AR15 FOR HOME DEFENSE

[rcs9250]

A couple days ago I helped a friend assemble an outdoor barbecue unit on his patio. A block of plywood was used in shipping to support the grill.
The plywood was 15 ply by 1 3/4” (45mm) thick.
When I saw it, I immediately knew I needed to shoot at it.

So I took it to the range yesterday and set it up at 100 yards. Took two shots at it with .223 Hornady Varmint Express. I thought for sure I would be digging a mushroomed piece of lead out of the board. Nope.
A neighbor has been considering getting an AR for home defense. He and I live on a cul de sac in a typical suburban neighborhood.
Depending on the angle of the shot, drywall would be no challenge for a .223 round.
My boss on the sheriffs department was in a firefight with some bad guys a few years back. Their M4’s were allegedly using some kind of frangible, I think, ammo that was safe for urban skirmishes. They found that even that ammo went through both sides of the dwellings fridge and its contents.
I’m in the shotgun home defense school of thought for where I live but YMMV.

 

[GSP7]

Oh my , I hear the ar15s will blow up the whole house,,, and kill all your neighbors

 

[Hertervillian]

Might try a varmint load before you give up.

 

[s4s4u]

AR-15 is great for home defense. I have one next to my bed all the time, but it isn't chambered in 5.56

 

[Jakeintexas]

A .223 is good for not ‘over penetrating’ but certainly will go through drywall. It’s a good choice for home defense.

There’s alot of stuff that’s worse for so called over penetration including buckshot and slugs.

I don’t get it. You can’t have something that will penetrate enough to stop a threat but not go through other stuff too. To me that makes no sense. So whatever one uses has the ability to get through some barriers in the event of a miss.

 

[gunzo]

Not only potential/maybe certain over penetration problems,,, but outside my bedroom door is a hallway & thinking that lighting off an AR there would be bigtime hearing damage.
Looked over a few shotguns today with thoughts of one replacing the AR behind my BR door.

 

[Jakeintexas]

Not only potential/maybe certain over penetration problems,,, but outside my bedroom door is a hallway & thinking that lighting off an AR there would be bigtime hearing damage.
Looked over a few shotguns today with thoughts of one replacing the AR behind my BR door.

Or you could get a set of those walker ear muffs with the electric amplifier for around 50 bucks or so and put them by your bed.

 

[M118LR]

The bullpup 12 gauge has come a long way. At normal room distances less than 00 is still catastrophic on intruders without armour and sheds most of its murderous payload passing through interior sheetrock walls. A sidekick with solids will cure folks intruding while wearing armour, but if you miss????? Over penetration is assured. Solids will penetrate hot water heaters etc. There isn't a perfect home protection firearm. Yet if you have enough time to put on a ear protection, you should have enough time to take up a position that allows you not to shoot others in the house? Then again, it may depend on how many folks you have in the house?

Bottom line. I prefer my 590A1 with a fixed bayonet.

 

[gunzo]

Or you could get a set of those walker ear muffs with the electric amplifier for around 50 bucks or so and put them by your bed.

Sounds nice, have a pair. But really you jest. Someone just busted down the door of my small house & I must come out of a sleep & grab a gun, but put on muffs?

I ain't that quick bud.

 

[gunzo]

The bullpup 12 gauge has come a long way. At normal room distances less than 00 is still catastrophic on intruders without armour and sheds most of its murderous payload passing through interior sheetrock walls. A sidekick with solids will cure folks intruding while wearing armour, but if you miss????? Over penetration is assured. Solids will penetrate hot water heaters etc. There isn't a perfect home protection firearm. Yet if you have enough time to put on a ear protection, you should have enough time to take up a position that allows you not to shoot others in the house? Then again, it may depend on how many folks you have in the house?

Bottom line. I prefer my 590A1 with a fixed bayonet.

Really,,, a fixed bayonet sound ludicrous at first, but if the intruder is very close it gets the thrust without family or neighbors getting the over penetration, it's all good. Except for the stickee.

Really,,, it's sounds nut's & the picture in my mind is off the wall. But the idea seems to really have merit.

Did I just say that?

 

[M118LR]

If the intruder is to close for the Pig sticker, a solid butt stroke usually backs them up far enough to stick. Then a quick trigger pull loaded with lead bird shot while they are dangling on the blade has a tendency to end collateral damage. JMHO YMMV.

The proximity of the target to the muzzle tends to mute the sound of the blast. But ear protection might still be advisable if you have the time.

Edit.

