Wolves kill 19 elk in suspected 'surplus kill'

[hpman66]

I guess that even among wolves that there are "slob" hunters. Of course the fact that this "slob" hunting by the wolves will affect the hunting season, the number of elk that can be taken and the local elk hunting area's revenues lost will go right over the heads of the animal lovers groups.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/wo...ted-surplus-kill/ar-BBqUHdC?OCID=ansmsnnews11
Wolves kill 19 elk in suspected 'surplus kill'
Mary Bowerman
3/25/2016

 

[Critch]

All predators get into those kill frenzies. A mink got in my hen house one time and killed all 20 chickens, just for fun. I've seen cats and dogs kill things for fun...

 

[GunnyGene]

Obviously the wolves ( and other predators) do this because they don't have internet access. :roll: :wink:

 

[Colonialgirl]

I seem to recall reading about the wolves killing a pregnant female elk and then just eating the unborn calf and leaving the rest to rot. When food is plentiful waste becomes rampant.

 

[warbird1975]

About 20 miles from me. Most of the ranchers around here have a pretty solid "anti wolf" policy. Wouldn't surprise me if the next story is about a bunch of wolves that mysteriously come down with a serious case of lead poisoning.

 

[Colonialgirl]

LOT of idiots and ignorant morons posting in the comments; Some have NO CLUE at all.

 

[gramps]

Yep, the wolves were killed off for a reason. Noooo, the dumb tree hungers had to bring the wolves back! :evil: I was noting in the comments that wolves save the environment by killing of the herbivores that eat plants, which gives us oxygen. So here we have a liberal agreeing that CO2 isn't a pollutant. 8)
gramps

 

[don44]

About 20 miles from me. Most of the ranchers around here have a pretty solid "anti wolf" policy. Wouldn't surprise me if the next story is about a bunch of wolves that mysteriously come down with a serious case of lead poisoning.

Let's hope so!!!!

 

[warbird1975]

The lady who cuts my wife's hair has a ranch on the upper green, which is not far from Bondurant. She told my wife that they lost over 360 cows last year to wolf and Grizzly bears. They get paid full market value by the government for each of those cows. Which means that everybody gets to help pay for those cows. I'm sure glad people who do not live in Wyoming, Idaho, and Montana made the decision to bring the wolves back. Sarcasm off.

 

[dougader]

Oregon F&W finally agreed to kill some wolves that were going nuts on some ranches. They killed 4 wolves... a good start imo.

 

[sixshot]

I'm a little over an hour from there. It was on the front page of yesterday's paper saying its not common to kill 19 elk & leave them, didn't mention that its common many times to kill 8-10, just that its not common to kill 19! That same herd has had 77 elk killed so far this winter.

Just a few years ago the central Idaho elk numbers were around 17,000, now, with the reintroduction of the Canadaian Gray Wolf, not the wolves that were here in the first place....that same central Idaho herd is down to around 3,000.

Its in the paper again today that the target number to delist them is far beyond the target number, especially in Wyoming.

Long live Wolves.....in Central Park!!

Dick

 

[don44]

I'm a little over an hour from there. It was on the front page of yesterday's paper saying its not common to kill 19 elk & leave them, didn't mention that its common many times to kill 8-10, just that its not common to kill 19! That same herd has had 77 elk killed so far this winter.

Just a few years ago the central Idaho elk numbers were around 17,000, now, with the reintroduction of the Canadaian Gray Wolf, not the wolves that were here in the first place....that same central Idaho herd is down to around 3,000.

Its in the paper again today that the target number to delist them is far beyond the target number, especially in Wyoming.

Long live Wolves.....in Central Park!!

Dick

+100.... I like your last paragraph!

 

[warbird1975]

We were just starting to get them under control when some federal judge back east decided that she knows more about what is best for Wyoming than we do.

 

[Ugly Hombre]

There used to be wolves and grizley bears in California too- they are talking about reintroducing the wolves into Cali may have already started.

Ok by me- if they start with Hollywood- turn lose a couple of hundred wolves and throw in a couple of doz. Griz as well.

That would make a hell of a movie.

 

[hpman66]

Long live Wolves.....in Central Park!!

