Palmetto State Armory, too much tech.

[blume357]

PSA got me with one of their many email promotions and for some reason I ordered another AR lower from them. Keep in mind they have a store here in town and so there is no transfer fee... and the lower was on a clearance sale, at least the email add claimed that. A few years back I had also bought a lower from them and it was a real challenge when I went to pick it up.... they have gone high tech and you actually fill out the 4473 form on a computer... that just about threw me a couple years ago... now it all even more high tech and is a touch screen.

So, this is how it works... you go in the store and show the guy at the gun counter your paper work for what you are going to pick up... he then proceeds to fill out some paper work from your order and copies your D.L. and CWP.... and then he goes to the back and finds your 'gun' brings it out and shows it to you. This takes about 5 or 10 minutes... then he takes you over to a counter with about 6 computer screens and hands the gun and paperwork to one of the young guys behind the counter.... the good thing is these guys help you fill out the 4473 on the screen. they are watching for when you get stuck, seems this is pretty common.... took me probably about only another 10 minutes with two guys helping me to fill the form out... then there is some weird thing where they send that back to somewhere else and they then get a special number you have to punch in and then you can finally sign the form on the screen... then they hand you one of the disc with LED lights on it like some restaurants have to say your table or food is ready and you wander around for a few more minutes waiting for the thing to go off.... when it does you can go back to the counter and get your gun and finally leave...... took something like 45 minutes to an hour.

I guess I'm just old... I like my FFL down the road from me..... I walk in tell them what I want, they go get it and show it to me and I fill out the paper work form which takes me all of two minutes.... I know the answer to the questions are ...first one 'yes'... all the rest 'no'. they take the paper work back... I pay them their transfer fee and they hand me the gun and I leave...trying not to look at the other hand guns on display as I do.... maybe all o 20 minutes if we get to talking....

 

[XUSNORDIE]

My favorite LGS has been using laptops for the 4473 and State forms for several years now. I love it. I'm in and out of there within 10-15 min. They only have four laptops though and sometimes it can take longer when busy. I only know of one LGS that still does hand written forms and it's normally a Charley Foxtrot getting out of there.

As for PSA...they get a ton of my money every month.....especially since they went with the Sezzle program.

 

[Mobuck]

Sounds a bit like the hoop jumping at Silencer Shop but with assistance. Good thing/bad thing: it's not something we do frequently.
I had some bits and pieces of excess plumbing parts to return to Menards but of course had lost the receipts. No problem just scan your 'Big Card' and then enter the SKU. After several failed attempts, the customer service person came to my rescue. My level of patience wore thin before the process was complete.

 

[s4s4u]

They have a similar system at Scheels. My usual FFL still uses paper and the phone.

 

[GunnyGene]

You are required to comply with the AI. It knows what's best.

 

[the_leper_colony]

I prefer paper - except on the rare occassions when I get distracted, screw something up on the paper form, and have to start over (I imagine corrections are easier on the digital forms)! They seem to change the 4473s just often enough that I don't assume it's "the same old form" when I'm filling one out; most recently, they seem to have gotten more convoluted regarding immigration status and "straw buyer" provisions...
:)

 

[krw]

 

[Sam Summey]

I still do and will always do paper 4473 forms. The dealer still has to print it off and store the forms for eternity plus the instructions. I'd rather use ATFE ink and paper than my paper and ink. I just bought new cartridges for the 845 Epson @$32 each at Sam's Warehouse.

 

[gunzo]

Have signed out guns like that at Ky. Gun Co. & Rural King. The Ky. Gun transaction went reasonably smooth considering I wasn't an Ipad or Iphone user at the time.
Rural King was just a time consuming mess. The touch screen went ok but then the clerk starts checking info & entering it into another machine then calling a manager & them doing the same all over again. They get so busy with it they have to call in another employee to work the counter. If I hadn't gotten there early that day I could've been held up for an hour or 2. Not real likely I buy a gun from them in the future.


While I was waiting & watching I thought that if they feared something that much they probably shouldn't be engaged in it. Selling baby ducks & dog food more up their alley.