 

[DGW1949]

Wood is a poor bullet stopper. Drywall ain't any better. Residential metal doors?....not a chance....
When I was with Humble P.D. over in Texas, some of us had an occasion to shoot up a couple of houses which were scheduled to be torn down....Just to sum up what I learned as it applies to this conversation; There ain't much inside the typical house which is going to stop a bullet from any serious pistol, or any rifle....Maybe a large water heater if it actually has water in it, or a freezer if it is packed full.
Point is, 90% of what gets tossed about and repeated relative to "which gun?" or "which caliber?" to use to prevent shooting through a wall (or walls) is pure fiction. Just because your favorite gun writer, internet celebrity, or who ever else may have said it, don't make it so.....
Remember the old western movies when a gunfight started in the saloon and everyone turned over them big ole heavy tables to use for cover?.....well, that was just Hollywood BS....
Just sayin' to be careful out there.

DGW

 

[Jeepnik]

When I got married I had three firearms. S&W .22 kit gun, Winchester .22 single shot rifle, and a Mossberg .410 shotgun. When I went to Spain I left those at home. It just didn't seem worth the hassle. Hey, it's Spain, at the time it had the lowest crime rate in Europe.

Once I got there I found out that while domestic crime was very low, terrorists were a very real threat (they didn't put that in the brochure). My first purchase was a .357 Llama Comanche. Followed shortly by a Franchi 48L 20 ga. The Franchi was bought more or less on impulse. I was invited to a bird shoot o a local ranch.

After I was discharged I sold the Llama. And I was not living in a "good" area. So, the Franchi and had the barrel cut back to 19". It served as my home defense shotgun. In fact, it is still serving in that capacity.

A 20 ga is about perfect for home defense. Plenty of capability, but with fairly light recoil.

 

[M118LR]

So if an AR makes you feel confident living alone, Go Rambo. Yet if you require a 30 round mag to stop a single intruder inside of a 20 x 20 foot room? I suggest more range time, or are you expecting a parade to pass through your Great Room?

 

[M118LR]

So if I'm with door kickers dancing the congo line somewhere other than your front door. Yup, a sub 11 inch Fully Automatic with a couple or 7, 30 round mags sounds like the perfect firearm. But then again I really ain't concerned with all those collateral casualties as long as I get the target. So since you feel the need to spray and pray, please don't pester me with how many folks you might hit since you intend to expend more than one round for every foot in your great room.

Oops, Excuse me. Everyone requires an AR at a minimum for self defense.

Wait, does that mean all the folks with a DA Revolver in the bedstand are just foolish?

 

[blume357]

For the original l question... depends on what you are defending your home from...
I'd say you don't need the AR for the average home invader(s)... 9mm or such in either long or short weapon will more than be adequate...and much less likely to go down the street and cause undue harm. Now the AR will be for when the team from the government shows up and all it will do is make a final statement in the press and on those that don't make it home.

 

[Mobuck]

"Might try a varmint load before you give up."
OP stated: " Took two shots at it with .223 Hornady Varmint Express. "
That's about as 'varmint load' as one would find. Maybe not as explosive as a 45 grain JHP but definitely not a deep penetration bullet.
IMHO. the .223 is just not a good choice for home defense anywhere there might be neighbors within 100-200 yards.

 

[Mike J]

Where I live the homes are on 1-3 acre lots. My neighbors are close enough I wouldn't want to use an AR in a rifle caliber for home defense. If I have to defend my home, it will most likely be with whatever handgun I carried that day and/or a 12 gauge.

 

[Hvymax]

A couple days ago I helped a friend assemble an outdoor barbecue unit on his patio. A block of plywood was used in shipping to support the grill.
The plywood was 15 ply by 1 3/4” (45mm) thick.
When I saw it, I immediately knew I needed to shoot at it.

So I took it to the range yesterday and set it up at 100 yards. Took two shots at it with .223 Hornady Varmint Express. I thought for sire I would be digging a mushroomed piece of lead out of the board. Nope.
A neighbor has been considering getting an AR for home defense. He and I live on a cul de sac in a typical suburban neighborhood.
Depending on the angle of the shot, drywall would be no challenge for a .223 round.
My boss on the seriffs department was in a firefight with some bad guys a few years back. Their M4’s were allegedly using some kind of frangible, I think, ammo that was safe for urban skirmishes. They found that even that ammo went through both sides of the dwellings fridge and its contents.
I’m in the shotgun home defense school for where I live but YMMV.