Dick

Need to add about a couple dozen each of mountain lions and grizzly bears too. :wink: :mrgreen:

 

[contender]

Just like many laws that are controversial,,, they use emotion to pull in the votes & get a law passed. "If just one life can be saved" or "We only want to get to a target number" or "We only want to save the condors, so we need the lead ban in just those areas." or any of the other emotional arguments they use to pass stupid laws. BUT,,, once a law is passed, THEN they add more & more restrictions as it's easier to get the laws added to an existing one,,, vs passing a new one.
There are hundreds of examples of such laws.
However these folks who got their wildlife education by watching Disney & Bambi,,, are totally clueless about real life. And the anti-hunters are full of glee when hunting is restricted or even stopped due to low numbers of animals by predation. What they do NOT understand is once the elk, deer & all are gone,,, and the wolves, mountain lions, bears, coyotes are hungry,,, they WILL move into places & go after pets, & people.
But these same people live in the concrete forest, too far away to be impacted by all this.

I, like sixshot,,, feel they should relocate them to places like Central Park, & ALL of the big cities & places where these bunny humpers live. Let them lose Fido or Fluffy to a coyote. Let their kids go outside to play & become a wolf's dinner. Let them go jogging on a nature trail & have a mountain lion snack on their reeboks.

Sadly,,, way too many people are absolutely clueless about wildlife & all. Heck,,, Miss Penny's boss hired an intern a few weeks ago. She is 22,,, and so naive,,, she recently moved in with boyfriend. He didn't have a dishwasher in his kitchen. She came in talking about that. And,, she has NO idea about how to cook. She gets pre-packaged stuff at the grocery store & eats out. They were talking about cooking,,, and Miss Penny was talking about cooking from scratch,,, & she didn't know what that meant. She called Miss Penny "her hero." Sadly,, she's exactly the same kind who votes & pushes for wolf protection & all the other CRAP we have to deal with. No clue about reality.
Ok,,, rant off,,,,,,,,,,
These posts always rile me,,, as I deal with such stupidity in my job.

 

[GunnyGene]

Just like many laws that are controversial,,, they use emotion to pull in the votes & get a law passed. "If just one life can be saved" or "We only want to get to a target number" or "We only want to save the condors, so we need the lead ban in just those areas." or any of the other emotional arguments they use to pass stupid laws. BUT,,, once a law is passed, THEN they add more & more restrictions as it's easier to get the laws added to an existing one,,, vs passing a new one.
There are hundreds of examples of such laws.
However these folks who got their wildlife education by watching Disney & Bambi,,, are totally clueless about real life. And the anti-hunters are full of glee when hunting is restricted or even stopped due to low numbers of animals by predation. What they do NOT understand is once the elk, deer & all are gone,,, and the wolves, mountain lions, bears, coyotes are hungry,,, they WILL move into places & go after pets, & people.
But these same people live in the concrete forest, too far away to be impacted by all this.

I, like sixshot,,, feel they should relocate them to places like Central Park, & ALL of the big cities & places where these bunny humpers live. Let them lose Fido or Fluffy to a coyote. Let their kids go outside to play & become a wolf's dinner. Let them go jogging on a nature trail & have a mountain lion snack on their reeboks.

Sadly,,, way too many people are absolutely clueless about wildlife & all. Heck,,, Miss Penny's boss hired an intern a few weeks ago. She is 22,,, and so naive,,, she recently moved in with boyfriend. He didn't have a dishwasher in his kitchen. She came in talking about that. And,, she has NO idea about how to cook. She gets pre-packaged stuff at the grocery store & eats out. They were talking about cooking,,, and Miss Penny was talking about cooking from scratch,,, & she didn't know what that meant. She called Miss Penny "her hero." Sadly,, she's exactly the same kind who votes & pushes for wolf protection & all the other CRAP we have to deal with. No clue about reality.
Ok,,, rant off,,,,,,,,,,
These posts always rile me,,, as I deal with such stupidity in my job.

As always there are those who reside in their minds only, and ignore the world around them.

Tennysen - http://www.theotherpages.org/poems/books/tennyson/tennyson04.html

‘So careful of the type?’ but no.
From scarped cliff and quarried stone
She cries, ‘A thousand types are gone:
I care for nothing, all shall go.

