New caliber idea....any thoughts.

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modrifle3

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So there is no real reason I am asking this other than "why not", but I am considering a wildcat semi auto load. I want to take the .44 automag concept, .308 cut down with a .44 caliber slug, and shorten it to fit the 1911 and push it to 10mm pressure levels and use a 200gr bullet.

I call it the .44 super.

First question, how would I determine the pressure level of the round?

Are there any 1911 tuners that would make a barrel?
 

DGW1949

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Yeah, you could do that.
Stuff to consider:
Folks has been making 45ACP ammo from cut-down 30-06 cases for years.
At one time, ya could even buy special dies for doing that. Might still can...dunno.
At any rate, I see no reason that the same couldn't be done with .308 cases.
Slightly necking-down your "new" brass to properly hold a .429 bullet would be simple enough, but you'll need to have a one of a kind barrel made.
Unless you extensively modify the gun itself, you're still going to be limited to the basic AOL of a 45ACP though, simply because the round has to fit within the mag AND cycle through the action AND ya can't make the ejection port of a 1911 slide but so long.....so....you'd end-up with would be more on the order of a 44ACP, NOT a "44-Super".
Also be aware that using cut-down rifle brass to form pistol cases will result in ya needing to drop the powder charge a bit. That's on account of the webing of the rifle brass being thicker/stronger, which will result in a reduced powder-capacity per X-amount of case length.
Pressures?.......Personaly, if it were my project, I'd start with 45ACP data that most closely matched the weight of the .44 bullet(s) that I intended to use, load-up 5-each of whatever I wanted tested and make arrangements to send them off to Whites Lab. Testing is what they do.

You didn't ask...but;
My best guess is that you might end up with a few more FPS at a given pressure than you'd see out of a simlar 45ACP load.
On the other hand, you'd be giving up a bit of bullet weight and mass.
All in all, lot to do about nothing, if ya ask me.

But hey, it's your time 'n money.....and sometimes, the fun is in the chase, right?

DGW
 

modrifle3

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You really depressed me but good points DGW.

I was thinking thicker web would allow a pressure bump. Oh well back to reloading .45
 

DGW1949

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modrifle3 said:
You really depressed me but good points DGW.

I was thinking thicker web would allow a pressure bump. Oh well back to reloading .45

Well, yeah it would. Question is though, how much would it allow for?....I can't answer that myself but I do know that theres a "bit" of the cartridge case which is not supported by the chamber in a 1911, which is usualy where things go astray when attempting to develop "higher than normal pressure" loads for that particular platform. When that happens, the usual result is that the grips are blown-off, the mag is damaged and/or blows out, and sometimes the top round in the mag is set-off during the process.

On the other hand....as I see it, there's good news;
Aside from a new barrel, nothing else about the gun would need changed.
You could still use your .45ACP mags.
You could still use the same reloading componants that you've been using.
The 44ACP which I see resulting from your propossed conversion could probably approach 44Spl performance while using about 20% less powder, and we all know that the 44Spl is a very accurate round.

So who knows?...you might be on to something here.
All I'm saying is to be carefull about it, that's all.

DGW
 

toysoldier

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I think the pressure level is the kicker. The 1911 was designed for the 45acp, at not much more than 20,000CUP. The 10mm runs over 36,000CUP.
The 1911 has been chambered for a bottle-necked 38/45 round, for target shooting. If the 1911 could take the 39,000CUP of the .357SIG, the 38/45 would be a simple way to get .357 Magnum performance.
 

Tellico

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How about .45 Winchester Magnum brass? Still offered by Starline. Pressure for that round was 40,000 and it was offered in a 1911 platform. The LAR Grizzly. It had an elongated grip frame. Pushed a 260gr to 1200fps.
Fred
 

dakota1911

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I would be happy if Ruger came out with a 10mm, and in the convertible tradition a second barrel and spring for 40 S&W.
 

Snake45

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And now, just to pee in the Wheaties:

Just what exactly do you hope that this gun/ammo combination can do that can't be done by either the .45 Super or the 10mm? :? :? :? :?
 

Biggfoot44

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What Snake said. From the start of the thread seemed to be reinventing the .45Super.
 

DGW1949

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Snake45 said:
And now, just to pee in the Wheaties:

Just what exactly do you hope that this gun/ammo combination can do that can't be done by either the .45 Super or the 10mm? :? :? :? :?

I can't answer for Modrifle3 but my first thought was to develop it around a 240 LSWC, perfect it, have some extra barrels made, match each of those with the proper (read that as "new") recoil spring, call the new round a ".44 Special-Auto"..........

....and then market each barrel/spring together as a "kit" to the Skeeter fans. :D .

Might start a trend....ya think?

DGW
 

Snake45

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DGW1949 said:
Snake45 said:
And now, just to pee in the Wheaties:

Just what exactly do you hope that this gun/ammo combination can do that can't be done by either the .45 Super or the 10mm? :? :? :? :?

I can't answer for Modrifle3 but my first thought was to develop it around a 240 LSWC, perfect it, have some extra barrels made, match each of those with the proper (read that as "new") recoil spring, call the new round a ".44 Special-Auto"..........

....and then market each barrel/spring together as a "kit" to the Skeeter fans. :D .

Might start a trend....ya think?

DGW
Dunno, but it doesn't answer my question. :wink:
 
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