a conscious effort to avoid rechambering rounds more than once, if possible. What do you all think? Ever heard of anything bad happening? What kind of ammo., etc?

 

[Cheesewhiz]

A round loaded in a semi-auto is whipped into the chamber and could (probably will) set back the bullet to an extent. If this happens more then once you could end up with over pressure and that's not good. Auto pistol rounds, for the most part, only have a taper crimp, so they are prone to this issue.

 

[45flattop]

+1 what Cheezewhiz said, I've had that happen with several P90s
and with several 1911A1 clones too, just about the only one that
didn't was a custom Les Baer 1911 with a very well polished and
throated barrel feed ramp. So to prevent setback, I usually swap
out the round on top of the magazine before it has a chance to be
setback.

 

[kstoneking]

When I carried a gun in the course of business (police offficer) I was concerned enough to not re-use the oft-chambered first round. I would put them aside for later range use and replace them with a fresh round. It may have been overkill or me being a little anal but I felt better doing it that way.

Kenny

 

[blume357]

It must depend on how many times you do it then... because I have rechambered rounds many times in both my Sig and Ruger P95 and have yet to have a problem with the first shot.

 

[HIP SHOT]

When I took my Glock armorers course the instructor told us of a story out of Florida. Apparently a police officer was removing and reloading the same cartridge out of his gun for a couple of years. When he actually had to use his gun in the line of duty it only fired once. The rim of the 40SW had worn away and didn’t extract under the live fire forces. He had a one shot gun. Fortunately all he needed was the one round.

The technique he used to load the gun was to lock the slide open and insert the round directly into the chamber. He then dropped the slide and the extractor would have to "climb" over the rim each time. Not a good idea.

Hip Shot

 

[martinj001]

^^More proof that just because police officers carry a gun every day doesn't mean they're any good/knowledgeable about them. That annoys me. I've had LEO's tell me before that I shoot more than they do. IMO, there's something wrong with that situation... [/rant]

I've never had an issue myself. That being said, I've never left the same ammo in a magazine/gun for over a few months at a time--it all gets cycled through eventually.

 

[revhigh]

The technique he used to load the gun was to lock the slide open and insert the round directly into the chamber. He then dropped the slide and the extractor would have to "climb" over the rim each time. Not a good idea.

Hip Shot

So you're saying that the round went into the chamber in exactly the same position each time, thus causing the brass to wear away over the years in the exact same place ?

I aint buying that at all .... I'm not doubting you .... I'm doubting the story itself ...

I've never worried about rechambering a round and never had an issue because of it. Any round where the bullet can be pushed farther into the case from the action of the slide wasn't loaded properly ...


REV

 

[rugerguy]

if you load the "same" round into the chamber first, then drop the slide,the extractor can and maybe eventually makes its way
full circle, against the entire rim, round off the case rim, all the way around....yes, will take time and we too have seen this anomoly...NOT the way to chamber any gun.for a multitude of reasons......
but to answer the first question, unless you actually "see" the bullet got "pushed back" into the case, there should not be any problem, as noted above, if in ANY doubt do like they do, and alternate,use a 'fresh" round if it makes YOU feel better.......
bottom line, I would be MORE concerned with the "rim issue", than a
"pressure" issue..........enjoy, practice, practice, practice and always
safety first......................... :wink:

 

[Cheesewhiz]

The technique he used to load the gun was to lock the slide open and insert the round directly into the chamber. He then dropped the slide and the extractor would have to "climb" over the rim each time. Not a good idea.

Hip Shot

So you're saying that the round went into the chamber in exactly the same position each time, thus causing the brass to wear away over the years in the exact same place ?

I aint buying that at all .... I'm not doubting you .... I'm doubting the story itself ...

I've never worried about rechambering a round and never had an issue because of it. Any round where the bullet can be pushed farther into the case from the action of the slide wasn't loaded properly ...


REV

Rev, I won't get involved with the multiple rim hits part but you are a reloader so this one will be easy for you. Load a couple of dummies (no powder, no primer), check the length with a vernier and then cycle them thru a couple of different guns and see if the length has changed. I think you will be very surprised.

