Lyman 223 dies for $12

[ra]

I saw this on another forum, a good deal I will pass along.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000N8LJV8/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1&tag=vglnk-c921-20

Roger

 

[DeletedMember275]

A smoking deal!

 

[gmartinnc]

The last Lyman product I ordered was made in China and the quality seemed to be lacking quite a bit. It's on the way back to Amazon right now, at my expense. RCBS has gone to China with a lot of their products as well. Redding is the only company still making products entirely in the USA, and that is where my money is going.

 

[6gun]

The last Lyman product I ordered was made in China and the quality seemed to be lacking quite a bit. It's on the way back to Amazon right now, at my expense. RCBS has gone to China with a lot of their products as well. Redding is the only company still making products entirely in the USA, and that is where my money is going.

Haven't seen anything from Lyman or RCBS made in china, what did you buy from them that is China made???

If it was I'm guessing somthing electronic since non of the reloading companies make their own.

Very excellent buy on the 223 dies, I have a set just like them that cost more than double that price and they are excellent USA made dies.

 

[gmartinnc]

Their new mold handles are made in China, and BTW, they didn't drop the price any. Also, there is a blacked out place below the part number where the country of origin was at. There are some RCBS products made there too. Since their scale production has moved to Mexico, everyone says they are junk. As I said, if you want 100% guaranteed made in USA, Redding is the only choice.

 

[6gun]

If it's blackened out how do you know it was China? Did you call Lyman and complain? I sure would just to let them know reloaders will not buy their products if they choose to jump on the china band wagon, I would also ask Lyman if they had some good American made ones to replace them, they have always been really good about sending me replacement parts when ever I needed them.

I sure don't blame you for not accepting china crap I don't go for that either.

 

[gmartinnc]

Yes, here is their response, however, I don't believe their explanation about the covered up part number. A imported product is supposed to have the country of origin marked on it somewhere. By Lyman's own admission, these are made in China as I suspected, but no where on the package is the country of origin stated.
The time is upon us when we must decide which side of the fence we are on, and plant our feet firmly on the ground of the chosen side.
The response:
"A customer support staff member has replied to your support request, #934183 with the following response:

Hello,

The blacked out part of your packaging is covering a part number that is not used for your item. Our handles are made in China, however we have no problem with letting our customers be aware of this. We are very sorry for your disappointment. Is there a problem with the handles? We would like to address any issue, if in fact there is an issue?

Thank you for your time.

Lyman Products
Customer Service"

 

[6gun]

Wow :shock: and yes there is a problem with the handles they are not made in America out of American hardwood and your customers have no problem letting you beware we will no longer buy them is my responce.

Thanks for posting this we all need to beware of this.

 

[gmartinnc]

The dies this thread is about, may very well be made in the USA, but when you are dealing with a company that doesn't disclose where something is made, how are we supposed to know?
I have ordered the 2014 catalog from Lyman and intend to go over it closely. If it isn't made clear in that where some of their products come from, my next contact with Lyman isn't going to be very nice.
Please read this statement from Redding.

http://www.redding-reloading.com/total-quality-since-1946

 

[Rick Courtright]

Hi,

Lee's working to stay on board, too:

"Our mission is simple. Produce the best American made value in reloading tools.

The Lee family has been producing affordable reloading products since 1958. Our great prices come from patented innovative designs. We are thankful to say Lee Precision products are cast, machined and assembled in the USA."

From their homepage, http://leeprecision.com/

Maybe it just helps me vent, but I've been known to register my displeasure w/ companies who've built their reputations on good quality, American made products then "defected" to the offshore manufacturing mentality.

Two things bother me in particular about that approach, and my letters generally hinge on the following:

1. The quality almost ALWAYS suffers; and

2. The price almost ALWAYS stays the same (or increases!)

So, if you're gonna sell me a cheap Chinese product, sell it to me at cheap Chinese prices. Otherwise, if you're gonna charge me American prices, I want American quality, made by one of my neighbors who needs a job just as much as some guy in China, but who means a lot more to me. Simple enough?

