Sentimental Journey

[David LaPell]

Yesterday I took my wife and son to the see the B-17 Flying Fortress known as Sentimental Journey as it traveled into our local airport. It doesn't come here often, I think this is the first time in three years since it has been here and since maintaining and keeping these fine airplanes in flying condition costs so much, one never knows if they will see it again. They plan on having flights later this week so hopefully we can go back and get a few glimpses of her on take off and landing, I have seen this one and another B-17 in flight before and its a sight to behold. I can hardly imagine seeing an entire flight of these crossing into Europe over the English channel during World War II.

 

[Ale-8(1)]

Wonderful aircraft!!

The Memphis Belle will be flying out of the Cincinnati Lunken Airport this weekend, July 26/27.

You can get a ride for $450 per person. Wonder if that even covers the fuel?

 

[Mike Armstrong]

I assume they put those models with the "chin" turret at the front of their box to deal with the head-on attacks that some Germans favored. Or did all B-17s have this at some point?

Truly beautiful plane; great pix!

My ancient brother and I were running a truckload of his guns and ammo from his former home in VA to his retirement home in Washington State about 5 years ago when a B-17 came in for a landing at the airport in Billings, MT. It flew right down the Interstate on its way into town and I suspect about 200 drivers ducked when they saw it in the rear view mirror. I KNOW I did!

 

[Rick Courtright]

Hi,

Thanks for the pictures! I didn't realize how many B-17s are still active, but here's one list (there are 14 aircraft on this one, some claim 15 planes are still flying. On this list, they talk about the Boeing Bee being "flyable" but she may never fly again.):

http://www.johnweeks.com/b17active/b17missangela.html

I've seen Miss Angela several times, parked at Palm Springs. That's impressive enough. But they take her out fairly regularly, too. A buddy and I were out hiking in one of the canyons not far away when she came right up the canyon over our heads. It was a steep climb to make sure she cleared the top, and both the sight and sound were amazing! As someone already commented, it's hard to imagine 100s of those aircraft overhead at once. A late friend's Dad served on a ground crew in England, and told a few stories when he was still with us... again, amazing!

Rick C

 

[Pierow]

Great pictures David. The designs of things and why have always made me curious noting the candy-striped shrouds above. My guess is they are cut that way to direct the gases away from the other gun? Anyone know?

 

[contender]

The beauty of these old birds is unmatched anymore.
Thanks!

 

[6GUNSONLY]

Incredible. I visited the Air Force Armament Museum near Ft. Walton Beach Florida a few weeks ago, but they didn't have a B-17. Had B-24s and 25s, though, and a lot of other cool stuff.

 

[Jim Puke]

That certainly is a beauty.

 

[FastEd]

Wonderful aircraft!!

The Memphis Belle will be flying out of the Cincinnati Lunken Airport this weekend, July 26/27.

You can get a ride for $450 per person. Wonder if that even covers the fuel?

I think the original "Memphis Belle" is still in the shop at the A/F Museum being fully restored. My no. 4 grandson and I toured the "Sentimental Journey" a few years ago at the Wright Brothers Airport. It was on the assembly line the day the WWII was over. Never flown in combat, so it was in new condition. The crew was very accommodating.

 

[street]

I sure do like the pictures of the old "War Birds". Here a some pictures of the new "War Birds" in flight

 

[WendyZXZ]

Those are great aircraft pictures!

 

[Rick Courtright]

You can get a ride for $450 per person. Wonder if that even covers the fuel?

Hi,

I read a comment somewhere that these aircraft flew on "oil, gas and money!" Only operating cost I've found so far is a fuel consumption figure of 200 gal/hr. Is $8/gal a fair price for avgas these days? If so, that $450 covers about fifteen minutes!

Rick C

 

[Wyandot Jim]

Rick,
A Wright 1820 probably burns more like 40-45 GPH at around $5.00-7.00 per gal. That fuel burn would be at low power setting.

Mike Armstrong,
The Chin turret was installed on the G Model but some F models also had it.
Yes you are correct the Germans figured out that the tail attack was to dangerous with the fire power that a BOX of B-17 could generate.
The head on attack which was known as a Pursuit Curve attack. The Fighters would station ahead and High of the bombers then turn a 180 and dive for a frontal high speed attack through the formation with would consist of a Bm Squadron. A box consisted of one squadron of 12-14 planes I think with 4 squadrons to a Group.
When you see the German gun camera films of a tail approach notice that it is always just one a plane attack meaning a straggler. Now way would they attack a tight box from the rear. There would be at least 56, 50 cals shooting at them

I have seen a lot of B-17s and yes when they were still flying in the USAF, But Sentimental Journey is without a doubt the best. Unfortunately I have not seen her yet.

 

[Brules]

I recently met a B17 pilot that flew in England, Germany and Holland. He has amazing stories of his time in Europe. I believe his plane was "Little Jennie".

 

[Rick Courtright]

Rick,
A Wright 1820 probably burns more like 40-45 GPH at around $5.00-7.00 per gal. That fuel burn would be at low power setting.

Hi, Jim

That's just for one of them, though, isn't it? Times four, with a full load and a little serious throttle involved (like watching Miss Angela climbing out of the canyon above Palm Springs), total fuel consumption for the aircraft could easily be in that 200 GPH range, no? Gotta admit, though, $5 to $7/gal for avgas ALMOST sounds like a bargain when we're "down" to $4 (from about $4.30 a couple of weeks ago) for 87 octane auto gas out here!

Rick C

 

[Highstandardguy]

What a beautiful aircraft, and Betty's looking pretty good too!