‘Thou makest thine appeal to me:
I bring to life, I bring to death:
The spirit does but mean the breath:
I know no more.’ And he, shall he,

Man, her last work, who seem’d so fair,
Such splendid purpose in his eyes,
Who roll’d the psalm to wintry skies,
Who built him fanes of fruitless prayer,

Who trusted God was love indeed
And love Creation’s final law–
Tho’ Nature, red in tooth and claw
With ravine, shriek’d against his creed–

And another:

Poe - The Conquerer Worm http://www.poetryfoundation.org/poem/178359

But see, amid the mimic rout,
A crawling shape intrude!
A blood-red thing that writhes from out
The scenic solitude!
It writhes!—it writhes!—with mortal pangs
The mimes become its food,
And seraphs sob at vermin fangs
In human gore imbued.

Out—out are the lights—out all!
And, over each quivering form,
The curtain, a funeral pall,
Comes down with the rush of a storm,
While the angels, all pallid and wan,
Uprising, unveiling, affirm
That the play is the tragedy, “Man,”
And its hero, the Conqueror Worm.

 

[BearBio]

The lady who cuts my wife's hair has a ranch on the upper green, which is not far from Bondurant. She told my wife that they lost over 360 cows last year to wolf and Grizzly bears. They get paid full market value by the government for each of those cows. Which means that everybody gets to help pay for those cows. I'm sure glad people who do not live in Wyoming, Idaho, and Montana made the decision to bring the wolves back. Sarcasm off.

I gotta call "BS" on that.

According to Wyoming State stats, in 2010 (last year the State has full records for), less than 50 sheep were killed in the state. 2009 (a high point) had less than 200 sheep killed. Figures (reported by the ranchers themselves) show 29 cattle and 33 sheep (again, in 2010) killed in the WHOLE STATE!

You can't argue with the numbers, so let the PERSONAL attacks begin!

Updates: The September, 2014 report from Wyoming WDFG stated 57 animals (LIVESTOCK and DOGS!) were killed (OR INJURED) in 2014.

 

[sixshot]

I don't know how many cattle were actually killed last year but just like the head lines in the paper it was "suspected" surplus Kills on the elk, thats how they always word it, good hell, give me a break! They know exactly how these animals are getting killed, its being going on for years now & its the same evidence & the Idaho, Montana & Wyoming F&G guys see it over & over but the Feds sweep it under the rug as "suspect", the tree huggers laugh it off as another win & so it goes.

If it were their cows, dogs, cattle,sheep, etc. then all the B.S would change in a hurry but they don't have to deal with it, they run it down our throats from 3,000 miles away & then go smoke another joint they bought with their welfare check!!

Dick

 

[BearBio]

Did you know that, in 2010, dogs killed more cattle than wolves in EVERY state where wolves exist?

Google National Farm Census, part of the USDA. They use numbers provided by the ranchers and farmers themselves.

BTW: Their "welfare check" is what pays the ranchers for the "kills". And pays a large part of "rural welfare" (grazing subsidies on Federal land), resulting in fees of $2.34 per AU to graze OUR land.

 

[sixshot]

Who in the hell is talking about 2010!!!! I thought this was 2016, maybe I'm missing something here, but I'm pretty sure I'm zeroed in on which way the wind is blowing on this one & its waaaaayyyy to the leeeeefffffff!!! I know a lot of ranchers but I don't know one thats lost a cow to dogs. There are wolves here & I do know ranchers that have lost cows to wolves, but I must be missing something.

Dick

 

[BearBio]

Maybe you should learn to read. I stated that 2010 was the last year that national statistics were reported and compiled (I could maybe get more recent but don't have the time to spoon feed you).

Maybe because ranchers don't get paid for cattle killed by dogs............ hmmmm................ I doubt if anyone here but me could tell a wolf track from a dog track.

 

[sixshot]

I can read just fine Bear Bio & if you care to bring that spoon over here to Soda Springs, Idaho I'll show you what you can do with it, I'm not hard to find! Its clowns like you that like to say OUR land but forget to say OUR elk. Thats right OUR elk are the one's that got slaughtered. And since 2010, (your figures) there are a lot more wolves & a lot less elk....would you disagree with that. I'm guessing you probably would. Remember, I told you where I live...... Oh, and bring your dog, I know a place where we can let it roam for a few hours, you'll love the results!

