woodperson
Single-Sixer
So do you insert the cocked SA into the holster with the trigger cover while it is cocked? Or do you cock it after you have it holstered but you cannot see the trigger? Do you have foot insurance?
Why single action woods or outdoor gun?
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bogus bill
Hunter
What we have here, is a failure to communicate. There hasn't been a range officer, target shooter, lawman, holster maker, gun designer, hunter, good man, bad man, manufacture or anyone else that would advise putting any cocked single action or double action revolver in a holster in history! I wouldn't do it if this was the old west if someone called me out in the middle of the street. I did personally know two different guys over the years that DID shoot themselves in the leg fast drawing but I spared them the embarrassment of asking them how they managed to do it as that's the only way they could have. One of those guys was lucky enough to just graze his leg and rip and mess his pants. The other was using a cane at work for a long time.
loaded round
Hunter
A SAA, especially a 45 or 44 Spl and the outdoors just go together just like peanut butter and jelly. I personally own about 20 different handguns since I've been buying them since I got out of the army. When I take a walk in the woods, my sidearm is usually my 4 5/8'' Vaquero Convertible with the 44 cylinder installed with stout 44 Spl. loads. I just shoot this pistol well.
It somewhat depends on the holster. I have one that it's very difficult to co co the revolver once in the holster, mabye if it were a bit tighter... But most of the Glock legs I know of were from inserting the pistol in the holster. It's much much better to cock after.
bogus bill
Hunter
The main thing a DA revolver or autos have over on a single action is faster reloading. Excluding bear attacks and even then after five rounds I doubt you would have time to reload while he is snacking on you. I own plenty of all them and truth is they all are good for the woods. I carry whatever flavor of the day appeals to me. I have a ruger single six in .32 H&R mag, a flat top .44 special and a early single six .22lr. Also own colt saa`s and clones plus colt and smith double actions.
I intend on taking this .32 h&r on my UTV rides more this summer. We don't have grizz`s here to worry about.
I intend on taking this .32 h&r on my UTV rides more this summer. We don't have grizz`s here to worry about.
woodperson
Single-Sixer
Mr Grobin:
What you say about carrying a revolver cocked is truly idiotic.
A Glock is not cocked. If the sear fails there is not enough energy in the spring to fire the gun. You fully cock the striker with the trigger pull. So it has a long pull. I do not know how safe a Glock is. I do not have one or want one. A 1911 has a couple of safeties. I do not really want one of those either. My revolvers have almost no trigger travel when fired single action. It would not take much of a piece of trash in the trigger guard to fire one. Yes, in theory the gun will not fire unless the trigger is held back. We all know that. We all also know better than to do what you suggest that you do. And I see no need or advantage from doing it that way.
What you say about carrying a revolver cocked is truly idiotic.
A Glock is not cocked. If the sear fails there is not enough energy in the spring to fire the gun. You fully cock the striker with the trigger pull. So it has a long pull. I do not know how safe a Glock is. I do not have one or want one. A 1911 has a couple of safeties. I do not really want one of those either. My revolvers have almost no trigger travel when fired single action. It would not take much of a piece of trash in the trigger guard to fire one. Yes, in theory the gun will not fire unless the trigger is held back. We all know that. We all also know better than to do what you suggest that you do. And I see no need or advantage from doing it that way.
Mr. woodperson I must admire your admission of ignorance. You admit you don't know about Glocks. If the sear breaks the round will fire, at least it did in the only case I've heard of. The typical trigger pull on a Glock is not enough to do the job (it's typically a bit under 5.5 lbs and very rough from the factory).
Yes a cocked SA will fire with a lighter pull than can be achieved in a Glock but that's due to the mechanism and IMHO the poor implementation of the trigger safety by Glock.
Yes a cocked SA will fire with a lighter pull than can be achieved in a Glock but that's due to the mechanism and IMHO the poor implementation of the trigger safety by Glock.
mohavesam
Hawkeye
Years ago I stood behind a guy ( in a large grocery store ) who wore a cocked SA Ruger in a belt holster. I mentioned to the dude that his hammer had become cocked...
He replied dryly... "Its called cocked and locked" .
I guess he schooled me ! :roll:
He replied dryly... "Its called cocked and locked" .