 

[revhigh]

The technique he used to load the gun was to lock the slide open and insert the round directly into the chamber. He then dropped the slide and the extractor would have to "climb" over the rim each time. Not a good idea.

Hip Shot

So you're saying that the round went into the chamber in exactly the same position each time, thus causing the brass to wear away over the years in the exact same place ?

I aint buying that at all .... I'm not doubting you .... I'm doubting the story itself ...

I've never worried about rechambering a round and never had an issue because of it. Any round where the bullet can be pushed farther into the case from the action of the slide wasn't loaded properly ...


REV

Rev, I won't get involved with the multiple rim hits part but you are a reloader so this one will be easy for you. Load a couple of dummies (no powder, no primer), check the length with a vernier and then cycle them thru a couple of different guns and see if the length has changed. I think you will be very surprised.

I doubt it Cheese !! When I'm reloading I ALWAYS take finished rounds and put them nose down on the table and press as hard as I can on them. I've NEVER seen a bullet move in my life, at least not the way I crimp them. Now I'm not saying that they won't change a thousandth or two, but that wouldn't matter in the scheme of things anyway from an overpressure point of view.

REV

 

[terryg]

Hmm. I say we should simply be going to the range often enough that this is not a real problem at all. :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

 

[resident]

Factory auto-piston ammo is lacquered at the bullet/case during assembly so the bullet will not be dislodged during chambering...no matter how many times it's done.
REloads are probably not, and may also suffer from less "grip" on brass that was resized.
Why would anyone chamber the same round time and time again, anyway? If you want to practice chambering rounds, then I suggest you use a dummy, not a live round....for LOTS of reasons, but bullet set-back is not the main one. :roll:

 

[HIP SHOT]

The technique he used to load the gun was to lock the slide open and insert the round directly into the chamber. He then dropped the slide and the extractor would have to "climb" over the rim each time. Not a good idea.

Hip Shot

So you're saying that the round went into the chamber in exactly the same position each time, thus causing the brass to wear away over the years in the exact same place ?

I aint buying that at all .... I'm not doubting you .... I'm doubting the story itself ...

I've never worried about rechambering a round and never had an issue because of it. Any round where the bullet can be pushed farther into the case from the action of the slide wasn't loaded properly ...


REV

The same round had been inserted and extracted for a couple of years using the technique I described above. The entire rim was worn - not enough to prevent a manual extraction but extraction under the violence of recoil. The extractor didnt have enough purchase to do its job.

The class I attended was with about 50 sworn officers. The instructor has been with Glock since they started training in the US.

I didnt include the story about his partner who didnt carry a round in the chamber due to his "fear" of the gun. They both transitioned from revolvers directly to the Glock. Needless to say, the partner, tried to fire a gun with an empty chamber at the suspect.

Hip Shot

 

[revhigh]

The technique he used to load the gun was to lock the slide open and insert the round directly into the chamber. He then dropped the slide and the extractor would have to "climb" over the rim each time. Not a good idea.

Hip Shot

So you're saying that the round went into the chamber in exactly the same position each time, thus causing the brass to wear away over the years in the exact same place ?

I aint buying that at all .... I'm not doubting you .... I'm doubting the story itself ...

I've never worried about rechambering a round and never had an issue because of it. Any round where the bullet can be pushed farther into the case from the action of the slide wasn't loaded properly ...


REV

The same round had been inserted and extracted for a couple of years using the technique I described above. The entire rim was worn - not enough to prevent a manual extraction but extraction under the violence of recoil. The extractor didnt have enough purchase to do its job.

The class I attended was with about 50 sworn officers. The instructor has been with Glock since they started training in the US.

I didnt include the story about his partner who didnt carry a round in the chamber due to his "fear" of the gun. They both transitioned from revolvers directly to the Glock. Needless to say, the partner, tried to fire a gun with an empty chamber at the suspect.

Hip Shot

Real smart guys !!!

