Changing Ruger Vaquero hammer and pawl

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flightsimmer

Bearcat
Joined
Jan 26, 2009
Messages
6
Location
Indy.USA
Hi Guy's and Girl's;

I have an old first model bright stainless Ruger Vaquero that I would like to install a "Montado" style hammer on. I can order the hammer from Ruger at what I guess you could call a resonable price and install it myself if they ever have any in stock. I was told that they don't take back orders so I would have to keep checking back about every week or so untill they have some in stock before I can order one. This is the same thing I was told a few months back when they didn't have any in stock then. So I guess I'll just have to keep trying. They must be very popular.

Now along with the new hammer I wanted to install a new pawl from GrandMasters L.L.C. D.B.A. Power Custom to make the action more like the Colt single action with a free spin at half cock so I can line up the cylinders more easily for loading. Now they offer a Bisley style S/S kit for $200.00 + shipping and handling but that is way more than I want to pay or invest in this handgun and I cannot figure out what all comes in the kit from the ad (I guess I could call them) but then it's still way more money than I want to put into this handgun.

I suppose I could be satistied with just the "Montado" hammer and by the way I don't know for sure if it's the same as the "Bisley" hammer or not and the girl at Ruger couldn't tell me because she didn't know either.

My question is, have you done a similar conversion to your Vaquero and can you answer some or all of my questions?

Thanks for your help and have a great week. Regards, Dan.
 

bnewberry

Single-Sixer
Joined
Jun 17, 2008
Messages
226
Location
MICHIGAN
The Montado hammer is the same (except for the checkering) as the Super Blackhawk hammer.


I have the Power Custom kit in a couple of my Bisley Vaqueros and it requires the trigger and the hammer to achieve the half cock.

The free spin pawl is another matter but the pawl alone won't give you a half cock.


Here is a picture, Standard hammer, Montado, Super Blackhawk and Bisley:

topview.jpg


Hope this helps!
 

Jayhawkhuntclub

Buckeye
Joined
Aug 28, 2007
Messages
1,121
Location
Kansas
Free spin pawl only takes a bit of filing (no need to purchase one). The half cock will require a new hammer (not a Ruger factory one): they are not cheap.
 

JWhitmore44

Blackhawk
Joined
Oct 23, 2008
Messages
987
Location
NW Kansas
Another vote for the super blackhawk hammer here. I ordered mine from Midway. Midway has an option to ship parts when they come off of back order so you don't have to go back and check.

For the free spin pawl try http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB/viewtop ... +spin+pawl As it says in this article i have altered several pawls with out removing them from the gun. This doesn't give you a half cock but you really don't need it after this modification. When you order the hammer from Midway order a new pawl so you have a spare in case something goes wrong with the mod.
 

flightsimmer

Bearcat
Joined
Jan 26, 2009
Messages
6
Location
Indy.USA
Hi Guy's and Girl's;

Thanks for the quick reply and for the pictures, they are a great help.

Am I correct that any of the stock Ruger Blackhawk, Super Blackhawk or Vaquero hammers are interchangeable but are made in either standard or Bisley configuration?

I understand what the free-spin pawl is now and I will just alter the one I now have.

I really don't need the half-cock hammer, it's just too expensive for my purpose. So I think I'll just go with the stock Ruger S/S Bisley hammer. All I was really after was to be able to make it easier to cock the hammer one handed.

Recently I was thinking about buying a Vaquero, Montado but I just couldn't justify the expence so that's why I decided to change hammers.

I would like to hear any other suggestions for the Vaquero that anyone might have.

Thanks again and have a great week. Regards, Dan.
 

outlaw_dogboy

Single-Sixer
Joined
Aug 2, 2005
Messages
166
Location
Maryland, USA
If you're talking about putting a Bisley hammer in a Vaquero, that is going to take a lot of filing and shaping of the base of the hammer. It is NOT a drop-in fit.

Super Blackhawk hammer is a drop in fit on the Vaquero. Or at least it was mine.
 

flatgate

Hawkeye
Joined
Jun 18, 2001
Messages
6,784
Location
Star Valley, WY
Sorry I'm late...

The Montado is a "mid sized frame" gun. The Vaquero is the large sized gun.
The Montado hammer may be a bit short. Sure, it'll hit the firing pin but come up shot in filling up the hammer well.

JMHO, and I've NEVER seen a Ruger Montado here in Wyoming.

flatgate
 

outlaw_dogboy

Single-Sixer
Joined
Aug 2, 2005
Messages
166
Location
Maryland, USA
flatgate":cf15e46t said:
Sorry I'm late...

The Montado is a "mid sized frame" gun. The Vaquero is the large sized gun.
The Montado hammer may be a bit short. Sure, it'll hit the firing pin but come up shot in filling up the hammer well.

JMHO, and I've NEVER seen a Ruger Montado here in Wyoming.

flatgate

I don't want to be a jerk, but maybe this is; however, I'm not certain you are correct there, Flatgate. All the parts of the hammer lined up perfectly on my Vaquero (50th Anniv. .357 Flattop hammer installed in a Vaquero), and the Super Blackhawk hammer that I put in that same 50th Anniv. lined up perfectly, and has worked perfectly ever since. It doesn't make sense, them being two different frame sizes. But it worked, and worked well.
 

flightsimmer

Bearcat
Joined
Jan 26, 2009
Messages
6
Location
Indy.USA
Hi Guy's and Girl's;

So, going on the above pictures of the four hammers, it appears that the Super Blackhawk hammer would be my best choice and would be a drop in fit unless of course I wanted to narrow it down like on the Birds Head model pictured.