 

[Fox Mike]

My LGS uses the same thing. I have to file an electronic State form on the computer at home then I get a PIN number. I give that # to the dealer, fill put the 4473 on his laptop type item, and am in and out in on time.

 

[Geronimo Jim]

Was going to buy gun at local shop and told me to fill out form on computer.
The programming sucked......put in date and you had to manually put in the
spaces between dates............etc. Very frustrating....I finally just quit and told them
I didn't need the gun and left.

 

[GasGuzzler]

Had to look up what a 4473 is.

 

[Mike J]

A couple of weeks ago I bought a gun from a local FFL for the first time in a long time. They had me fill out the 4473 on a computer. It did take a little longer but wasn't a huge hassle. I was working close to the shop & went straight from work so I was in & out quickly as I was the customer there at the time.
For several years I have been ordering online & using a FFL in a hardware store that doesn't sell guns to do the transfer. I did the math. On my last purchase it didn't really make sense to go through the hassle.

 

[Armybrat]

Had to look up what a 4473 is.

Oh, you like to do your gun shopping at Gilberto Lopez’s old van with paper plates in the alley behind your local 7/11?
Cool. :D

 

[GasGuzzler]

Kinda of ... if we had 7-Elevens up here. Never bought a gun from a Mexican but I have had one stolen. Pretty much every one came from a white man in his 60's or 70's.

 

[RoninPA]

I still do and will always do paper 4473 forms. The dealer still has to print it off and store the forms for eternity plus the instructions. I'd rather use ATFE ink and paper than my paper and ink. I just bought new cartridges for the 845 Epson @$32 each at Sam's Warehouse.

Sam, I'm like you, I have never done anything other than the paper 4473's. I'm like you, why waste my paper and ink. The ATF will send the forms to me at no cost and when I purge them (I keep the last 5 years worth of 4473's handy) I put them in a box, seal it up and store it in the garage attic. When I get out of the business I'll call my regional IOI's and tell them that if the ATF wants my 4473's they can come get them or send me prepaid shipping labels.

Even doing the paper forms (PA has a specific form for handguns, SBR's and SBS's), I can transfer a firearm to a buyer in less than 15 minutes and that includes the time for the PA background check (either by phone or computer).

Folks - DO NOT ASSUME that the 4473 you are filling out is the same as the last one you did. They do get changed and I tell all my customers to be careful, read all the questions before answering. Yes, you can scratch it out, remark it and initial/date your mistake but if you don't and I miss it when I review the form, we both can get into trouble. I tell them that if you have any questions about the question, let me know ao I can explain it before you answer. For some reason people don't understand the first question "Are you the actual transferee/buyer..." (because they don't take the time to read the explanation THAT IS PRINTED ON THE FORM!)

 

[Yaworski]

I've used the "computer 4473" a few times. The damned clerk hovers and makes sure that you're doing it right. I suppose it save storage space but I'd rather have paper.

 

[Yaworski]

While I was waiting & watching I thought that if they feared something that much they probably shouldn't be engaged in it. Selling baby ducks & dog food more up their alley.

I bought my Tisas 1911 at Rural King. Didn't have any problems with paperwork but as I recall, I wasn't allowed to examine the gun. The clerk showed it to me but I couldn't handle it or dry fire it or anything. Very strange.

 

[larry8]

I've used both and found that once you become familiar with the computer 4473, It wont take any longer to use it over a paper form.

 

[RoninPA]

I've used both and found that once you become familiar with the computer 4473, It wont take any longer to use it over a paper form.

I don't disagree with that at all. But as a FFL, I am bound by law to save, as long as I am in business, every 4473 that is filled out at my shop. Then, when I close the business I have to (by law) print out each and every one of the electronic 4473's to ship to the BATFE. Why should I use my money to print a form when I get the paper form free from the ATF? I store the completed ones now in a file cabinet (or boxes) and then when I close the business I tell the ATF to pick them up or send me prepaid shipping labels.

 

[blume357]

RoninPA tagged it:
here's the thing... remember they gave me a disc that would light up when someone in the back finally finished... I asked the clerk what they were doing and he said they were printing out the paper work from what we had just done on the computer.....