Rick C

 

[gmartinnc]

Yes, Lee products have always been a good value for the price. As far as I know, Dillon products are still made in the USA also.
I just get really agitated when anyone tries to deceive me. When I saw that Chinese looking caution label on that mold handle and the blacked out place on the package along with the yellowish looking wood, I knew where it came from without even asking.
I'm done with Lyman.

 

[6gun]

ra, sorry about taking your thread way off subject, I have been a customer of Lyman products for over 30 years and and finding out they snuck in some china parts really angers me, wonder how much they truely saved putting a American out of a job making wood handles, to some this may be no big deal, but who would buy a Ruger if it had china grips? many of us deeply value our American made products.

 

[Rick Courtright]

wonder how much they truely saved putting a American out of a job making wood handles, to some this may be no big deal, but who would buy a Ruger if it had china grips? many of us deeply value our American made products.

Hi,

If we can abide just a touch more thread drift, I learned a bit about offshoring from a client, who's now passed, so I hope I tell his story properly.

He was a bird hunter and shooter, but this came from his business. He'd been a printer for close to 30 years, when the company downsized and he was left out of a job. After a while, he went to work for a publisher, who did specialty magazines (motorcycles and other spendy toys in particular.) One reason for his hiring was to bring the publisher into the black: the company had lost money for several years.

Boss had decided he needed to follow the crowd and take their printing offshore, to Singapore, IIRC. That seemed to be the printing center of the world at the time. My guy suggested they hold off a short while so he could "do some talking."

Now I didn't realize this until he 'splained it all, but printers and publishers speak two different languages. Publishers want all kinds of special stuff, but seldom know what's involved in delivery, so they don't understand what the printer is saying when he tells 'em it can't be done for the desired price, or sometimes can't be done at all, or how another way of doing the job will yield satisfactory results at a lesser price. My guy was "bilingual" if you wish, so the printers he dealt w/ for the publisher liked him.

He went out to talk to some of 'em, and came back to meet w/ the boss. Not only could he save 'em money on the job, he could improve their cash flow, get a better job at a lower price and cut lead times considerably on both the original job and any reprints required if they sold out the first run. They'd also be dealing w/ folks who speak English as their first language--since communications w/ offshore sources were often difficult, some of the jobs suffered--and they kept some American workers employed!

Boss was skeptical: all he'd ever heard was Singapore's cheaper...

My guy convinced the boss to give his idea a 6-12 month trial, then if it didn't work, Singapore would still be there. They went w/ his plan until the end of the year, and it seemed to be a good one until the boss called him into the office and started complaining! What was his beef now?

The company was gonna have to pay income taxes that year! It was the first time in several years they'd run in the black, and he'd forgotten all about having to share w/ Uncle Sam! The good side of that was both the boss and my guy received very nice bonuses that year.

Moral of the story kinda parallels that old adage about the guy to whom nothing but price is important?

Rick C

 

[Flash]

The last Lyman product I ordered was made in China and the quality seemed to be lacking quite a bit. It's on the way back to Amazon right now, at my expense. RCBS has gone to China with a lot of their products as well. Redding is the only company still making products entirely in the USA, and that is where my money is going.

Isn't CH4D made in America?

 

[Flash]

Yes, Lee products have always been a good value for the price. As far as I know, Dillon products are still made in the USA also.
I just get really agitated when anyone tries to deceive me. When I saw that Chinese looking caution label on that mold handle and the blacked out place on the package along with the yellowish looking wood, I knew where it came from without even asking.
I'm done with Lyman.

I'd be surprised if their electronic goods aren't coming from China.

 

[gmartinnc]

The last Lyman product I ordered was made in China and the quality seemed to be lacking quite a bit. It's on the way back to Amazon right now, at my expense. RCBS has gone to China with a lot of their products as well. Redding is the only company still making products entirely in the USA, and that is where my money is going.

Isn't CH4D made in America?

I am going to guess that they are.

 

[sebtool]

FWIW, I just checked the link. Current cost is $29.20, country of origin listed as USA. Hopefully that means manufactured here, not just packaged....