I guess he schooled me ! :roll:
bogus bill
Hunter
Disregard the safety aspect. What advantage is there carrying a cocked revolver in a holster? I would sooner drive on a icy mountain road without brakes!
bogus bill
Hunter
What is a passive trigger safety on a revolver? Few if any leo carry a revolver for the last 25 years but when they did they were taught to shoot DA, not SA. DA revolvers can be fired as fast and accurate as a auto. They do have less rounds and are a little slower to reload, and then maybe not with speed loaders. Were it not for less firepower the police wouldn't have bothered changing to autos. Less complicated too. Arguably even faster and more accurate. In short, there is no advantage of speed at all having a cocked revolver in your holster. After the deadwyler shooting in Los Angeles the LAPD made their officers bring their revolvers in and made them DA only.http://articles.latimes.com/1996-03-16/news/mn-47676_1_traffic-stop The cop had his cocked revolver through the car window on deadwyler, the car lurched and the gun went off killing deadwyler. Had it not been cocked it wouldn't have happened.
There is A HUGE danger factor that is unthinkable in having a cocked revolver in your holster. I am almost 78 years old, never once read or heard it advised, carried DA revolvers on my job for 35 years, besides off the job for the last 19 years since I retired, read every gun rag for the last 65 years and until yesterday never seen it advised. I own roughly 30 handguns, DA, SA, and about 3 autos. In the past I suspect another 100 or so have passed through my hands. While I am experienced I no longer with age claim to be a good shot. I have developed "the shakes" with age.
There is A HUGE danger factor that is unthinkable in having a cocked revolver in your holster. I am almost 78 years old, never once read or heard it advised, carried DA revolvers on my job for 35 years, besides off the job for the last 19 years since I retired, read every gun rag for the last 65 years and until yesterday never seen it advised. I own roughly 30 handguns, DA, SA, and about 3 autos. In the past I suspect another 100 or so have passed through my hands. While I am experienced I no longer with age claim to be a good shot. I have developed "the shakes" with age.
daveg.inkc
Hunter
I wonder what Bill Ruger would say about one of his Blackhawks being packed with hammer cocked? I bet it would be colorful!!
GunnyGene
Hawkeye
mohavesam said:
Murphy loves guys like this. Personally, I do my best to avoid getting friendly with Mr. Murphy. He will whisper sweet nothings in your ear while plotting unpleasant surprises and arranging a meeting with Mr. Darwin. :wink:
CraigC
Hawkeye
Carrying a revolver with the hammer cocked has got to be one of the stupidest ideas I have EVER heard in my life. If you do this, you're a danger to yourself and others.
Even with the right holster that made it totally safe to carry that way, unholstering, and probably worse, re-holstering would be hairy IMO.
I've had occasion to accidentally end up with a loaded and cocked, safety off, semi auto in a holster, and because of the design of gun/holster. no way to put it back on without drawing the gun. Even knowing the situation, with no rush in the slightest doing so, I didn't like it. The times I WAS in a rush, even less so.
I've had occasion to accidentally end up with a loaded and cocked, safety off, semi auto in a holster, and because of the design of gun/holster. no way to put it back on without drawing the gun. Even knowing the situation, with no rush in the slightest doing so, I didn't like it. The times I WAS in a rush, even less so.
bogus bill
Hunter
Fifty years ago I knew a Los Angeles county reserve deputy that answered a call of someone who was open carrying in a country tavern out of town. The man had been out shooting on the dessert, kept his gun, belt and holster on. While I knew the deputy I never asked him his version. I got the story from others. Sounds like a nervous patron dropped a dime on him. He wasn't pulling a crime. It had been raining. The deputy pulled up to the bar, was getting out as the man wearing the rig also was coming out of the bar and walking towards his vehicle. The deputy got in a kneeling position or whatever over the cruiser hood and ordered the guy, but don't know what was said. I was told the guy took the gun or gun belt?? off and threw them in his vehicle. The deputy had a double action revolver and I THINK he must have had it cocked but am not positive. He was starting to stand up as he now had the situation under control but slipped in the mud. His gun went off and he killed the man! Basically, thats similar to what happened in the deadwyler case. In high stress situations chise happens. Deadwylers foot slipped off the clutch in his VW bumping the cops arm who likely had his DA revolver cocked setting it off as it also did on the deputy's gun when he slipped trying to get to his feet. Los Angeles right after those incidents had all the officers guns made to shoot DA only and right after that it seems the entire law enforcement agencies in the united states went to autos. I knew that deputy. He was a gun aficionado, shooting and reloading. While many can shoot DA about as accurately as SA, I am not one of them. I started out with a ruger single six and may have shot that gun as much or even more than I did my service guns on all my requalifications put together, old habits are hard to break. The point of all this is its very easy to set off a cocked DA revolver and it takes a conscious deliberate pull threw to set one off double action. Baaad idea carrying one cocked in a holster!