Leaving for 5 days to help one of my son's, hope you forum members take good care of Bear Bio, bye bye bio!

Dick

 

[contender]

I was in Idaho in 2010,,, and I personally saw high,,, expensive fences to keep wolves out. AND,,, no dressing or anything where the waste would be left for them to find. It had to be buried, and a backhoe was used to do so. Yes,,, it was a high fence elk hunting farm. And the discussion was about the problems with wolves & all. It was even mentioned,,, that if we saw any wolves,,, maybe they could be mistaken for coyotes.

But,,, all you have to do is dig up the original proposal about the wolf re-introduction, and the proposed "target" numbers of the population of the wolves. NOTHING was proposed about what to do, or HOW to deal with the surplus when that number was reached. And,, if you follow the studies numbers,, you will see that the target numbers have been exceeded. Yet,,, NOTHING is being done to control the wolves.

We NEED wolf control, as well as coyotes, mountain lions, & bears.

 

[warbird1975]

I don't care what some liberal bunny hugger from eastern Washington has to say. I will believe what the lady who lives on the ranch in question has to say.

 

[BearBio]

I don't care what some liberal bunny hugger from eastern Washington has to say. I will believe what the lady who lives on the ranch in question has to say.

"The lady who cuts my wife's hair has a ranch on the upper green, which is not far from Bondurant. She told my wife that they lost over 360 cows last year to wolf and Grizzly bears. They get paid full market value by the government for each of those cows. Which means that everybody gets to help pay for those cows. I'm sure glad people who do not live in Wyoming, Idaho, and Montana made the decision to bring the wolves back. Sarcasm off."

Somebody said "our elk"=yes, yours and MINE!

The NASS (National Agricultural Statistics Service) collects data provided by the RANCHERS, cattlemen's associations and Granges. This is part of the USDA (U.S. Department of Agriculture) which manages for THE USE of resources (I'm keeping it simple for some people from Idaho and Wyoming). Their data on wolf kills runs through 2001, as a published report (more recent data have not been published).

Predator Number of Head % of Total Predators
Coyotes 95,000 64.6
Dogs 26,000 17.7
Mountain Lions & Bobcats 11,000 7.5
Bears 2,800 1.9
Wolves 1,600 1.1
All Other Animals 10,600 7.2

Full report is available at: http://usda.mannlib.cornell.edu/usda/current/CattPredLo/CattPredLo-05-04-2001.pdf

Another report dated 2011 says:
"Cattle and calf losses from animal predators totaled nearly 220 thousand head during 2010. This represented 5.5 percent of the total deaths from all causes and resulted in a loss of $98.5 million to farmers and ranchers. Coyotes and dogs caused the majority of cattle and calf predator losses accounting for 53.1 percent and 9.9 percent respectively"

http://usda.mannlib.cornell.edu/usda/current/CattDeath/CattDeath-05-12-2011.pdf The 2011 report is a short report, not a census

So, on one hand, we have a (possibly non-existent) hairdresser who supposedly lost more cattle on her ranch than the whole state did, who told someone something who told another person something (ever play the part game "telephone? See a correlation here?). She got paid for her losses (enough to enable her to retire, possibly) but did so without reporting it. BTW: Why does she still cut hair if she gets all this money? Of course, cowboys don't make up stories (Pecos Bill was real, wasn't he?)

On the other hand, we have REAL numbers from REAL ranchers, compiled by their own Cattlemen Associations, etc (Of course, no AGENDA there!), who BTW, have many reasons ($$$$$) to inflate the numbers saying something else.

And the glove didn't fit. Amelia Earhart is living in Tahiti.

 

[sixshot]

Poor Bear Bio, I have to wonder if your last name is Clinton, the way you like to juggle numbers to suit your wolfie loving friends almost brings tears to my eyes. And the fact that somehow all of a sudden there are all of these free roaming dog packs killing "OUR" elk is just amazing since I don't remember it happening before the reintroduction of your "wolfies" to the lower 48, which again are not native to the lower 48 like many would like us to believe. These are Canadain Gray wolves, not the Prairie Wolves that were originally here.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure Stevie Wonder could tell a wolf track from a dog track, although it sounds like you can't, maybe its because you EASTERN Washington folks don't have to deal with the problem, but its just fine if we do. Does make it convenient when it comes time for the feds to pay up though doesn't it?