My issue with a 5.56 AR for home defense is the flash and the bang in a confined space!!! Unless you are running a can you may as well flashbang yourself.

 

[Hvymax]

So if an AR makes you feel confident living alone, Go Rambo. Yet if you require a 30 round mag to stop a single intruder inside of a 20 x 20 foot room? I suggest more range time, or are you expecting a parade to pass through your Great Room?

There's never any guarantees on the number of intruders or how easy they will be to neutralize. I prefer my 350 Legend AR for HD myself. 300gr semi sonics with a flash can is pretty manageable indoors with reliable 20rnd mags.

 

[41Dude]

Here's mine. I am not happy with it. I need more mag capacity.

 

[Johnnu2]

First line of defense for us is THE WINDOW...........then:
a pump action shotgun ...... PERIOD.
We have used these methods thru dozens of home invasions and four terrorist attacks on our suburban neighborhood. Looking forward to a good old fashioned revolution..!

J.

 

[tazbigdog]

Handgun for me for home defense. Had a tactical shotgun for HD, loaded with O buck, 6’s and 4’s. AR is for multiple targets, and usually outside defense.

 

[s4s4u]

a pump action shotgun ...... PERIOD.

Hoping you only have one perp in your house to deal with. A pump gun may not not a great choice for multiples, unless you have Tom Knapp type of skilz..

 

[Jakeintexas]

For the original l question... depends on what you are defending your home from...
I'd say you don't need the AR for the average home invader(s)... 9mm or such in either long or short weapon will more than be adequate...and much less likely to go down the street and cause undue harm. Now the AR will be for when the team from the government shows up and all it will do is make a final statement in the press and on those that don't make it home.

It kinda makes me cringe when anyone says ‘you don’t need.’

I have no idea what someone else might ‘need’. I might have some suggestions as to what might work for them. I can’t possibly determine what someone else’s ‘need’ might be because I don’t know them, their personal situation, or what threats they might face. And need isn’t that important; they should be able to have what they want and believe they can use effectively.

A 30 round mag is good for me in a HD rifle. No matter how good I think I am stats show LE often miss over half of the rounds sent at a target. Maybe I’m better on the day but on the day everything is moving including me and it’s not like shooting at paper. Moreover BGs have been known not to be stopped by multiple hits and if there’s more than one that complicates things even further.

What do I use ?

Depends on where I am. Right now a suppressed AR pistol build with eotech works quite well. It’s in .223/5.56 and would work for home defense as well as its critter eradication role which is much more likely.

In another place a 9mm scorpion PDW with brace works well. Or that could even be an AR build in 9mm if one likes the caliber.

And a shotgun might work mighty fine too depending on situation. Problem with shotguns is a lower capacity and getting hits. Most people don’t realize that a shot charge from even a cylinder bore shotgun doesn’t spread out all that much and is likely between a large saucer and a dinner plate in diameter at most HD ranges. So needs to be aimed.

 

[DGW1949]

One of the best things that can be done to help with the "penetration" problem relative to walls and stuff is to actually hit the bad guy. That alone should slow the bullet down quite a bit....
No offense to anyone, just thinking out loud here.

DGW

 

[krw]

I cood choose an HK 9mm w Jet Funnel, or a AR9 pistol suppressd w Hi-Cap mags, or SBR'd AR suppressed. I sleep very well with an 18" 870 w a +2 extension loaded w 2 3/4" #1 BuckShot. I sleep like a Baby

 

[Joe Chartreuse]

Two answers. Sitting in my living room I have a .380 in a wooden box next to me at all times. I can see what I am dealing with instantly and adjust accordingly. However, at night when I am in the bedroom I keep a Shockwave next to the door. It's what it is specifically made for, and should solve any problems. I have other surprises hidden around as well.

 

[blume357]

It kinda makes me cringe when anyone says ‘you don’t need.’

Jake, like a lot of the media, you took what I said out of context... if you look back, what I actually wrote was:
" you don't need the AR for the average home invader(s)."
Then I went on to be slightly political and explained when exactly I thought one would need an AR in a home invasion or to defend their home and family. And there are instances in the recent past when this has happened....

 

[rcs9250]

One of the best things that can be done to help with the "penetration" problem relative to walls and stuff is to actually hit the bad guy. That alone should slow the bullet down quite a bit....
No offense to anyone, just thinking out loud here.

DGW

Home invasions like a lot of things are very dynamic. You don’t know what the invader will be doing and you don’t know how you’re going to do either. There are so many things to use to defend your domicile and the inhabitants.