I just have a somewhat difficult time cocking my present hammer and at times have almost dropped it trying to cock it one handed.

My understanding (and I may be wrong) is that the early Vaquero reciever was the same as the Blackhawk and the "New" Vaquero reciever is the same also but with a smaller (#3) grip frame and a smaller diameter cylinder by about .150". I gathered this info from reading gun magizines in the past but I cannot swear to it.

The "Montado" was an un-cataloged "New" Vaquero version for the SASS horse mounted events where cocking single handed was a problem while riding and that is why I thought that hammer would work in my case.

However, I wanted the opinion of those who have done it before so that I would have less chance of screwing it up.

Thanks for your advice and have a great week all. Regards, Dan.
 

JWhitmore44

Blackhawk
Joined
Oct 23, 2008
Messages
987
Location
NW Kansas
Flightsimmer, yes the super blackhawk hammer will be what you want. It's an easy change and lowers the hammer to make it easier to get to.

PA310002.jpg


Should be bale to get the hammers form Brownells, Midway, or direct from Ruger.
 

flightsimmer

Bearcat
Joined
Jan 26, 2009
Messages
6
Location
Indy.USA
Hi everybody;

I just got off of the phone with Ruger in New Hampshire (for revolvers)603-865-2442. You have to call them, they do not have an on-line parts store. I told the fellow what I had and what I wanted to do and he said the only (low) drop-in hammer that would work was a Super Blackhawk hammer, so I ordered one for $33.00 + $3.50 shipping and they had it in stock and would ship today. Part # was KMR-04001B.

I have not been able to varify that the (Original) Vaquero reciever and the (New) Vaquero recievers are the same size (I don't think they are) but I know the grip frame on the New Vaquero is smaller, it's what they call a #3 size. They did say that the Montado hammer will not fit (drop-in) the Original Vaquero reciever but it will fit the New Vaquero reciever which tells me that the recievers are different.

The half cock hammers and the free-spin pawls can only be bought from www.powercustom.com/ , Brownells or midwayusa.com/ , I'm not aware of any others.

I hope I will be satisfied now and thanks for your pictures and help.

Have a great week. Regards, Dan.
 

flatgate

Hawkeye
Joined
Jun 18, 2001
Messages
6,784
Location
Star Valley, WY
outlaw_dogboy":5htqouxe said:
and the Super Blackhawk hammer that I put in that same 50th Anniv. lined up perfectly

Really? Wow, I'm confused. So the 50th Anniversary .357 Flattop has identical height hammer as a Super Blackhawk?

Well, I'll be doggoned if that's the case. You can teach an old dog.......

flatgate
 

outlaw_dogboy

Single-Sixer
Joined
Aug 2, 2005
Messages
166
Location
Maryland, USA
flatgate":1tqt4dba said:
outlaw_dogboy":1tqt4dba said:
and the Super Blackhawk hammer that I put in that same 50th Anniv. lined up perfectly

Really? Wow, I'm confused. So the 50th Anniversary .357 Flattop has identical height hammer as a Super Blackhawk?

Well, I'll be doggoned if that's the case. You can teach an old dog.......

flatgate

Yeah, as best as I can tell it lines up perfectly. Perhaps if I needed to run the Micro sight down to its absolute bottom, there might be some interference, but it doesn't look like it. It looks like the hammer comes right up to where it should.

I think the reason the Ruger said that the Mantado hammer is not drop-in fit for the Vaquero is because of the step at the top of the hammer. The step that prevents the hammer from contacting the firing pin when the trigger isn't pulled. That step is slightly taller on the small-frames, for some reason, and the difference is made up by a change in the transfer bar. It is thicker at the top. If you put the Montado hammer (or a NM Flattop hammer, for that matter) in an older model, the ideal solution is to file away just a little of that step, otherwise there is the chance of light primer strikes. At least that is what I've been told. However, facts do not bear out theory here. I put a NM Flattop hammer on my Vaquero (full size) like I mentioned above, and it was a drop-in fit. I did no filing. I tested it with the full range of ammo that I had, from light Federal ammo all the way up to Buffalo Bore ammo, as well as a few handloads IIRC. 100 percent funcitonality with all primers. No light hits.

Anyway.... looking at the hammer comparisons above, I'd rather have the SBH than the Montado.
 

flightsimmer

Bearcat
Joined
Jan 26, 2009
Messages
6
Location
Indy.USA
Hi Guy's and Girl's;

I dug back through my library of gun magizines and found a good source for Ruger firearms of all kinds. It is the latest 2008, 42 page Ruger catalog with the SR9 and the LCP on the front cover (they are free at most gun shops). There are numerous articles included in it about many of the Ruger firearms. I found the one by Sheriff Jim Wilson to be especially helpful concerning the old and new Vaquero and the Montado but there are also articles on the Blackhawk, Super Blackhawk, Redhawk and many, many others. This catalog belongs in your Ruger library.

Have a great week everybody. Regards, Dan.
 
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