Most, but not all, modern revolvers and pistols have a passive trigger safety, that is regardless of the gun being cocked it will not fire. Unless the trigger is pulled! Older revolvers without this feature must be carried with the hammer down on an empty cylinder! Even this precaution can fail. I was at a Cowboy Action event that had a riding component. A contestant was mounting in a hurry and somehow managed to catch the the hammer on something, that cocked the revolver on a loaded cylinder, when the hammer released the revolver fired! No one was hit by the bullet but the contestant was injured when the horse took exception and bolted! Weird freak accident!
With the trigger safety this would not have happened. Everyone needs to come into this century and upgrade.
With the trigger safety this would not have happened. Everyone needs to come into this century and upgrade.
woodperson
Single-Sixer
I wonder if you might be subject to arrest for an unsafe practice with a firearm? Public endangerment? something like that?
I could see us having this conversation over carrying a 1911 with pros and cons. But I just do not see that the transfer bar or trigger block makes it safe or even reasonable to carry a revolver with the hammer cocked. And yes, the modern revolvers with the transfer bar or hammer block are "safer" in many respects than their older counterparts. And yes, I do still have a OM that is not converted. And yes, I am somewhat ignorant of Glock's. And many other things firearm related. But I know a couple of practices carrying a revolver that should be avoided. And yours is one of them.
I could see us having this conversation over carrying a 1911 with pros and cons. But I just do not see that the transfer bar or trigger block makes it safe or even reasonable to carry a revolver with the hammer cocked. And yes, the modern revolvers with the transfer bar or hammer block are "safer" in many respects than their older counterparts. And yes, I do still have a OM that is not converted. And yes, I am somewhat ignorant of Glock's. And many other things firearm related. But I know a couple of practices carrying a revolver that should be avoided. And yours is one of them.
bogus bill
Hunter
Mr grobin, at first I thought your first post had to be a mistake, not what you really meant, but you seem to be sticking with it. Have YOU ever actually carried a double action revolver cocked in your holster or ever seen any one else do it. (except by unintentional brain fart?) I actually have too but that's just what it was and I explained those two incidents earlier on this thread. Have you ever seen in print or had some instructor even mention or advise anyone to carry a cocked DA or SA revolver that way? Not wanting to embarass you but I would like if ANYONE ELSE reading this to tell me about it if they have ever seen it or read to do it either. I would think every range officer in the country would bar a shooter from intentionally doing it. Yes, it has inivertedly been unintentionally done even by me as I admitted on a earlier post. People do stupid stuff by accident. Years ago I and my best friend went in a gun store and I bought a set of grips for a s&w model 60. Since we were near his house we went there to get a screwdriver to change my grips. We were sitting across a coffee table from each other. I unloaded the gun and put the grips on with him watching. When done we both hefted it and dry fired at something. Then I reloaded the gun with him watching. We were BS`ing for a few minuets and then he again picked up the gun and fired at a picture of a wolf on the wall! He fired at the same instant that I yelled HEY! Now this guy was also a gun lover, a ex cop and we both carried on our guard job. It takes very, very little to light off a cocked revolver. It takes a intended longer pull to cycle it in double action that is next to impossible to happen accidentally. I am not talking here about the hammer block you were referring to that keeps a at rest hammer down revolver from firing without the trigger being pulled if it falls on a rock or whatever. Recall that FBI agent a couple months ago who did a backflip dancing, his auto fell out, hit the floor and went off hitting a patron when he hurried to grab it? I doubt it could have went off had it been a UNCOCKED DA revolver that he consciously had to pull the trigger through in double action.
That's not what happened. It hit the floor and went off when he picked it up with his finger inside the trigger guard.bogus bill said:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfqwMQ5DNVQ
I think grobin's just looking to rile some people up.
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