REV

 

[HIP SHOT]

Real smart guys !!!



I completely attribute it to training. This department should have a SOP that everyone follows.

I routinely rotate my carry ammo thru my guns. I shoot up the old and purchase new. A small price to pay.

Hip Shot

 

[resident]

[...The class I attended was with about 50 sworn officers. ...I didnt include the story about his partner who didnt carry a round in the chamber due to his "fear" of the gun. ..., the partner, tried to fire a gun with an empty chamber at the suspect. Hip Shot

Proof again that just because someone is a cop doesn't mean they're not stoopidly incompetent.
- resident, EX-Belton PD by choice.

 

[Pinecone]

As long as the round is "crimped" properly, either factory or reload, I have never seen a bullet pushed into the cartridge case when loaded into a spec chamber. I have seen reloads pushed into cases that were "not" crimped properly. As far as .22 LR ammo is concerned, I have been taking the cartridge out of chambers for well over 40 years and putting them back into the top slot of magazines and have never had one pushed into it's case. In fact I do this "daily" with my 10/22 as I shoot red squirrels around my place all the time and do not put the gun back in the safe with a chambered round!..........................Dick :wink:

 

[Kanook]

As far as .22 LR ammo is concerned, I have been taking the cartridge out of chambers for well over 40 years and putting them back into the top slot of magazines and have never had one pushed into it's case. In fact I do this "daily" with my 10/22 as I shoot red squirrels around my place all the time and do not put the gun back in the safe with a chambered round!

The 22LR uses a "heeled" bullet. (not sure on spelling)

It would take a bunch of force to make it compress into the casing.

 

[NixieTube]

Thanks for all the replies as well as the inadvertent (and advertent) humor. I believe that story about the cop with the Glock, it makes sense and even if it never actually happened it still makes sense. Brass is soft, the extractor is relatively hard, and nobody should think they can keep rechambering the same round without something bad eventually happening. If you're reloading your own rounds, you're going to pay extra attention to the condition of the brass and discard the bad ones, but someone just dropping a round back into the chamber repeatedly might not.

Thinking about good practice with my pistols means learning about what other people's experience of good practice is. Once again, I've gotten good information and food for thought here; part of the reason I asked the question is that not only am I a relative newbie, there seem to be a lot of people posting here recently who are too. It's good when you're new to be safe and not sorry. The idea of potentially causing problems by repeatedly rechambering the same bullet might not occur to them - it didn't occur to me until after I read about it, and now I also know that the proper term is "set back."

Thanks again.

 

[blume357]

The problem with the story about the Cop wid de Glock is it is ONE instance... it's kind of like a different thread I read this morning... some guy in PA who was refused a State carry permit and got one from Florida then foolishly shooting a vandal.... point being one instance of a permitted carrier doing something stupid should not be grounds to change the world or the laws... Same with this discussion about repeatedly chambering the same round.....

 

[Mike J]

I have found bullet setback in a round that had been chambered multiple times. I usually only unload my carry ammo if I go to the range. I try to rotate the one I took out of the chamber to the bottom of the magazine. If I think the whole magazine has been through this twice I shoot them. I believe this is more an issue with 9mm or .40 as they operate at higher pressure than .45.

 

[NixieTube]

The problem with the story about the Cop wid de Glock is it is ONE instance... it's kind of like a different thread I read this morning... some guy in PA who was refused a State carry permit and got one from Florida then foolishly shooting a vandal.... point being one instance of a permitted carrier doing something stupid should not be grounds to change the world or the laws... Same with this discussion about repeatedly chambering the same round.....

Believe me, I don't want to change the world or the laws, at least not based on this thread . I just asked the question because compared to a lot of people here, I haven't fired that many rounds through my semiauto pistols, I don't (currently) reload my ammo., and I haven't competed (yet) with the gun, and I'm not a LEO or in the military, so I had no idea how big or small a concern it really was. I've fired about 2,000 rounds through 2 semiauto pistols of 2 different calibers in about 1 year, and there are probably people here who have fired 200,000 rounds through 20 different pistols of 10 different calibers in 20 years or more. Those were the people I was hoping would help answer my question.