Central Idaho is the largest primitive area in the lower 48 states, wonder how all those dogs happened to get in there & kill all our elk, maybe your 2010 NATIONAL survery could explain that to us.

Getting back to the original topic: 19 elk were slaughtered by wolves, 18 were last years calves & one was a pregnant cow & 77 head have been taken out of that one herd this winter, not one was eaten. ARE YOU OK WITH THAT, YES OR NO!

Dick

 

[don44]

Poor Bear Bio, I have to wonder if your last name is Clinton, the way you like to juggle numbers to suit your wolfie loving friends almost brings tears to my eyes. And the fact that somehow all of a sudden there are all of these free roaming dog packs killing "OUR" elk is just amazing since I don't remember it happening before the reintroduction of your "wolfies" to the lower 48, which again are not native to the lower 48 like many would like us to believe. These are Canadain Gray wolves, not the Prairie Wolves that were originally here.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure Stevie Wonder could tell a wolf track from a dog track, although it sounds like you can't, maybe its because you EASTERN Washington folks don't have to deal with the problem, but its just fine if we do. Does make it convenient when it comes time for the feds to pay up though doesn't it?

Central Idaho is the largest primitive area in the lower 48 states, wonder how all those dogs happened to get in there & kill all our elk, maybe your 2010 NATIONAL survery could explain that to us.

Getting back to the original topic: 19 elk were slaughtered by wolves, 18 were last years calves & one was a pregnant cow & 77 head have been taken out of that one herd this winter, not one was eaten. ARE YOU OK WITH THAT, YES OR NO!

Dick

+100

 

[BearBio]

Can't read and doesn't know geography......poor baby! Get out of your trailer park sometime!!!!

Eastern Washington wolf packs (as of March, 2016):

Carpenter Ridge
•Diamond
•Dirty Shirt
•Goodman Meadows
•Huckleberry
•Nc'icn
•Profanity Peak
•Salmo
•Smackout
•Strawberry
•Tucannon
•Wedge
•Whitestone
•Lookout
•Teanaway
•Wenatchee

By the way, I will be driving through the range/territory of two of these this PM to attend a meeting. One of these has come down within City Limits where I live. These do not include wandering individuals like those on Badger Mountain, Wenas Wildlife Area, Yakima Basin, Satus Pass, Snoqualmie Pass areas.

Oh, and I've seen wolf tracks within City Limits.

Wolves were re-introduced into Idaho in 1995. Figures for that year show:
"Coyotes were the largest cause of cattle and calf predator losses at 69,350 head
or 59 percent of the total loss to predators. The value of coyote losses was
$21.8 million. Dogs were the second leading cause of predator losses,
accounting for 19 percent of predator losses."

Any more B.S.??? This is FUN!

 

[Colonialgirl]

Can't read and doesn't know geography......poor baby! Get out of your trailer park sometime!!!!

Eastern Washington wolf packs (as of March, 2016):

Carpenter Ridge
•Diamond
•Dirty Shirt
•Goodman Meadows
•Huckleberry
•Nc'icn
•Profanity Peak
•Salmo
•Smackout
•Strawberry
•Tucannon
•Wedge
•Whitestone
•Lookout
•Teanaway
•Wenatchee

By the way, I will be driving through the range/territory of two of these this PM to attend a meeting. One of these has come down within City Limits where I live. These do not include wandering individuals like those on Badger Mountain, Wenas Wildlife Area, Yakima Basin, Satus Pass, Snoqualmie Pass areas.

Oh, and I've seen wolf tracks within City Limits.

Wolves were re-introduced into Idaho in 1995. Figures for that year show:
"Coyotes were the largest cause of cattle and calf predator losses at 69,350 head
or 59 percent of the total loss to predators. The value of coyote losses was
$21.8 million. Dogs were the second leading cause of predator losses,
accounting for 19 percent of predator losses."

Any more B.S.??? This is FUN!

Never heard of Coyotes attacking Cattle and calves and I had grand parents and uncles that lived in Oklahoma; I suspect that those statistics are the same type of government male bovine deposits as "Global Warming" and "Sea Rise" is from NOAA.