 

[Wyandot Jim]

Yep that is for just one eng. at nice cruise speed of 160-170 mph. Add load and say 200mph and burn does go up a bunch.
The price for Avgas at or field is $4.50 Which is cheap. At the bigger airports you will pay the $6-7.00 range. A lot of it depends on the shipping cost and the fee the the owner of the airport adds on. Very few refineries make avgas. For instance we live within 50 miles of a lot of refineries but our gas comes from Beaumont 140-150 miles away
There is such a small demand for avgas that the refineries don't want to mess with it. It also contains LEAD which is a pain for them

Here is the fuel burn info. As you can see it depends on the HP being used. Most of the time we run an eng, at 75% for a normal cruise. For economy gut way back say to 50-60%
R1820G Cyclone engine permitted a rating of 1,000 hp at take-off with a weight in certain models of 1.07 pounds per horsepower and fuel consumption of .43 pounds per horsepower at cruising speed.

One Gal of Avgas weighs 6#

A hell of and Engine.

 

[Snake45]

I'm not a huge B-17 fan--it's not that I dislike them, there are just a few dozen other airplanes I happen to like better--but I think there is something absolutely majestic about them, some intangible, charismatic factor that very, very few other airplanes possess.

 

[Wyandot Jim]

I'm not a huge B-17 fan--it's not that I dislike them, there are just a few dozen other airplanes I happen to like better--but I think there is something absolutely majestic about them, some intangible, charismatic factor that very, very few other airplanes possess.

Yep just to see them rumble over at 800-1000' at about 120 MPH or so. When they come to a field at close my airport to hop passengers, they fly over us a lot.

 

[Ruger Packer]

Rick,
A Wright 1820 probably burns more like 40-45 GPH at around $5.00-7.00 per gal. That fuel burn would be at low power setting.

Mike Armstrong,
The Chin turret was installed on the G Model but some F models also had it.
Yes you are correct the Germans figured out that the tail attack was to dangerous with the fire power that a BOX of B-17 could generate.
The head on attack which was known as a Pursuit Curve attack. The Fighters would station ahead and High of the bombers then turn a 180 and dive for a frontal high speed attack through the formation with would consist of a Bm Squadron. A box consisted of one squadron of 12-14 planes I think with 4 squadrons to a Group.
When you see the German gun camera films of a tail approach notice that it is always just one a plane attack meaning a straggler. Now way would they attack a tight box from the rear. There would be at least 56, 50 cals shooting at them

I have seen a lot of B-17s and yes when they were still flying in the USAF, But Sentimental Journey is without a doubt the best. Unfortunately I have not seen her yet.

I have a cousin who was a tailgunner in a B-17 stationed at Rattlesden AB, England. He survived 35 missions. He has stated that there were a handful of times that he wondered if they'd make it back.

 

[timnc]

Beautiful photos of a great old airplane. Odd story: In 1947 I flew in a B-17 from Saun Juan,PR to British Guiana together with my mother & 2 mo. old sister. This had been converted as a "ferry plane" to carry cargo and 3-4 passengers around the Caribbean. We were joining my dad who was assigned to the hospital at a British air field used by USAAF during WWll as part of the lend-lease program. During the flight, I was invited to come forward and had the opportunity to view the Caribbean Sea from the bombardier's seat. Needless to say, that was an experience of a lifetime. Now, fast forward 50 years. My son is going through the USAF test pilot school at Edwards AFB and as part of their aircraft orientation he got to take the controls of a B-17. Sometimes it's a strange and interesting world.

 

[Rick Courtright]

How can you NOT get a lump in your throat when you see one?

Hi,

DB, I think anybody who has a soul has shared that lump in the throat about a number of things in life!

I wish I had more stories, but as with so many ol' WWII vets, they weren't readily forthcoming: a late friend's Dad, who's also gone now, served with the 8th in England. He was on a ground crew, and wouldn't say much about his service there. He did mention once how hard it was to send the guys out, knowing how many would never make it back. And how so many of them who did musta been held up by nothing short of the wings of angels... That was about as much as he'd say. I miss 'em both.

Just an aside, PLEASE get as many stories as you can from the gentleman you've been working with! He's got to speak for untold numbers of his brothers in arms whose stories are forever untold...

Rick C

 

[Ruger Packer]

The pictures posted show a plane with polished gleaming aluminum skin. But every war time picture I have ever seen shows a plane that is olive drab. Were the planes painted before or after they arrived in Europe???? :?

 

[Snake45]

Snake said there's something majestic about seeing a B-17 flying overhead.

- DixieBoy

I did not. Go back and read what I said again. Please don't tell me you're coming down with Liberal Reading Comprehension Disorder! :shock:

 

[Snake45]

The pictures posted show a plane with polished gleaming aluminum skin. But every war time picture I have ever seen shows a plane that is olive drab. Were the planes painted before or after they arrived in Europe???? :?

You must not have seen very many wartime B-17 pictures. There were thousands of unpainted ones in action. We quit painting most* USAAF warplanes about mid-1944, to save time, money, weight, and because it was deemed no longer necessary.

The olive drab B-17s and B-24s were painted that way from the factory. SOME "silver" P-47s, P-51s, P-38s, and B-26s received full or partial camo paint in the field, but most didn't.

*All A-20 Havocs and P-61 Black Widows were delivered painted till the end of the war--those never left the factory in bare metal, for some reason. I think most of the C-46s and C-47s also continued to wear olive drab. And of course with very rare exceptions, all USN/USMC aircraft wore blue camo of one sort or another throughout the war.

 

[Mike Armstrong]

Jim, thanks for the gunnery details! I have been shot at by ONE "Ma-Deuce" (long story of mis-spent youth) and I wouldn't want a whole "box" of em shooting at ME! You tend to concentrate on the tracers and forget what's in between them....if you're lucky!