I think I've gotten a good answer here - no law changes or world-alteration needed.

 

[Cholo]

I've done it many times when I unload a pistol for whatever reason. I always put the round that was in the chamber back in the chamber when I reload. I'll have to check if there's any setback. I never really thought about it. Hmmm...

Ok, I just checked my bedside Kahr K40 that I havn't shot in awhile, but I have released the magazine and cleared the chamber many times. I checked it against the Cor-Bon's in both magazines and the unfired cartridges in the box they came out of. Guess what?

It was .007 shorter than the rest of them. I'll need to chomp on that a bit. I checked it against about 10 cartridges. This is one gun with one lot of ammo. There seems to be something to it. I'd have never known without actually checking it with a micrometer.

Who will be the 1st to tell me that my Cor-Bon's suck? :wink:

 

[NixieTube]

Who will be the 1st to tell me that my Cor-Bon's suck? :wink:

Not me, that's for sure. But let's say for the sake of argument that people are conserving their money and buying whatever ammo. they can get on sale, sometimes recycling it without firing. Recession prices, recession thinking. So maybe they're rechambering cheaper stuff without even thinking twice about it. And there's very little hard data to go on if you want to determine how much of a problem it is.

I don't think there needs to be a federal case made out of it, it's just something that people should be aware of, particularly new owners, or people who for whatever reason are loading and unloading the same rounds repeatedly. When I realized I had done it several times with my guns, the first question was: "Is this really a concern?" I didn't know, so I asked.

The best advice I've heard here is to shoot the ammo. instead of repeatedly rechambering it. I can get behind that.

 

[Mike J]

It happened to me with an XD & Winchester Ranger JHP Cholo. I didn't have calipers handy. I just put the cartridges in a line & laid a ruler across the top of them. I could see the daylight in between the ruler & the bullet on that cartridge.

 

[Cheesewhiz]

I have found bullet setback in a round that had been chambered multiple times. I usually only unload my carry ammo if I go to the range. I try to rotate the one I took out of the chamber to the bottom of the magazine. If I think the whole magazine has been through this twice I shoot them. I believe this is more an issue with 9mm or .40 as they operate at higher pressure than .45.

Mike, actually the .45ACP is probably the most likely to set back of all auto pistol rounds. More mass, larger radius, it's physics.

 

[9isFine]

HIP SHOT Wrote:I didnt include the story about his partner who didnt carry a round in the chamber due to his "fear" of the gun. They both transitioned from revolvers directly to the Glock. Needless to say, the partner, tried to fire a gun with an empty chamber at the suspect.

I think Ive seen these guys.

I couldn't resist . Honestly rotate your inventory of rounds. The more range time you have the less of a worry about "wearing out" a round.

 

[resident]

...Mike, actually the .45ACP is probably the most likely to set back of all auto pistol rounds. More mass, larger radius, it's physics.

I disagree. Larger bullet means more surface area being gripped, means more friction to resist set-back. (And .45 ACP is one of the rounds most likely to have the bullet shellacked to the case, which is a mil-spec requirement.) Larger radius also means less force applied linearly (in the direction of setback), more force applied laterally, not in the direction of setback. More mass also mean more force necessary to move the bullet. It's Newtonian physics.

 

[GhosT]

NixieTube,

Found this thread interesting.

And ya got good advice.

Personally,
Never came across this problem,and I wouldn't sweat it.
That said...many suggested rotating the rounds....I would suggest that ya do, just for yer peace of mind.


The Only time I had factory ammo shift in a handgun was back in the early 80's.
Revolver..... cheap 44 magnum rounds.....
And the bullets did not move backwards to cause pressure problems...the recoil forced the bullets forward...locked up the cylinder!

AND keep in mind......
RUGER's are a tad overbuilt!

I WRECKED a previously owned Colt Python with handloads,twice...
With loads that my GP100 would laugh at!


Rotate yer rounds, if ya sweat this problem






:wink: