SR9c -- CZ

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fossils and guns

Single-Sixer
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Dec 9, 2008
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NW Arkansas
I have an SR9 and a XDM Compact, and finally talked myself into getting the SR9C... and I like it better than both guns mentioned above!! Ruger got it right with this gun, I am extremely impressed.

Now can anyone recommend a CZ pistol or two? I want a compact and a full size (5in), any help would be greatly appreciated, as I don't post on other sites.
 
Really glad you like your SR9c. Mine's been absolutely great!

Rev will be by shortly to tell you everything you need to know about CZ's. :wink:

Personally, for the full-size, I don't think you can go wrong with the CZ75. As far as the compact... depends what you consider a compact. Maybe the P01 if you want a "large" compact or the RAMI 2075(right number? off the top of my head) if you want something smaller. Cz's seem to be great pistols from what I hear. I've only fondled. Haven't fired, but I'd like to get my hands on a CZ75 sometime.
 
May I suggest a EAA Witmess Match? Made by Tanfoglio in Italy these are CZ clones but those of us who own them call them CZ's improved. Available in 9, 40, 10mm, 45acp and 38 super, easily and inexpensively convertable from one cal to another. There's a LOT to be said for these lesser know weapons, guess that's why I own two of them.
http://www.eaacorp.com/handguns-witness-elite-match-description.html
Good luck with your search.
Sal
 
ArmedinAZ said:
Sal1950 said:
May I suggest a EAA Witmess Match? Made by Tanfoglio in Italy these are CZ clones but those of us who own them call them CZ's improved.
Sal
Click to expand...

I'm really curious about the "CZ improved" thing. Explain.
Click to expand...

LOL ! I was thinking the same thing, AIA !!! I've handled a few of the Tanfoglio guns, and they are indeed a very nice copy of the CZ75 platform. In my opinion, much like everybody 'copies' the COLT 1911, most consider the COLT to be the one to beat. The same thing goes for the CZ's as well. That's the first time I ever heard anyone imply that the CZ75's aren't at the head of the class in terms of quality and reliability.

It's also not fair to compare a 'worked' gun, which I imagine the Witness 'MATCH' is .... to an out of the box 75B. Given the same tweaking, I have zero doubt that the CZ75 would again be at the top of the class.

I almost bought a Tanfolgio TZ75 Special edition, which had a two tone frame and adjustable sights. It was a VERY nice gun. I didn't buy it on the spot because I wanted to do some research on it prior to buying it, and from the very limited research I did, I found out that Tanfoglio has a VERY bad reputation for a horrendous customer service, which can easily be verified on the net, and because of that I passed on the gun. This is not to say that there's anything at all wrong with the Tanfoglios ... I really liked the ones that I've handled.

So ... from the standpoint of 'CZ Improved', I guess you could say that if the gun (Tanfoglio) in question was worked and tweaked, over and above a standard CZ75(B) model. But given the same upgrades to two given guns ... one CZ and one Tanfoglio, I doubt that you could still use that terminology.

I always liked the EAA Witness line/platform, but Tanfoglio's bad reputation for customer service has kept me from actually buying one.



To the OP. If I were looking at CZ's ..... I'd definitely look at the bone stock CZ75B for a range and/or carry gun, or the SP01 if you want higher capacity and mega tacticool looks, the CZ75B compact for carry, or any of the other METAL CZ's. Personally, I never liked the RAMI or ANY of the plastic CZ's.

Cheese will be along shortly too, I'm sure, with his great advice .... he's got a whole safe full of 'em.

http://www.czforumsite.info/index.php?topic=29244.0

and a few about customer service ... not so good ....

http://www.thehighroad.us/showthread.php?t=117477
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=190252
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080313113159AATXprE
https://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=1162937
http://thefiringline.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-6691.html
http://206.125.47.52/showthread.php?t=379111

REV
 
"It's also not fair to compare a 'worked' gun"
It's fair when the two weapons cost almost the same $)

The "improved" part really comes from the fact that the whole Witness line are built on an enlarged/strengthened frame compared to the CZ. This allows building the entire range of calipers from 45/10mm down on the same base frame/slide, makes for an incredibly strong weapon.
The other part would be "bang for the buck". For around the same money as a base CZ75B ($660 USD MSRP, around $100 less street price) with the Elite Match you get,

Tanfoglio custom shop build quality
Match grade 4 3/4" barrel
Match level SAO trigger
Trigger is adjustable for pre-travel and over-travel
Fully adjustable rear sight and interchangeable front blade
Extended safety and mag releases
More

" In my opinion, much like everybody 'copies' the COLT 1911, most consider the COLT to be the one to beat."
Very true perception by the general public, but would you as an educated gun enthusiast consider a Colt better than Wilson, Volkmann, Les Baer, Caspian, STI, etc.
There are inferior clones and there are those that have improved on the original.

"I always liked the EAA Witness line/platform, but Tanfoglio's bad reputation for customer service has kept me from actually buying one."

Not Tanfoglio, but true enough about their importer/distributor EAA.
The personal experience I've had with them when ordering parts, etc: has been great but I am aware of the troubles some have posted on the web. I know they tend to be strict in their warranty polices on altered/abused weapons and there is aways two sides to every story posted on the internet. But bottom line is they're no Ruger, but then again who is. ;)

Really just trying to make the point the if the OP is interested in a CZ75 platform gun he really should take the time to check out the options from EAA and decide for himself which best fit his needs.
Cheers
Sal
 
Sal1950 said:
Really just trying to make the point the if the OP is interested in a CZ75 platform gun he really should take the time to check out the options from EAA and decide for himself which best fit his needs.
Cheers
Sal
Click to expand...

Fair enough Sal, I agree with that assessment ... as I said, I like the Tanfoglio/Witness guns ... the only thing that kept me from buying one was the persistent complaints about customer service. However I don't think the price is quite as equal as you're saying. I can buy brand new CZ75B's where I am for $525 every day of the week. Can you REALLY get a custom shop Witness for that ?? If you can document that, I'd be real interested in getting one !!!

I have no doubt that they're great guns as well.

Regarding 1911's .... I've never had much respect for the 'boutique' builders like Baer, Wilson, etc, etc. Many start with COLT frames anyway, and it takes a helluva shooter to be able to tell the SHOOTING differences between ... say a Colt Gold Cup National Match, and any of the boutique 1911's. I've always considered the high end boutique 1911's pretty much a waste of money, and I can buy any of them.

You can get a great 1911 for $1000 that doesn't need a thing ... why pay $2500-3500 ? I'm not into all the extra doo-dads, add ons, and stupid machining that most of the boutique builders try to make people think is necessary. Would I buy one of the $2500-3500 boutique 1911's ????? Sure I would ..... for $1000. :D

Great discussion !!! Cheers to you as well, my friend !!!

REV
 
Sal1950 said:
with the Elite Match you get,

Tanfoglio custom shop build quality
Match grade 4 3/4" barrel
Match level SAO trigger
Trigger is adjustable for pre-travel and over-travel
Fully adjustable rear sight and interchangeable front blade
Extended safety and mag releases
Click to expand...

Now THAT alone would make me look at the Witnesses !

Here's an excellent article about the EAA ....

http://www.gunweek.com/2006/feature0910.html

REV
 
I pretty much agree with your thoughts on the "boutique" builders but you got to admit the general fit & finish for this group is truly outstanding, that's what you pay the big bucks for, that and bragging rights on how much you $ spent. LOL
If I were in the market for a new 1911 and being the cheapskate I am, IMHO the best bang for the buck that would include the features important to me would be a Springfield Loaded at about 1K.
Sal
 
Sal1950 said:
If I were in the market for a new 1911 and being the cheapskate I am, IMHO the best bang for the buck that would include the features important to me would be a Springfield Loaded at about 1K.
Sal
Click to expand...

Not sure if you're an anti-COLT guy or not, but the current Colt Gold Cup Trophy's are available for about $950 delivered. I've personally shot 3 or 4 of the new CGC's and I can tell you that I've never seen a bad one. I have 2 series 80 CGC's and friends have 70 series CGC's, and the new ones are every bit as good.

Anybody who says the current Colts aren't good guns is talking hogwash.

I also like the entire Springfield line as well, although if I was in the $1000 range, I'd be buying Colt. At about $550-575 the Springfield MilSpec is the only gun to buy IMO at that price point. I've been eyeing a 9MM Loaded from Springfield, but I've talked to several people at my range recently who own them and aren't impressed. I may have to re-think that and look more closely at the Spartans.

REV
 
Thanks for the advice 'Rev, I've heard you were the CZ guru so I'll take your advice very seriously. And thanks to the rest of you who posted as well!
 
fossils and guns said:
Thanks for the advice 'Rev, I've heard you were the CZ guru so I'll take your advice very seriously. And thanks to the rest of you who posted as well!
Click to expand...

Thanks FG, but I'd say Cheesewhiz is the CZ Guru. I really like them, but CW knows a lot more than I do ... he's got a whole bunch of 'em. He'll be checking in shortly I'm sure.

REV
 
I had a CZ Rami-P and wasn't impressed. I think the SR9c is a better gun. That being said, nothing fits my hand like a CZ75. I think the SP-01, P-01 are both great guns. The ergo's on CZ75's is great, point naturally.
If you intend to do some competitive shooting, the CZ75 Combat would be a good choice as the trigger has fewer parts, is smoother and more easily polished for a truly great trigger.
 
Hi Guys, I'm sitting in Brasil right now, finally got a good internet connection.

G&F, I agree with you, if I carried around a pistol concelled, I would choose the SR9c over a CZ RAMI and that's saying alot because the RAMI is a pretty damn good gun.

I do like CZ's alot and have a :D few, for a very nice full sized gun and it is really full sized and weights it, The SP-01 is hard to beat.
The CZ75B's are great guns and somewhat less expensive.

If you want a combat/tactical type based full sized pistol that is absolutely accurate with probably the best DA/SA trigger out there, get a CZ SP-01 Shadow but they no longer offer the original CZ custom shop Shadow, it is now the CZ SP-01 Shadow Target w/ adjustable rear sights.
That gun approaches some target gun prices and I really plan on buying one at some point but you can get a stock SP-01 for around $600

Speaking of target guns CZ makes some real nice ones, full blown options, single action triggers, really well made, fairly expensive. I don't own any, I like my guns nowadays to be more streetable in type.

CZ compact line, P-01, CZ75 Compacts are very nice compact guns and really well made, I own two P-01's and they stay loaded all the time, very reliable and very accurate for a compact.

As far as EAA guns that are CZ clones, I have recommended them before and have shot them and I like them.

...but as Rev said, their customer service really has a terrible rep.

I do like that they offer multi-caliber centerfire conversions for almost all their guns and I would never tell someone not to buy one but I would probably get a used one as their resale value isn't strong so you can get used ones at a good price.


...and no I'm not a salesman but I forgot to mention that many CZ pistol models can be had as decocker only.
 
I'm headed off to the shop right now to pick up my new Witness Match. Thanks a lot, Sal. ;)

Rev, you gotta check them out. The SA trigger is really sweet. It sold me on the spot. This is from a guy who had a Sig P226 Elite on order until I canceled it due to Sig taking forever to build the gun. That's comparing a $550 gun to an $1100 one.

I too saw the Interweb posts on EAA customer service, or rather disservice, or the lack thereof. Oh well. It's a gamble I was willing to take. Of the 100 or so guns I've owned in my life very few have needed post-sale factory support. Besides, since these are CZ clones anyone who can work on a CZ can work on a Witness, and most CZ parts will fit. And finally, I'm getting mine through Davidson's, with a lifetime replacement warranty on top of whatever I get from EAA. I've also read of people dealing directly with Tanfoglio in Italy and getting better service than from EAA. Note too that most of the complaints I read were from as far back as 2005; Who knows what the story is today.

This is my second evil clone; The first being an AR-24. The AR is a good combat gun, and I like the ergos and styling more than the base CZ75B. The Witness is indeed a bit bigger, but not as big as a CZ97 (the .45ACP CZ). Tanfoglio puts everything from a 9mm to a 10mm on the same frame. And as logic would have it, many of the afore-mentioned customer service complaints I read about dealt with 10mms and cracked frames. Hmmm...

Now that I think about it, this'll actually be my third clone: I owned a MR Baby Eagle many moons ago.

A friend of mine just picked up a new CZ75B a week or so ago, and it now comes with what they call the Omega trigger, which apparently lets the owner switch between the standard safety and a decocker. That's kinda cool. Like everything else, there are lovers and haters of the new trigger.

I'll have a chance to compare my evil clones to the "real thing" this coming weekend. I already know the AR-24 feels better to me than the CZ.

-- Sam
 
It's not too bad in my G20, why, do you know something that I don't ?? :D Or are you just referring to the fact that it's the same caliber as .40 ?

REV
 
Sam, Congrats on the new Match, know your going to love it.

Nice thing about 10mm in the Match is the weapons so large and heavy I think the recoil seems about the same as my SR9C. :)
Get my best groupings with it in either ,40 or 10mm using 170g lead SWC's from Missouri Bullet Co.
Sal
 
I have a CZ 75D Compact, also called the P01. It has an aluminum frame, and has about the finest construction of any semiauto I have owned.
I cannot say one bad thing about it. Oops, yeah, the trigger is a very long pull although it can be remedied somewhat by factory or third parties.
Very accurate, beautiful gun, ultra-reliable.
I shoot it very little, however. I carry, and shoot my Glocks primarily. I scratch my head on this one. Of course, I've had ten Glocks over the last 10-15 years and trust them a bunch. This is my first CZ.
I don't want a CZ RAMI due to the short barrel.
I think you should check out the P01. This link will give you a clue as to just how good these CZ's actually are.
http://cz-usa.com/products/by-category/handguns/
sonnytoo
 
I strongly recommend the CZ75. A fellow member here steered me there and he was 100% correct.

Also, speaking of EAA ~ don't laugh but ~ a co-worker just bought his first semi-auto. He picked up (stole?) a new-looking EAA EZ-9 for $250.00 and WOW what a very nice 9MM!
 
hittman said:
I strongly recommend the CZ75. A fellow member here steered me there and he was 100% correct.

Also, speaking of EAA ~ don't laugh but ~ a co-worker just bought his first semi-auto. He picked up (stole?) a new-looking EAA EZ-9 for $250.00 and WOW what a very nice 9MM!
Click to expand...
The Witness is one of the truly amazing values still out there right now. I'm assuming that "EZ-9" was used, but still. Under $500 for a NIB, all-steel, well made semi auto is amazing.

The CZ is a good deal in itself. And yeah, I've been looking at those P01s since they came out. Hard to justify yet another carry gun, though. I was looking at the SP01 Tactical Sport, but then the Witness Match caught my eye, at half the price.

-- Sam
 
fossils and guns said:
Now can anyone recommend a CZ pistol or two? I want a compact and a full size (5in), any help would be greatly appreciated, as I dont post on other sites.
Click to expand...

Ahh thats easy, the CZ75PO1 9mm is the best 9mm made(other then the G-17). Mine easily out performs my sig 226, in fact its the only compact pistol that I have ever fired a sub 1-inch free standing group from the 25-yard line with. Too bad you didnt grab one a year or two ago, before the dollar collapsed, you could have obtained one NIB for under $500.00....Now, the same pistol is going for $700.00 +...Nonetheless, its ergonomics, fit, finish, function, and accuracy remain absolutely top shelf, to my mind its one of the two best field grade 9mm pistols currently produced on the planet. I highly recommend it to you.
 
Sol said:
Too bad you didnt grab one a year or two ago, before the dollar collapsed, you could have obtained one NIB for under $500.00....Now, the same pistol is going for $700.00 +...
Click to expand...

???????????? :?

http://czcustom.com/CZ-P01-9mm.aspx
 
Sol said:
in fact its the only compact pistol that I have ever fired a sub 1-inch free standing group from the 25-yard line with.
Click to expand...

Here we go again !!! :D

REV
 
Cheesewhiz said:
Sol said:
Too bad you didnt grab one a year or two ago, before the dollar collapsed, you could have obtained one NIB for under $500.00....Now, the same pistol is going for $700.00 +...
Click to expand...

???????????? :?

http://czcustom.com/CZ-P01-9mm.aspx
Click to expand...

Agreed ..... :roll:

REV
 
Cheesewhiz said:
revhigh said:
Sol said:
in fact its the only compact pistol that I have ever fired a sub 1-inch free standing group from the 25-yard line with.
Click to expand...

Here we go again !!! :D

REV
Click to expand...

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Yeah, I saw that, didn't know what to say.
Click to expand...

Anyone can do anything once.

Proof: A couple of summers ago I took an 81 year old friend out to shoot the 45. He hadn't shot one since Army days and told me stories about how bad he shot. I put a nice big target up and we stood at 10 yards. He waved around so much I didn't think he'd hit the same zip code but he snapped the first one off and it hit dead center bullseye. He said he guessed he still remembered how to shoot. :shock: :wink:

The trick is to repeat the trick. :?
 
ArmedinAZ said:
Anyone can do anything once.

he jerked the first one off and it hit dead center bullseye.
Click to expand...

Yeah that's true ... at least it wasn't followed by something like 'all day long' ....

You WERE shooting GUNS, right, Jeff ??? LOL :D

REV
 
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