Hawkeye prototypes?

[Joe in Fl]

A friend of mine recently brought over 3 unmarked made in 1965 handguns
she believes to be prototypes of the Hawkeye. there is one in 22
Hornet, one in 256 and one in 44Mag. These three guns looks exactly
like Hawkeyes. There no markings at all on these at all. They were given
to her Grandfather in 1965. They are absolutely beautiful. Her grandfather
was the chief of police in a small Virginia county. Her family has owned them
for last 47 years. I am currently trying to get pictures of these
awesome handguns. I will try to post them when I get them.
I guess what I am trying to find out is it possible they could be
prototypes? Any help and direction on these masterpieces would be
appreciated. She may want to sell them as a set if they can be
authenticated.
Thanks for any help,
Joe

 

[Hondo44]

Joe,

Very interesting. When you say no markings on them do you mean the frames and the barrels or just the barrels?

Here's what I've heard or observed:

1. Two factory prototypes that never left the factory were made in 357 Maximum.

2. The Hawkeyes were such poor sellers when introduced in 1962 that many dealers had them rechambered/rebarrelled with custom barrels in several different cartridges, two of which you mentioned. The 256 Win Mag however was the one and only factory production/shipped cartridge.

3. Many have also been rechambered/rebarrelled after original sale.

Those three guns will be easy to verify if they are serial numbered by a $10 letter from Ruger.

I look forward to seeing photos and thanks for sharing.

 

[Joe in Fl]

Jim thanks for the reply, I talked to her again today , pics will
be forth coming. Today she passed on that the guns were given
to her grandpa by a gentleman from up north, that's all she knows
her grandpa is long gone and her father can't remember anything
about anything. There are no markings what so ever on the guns.
I will post the pics as soon as I get them.
Thanks, Joe

 

[Ale-8(1)]

Man, if these turn out to be totally unmarked Hawkeyes . . . whooooeeeee!

Anticipation . . .

:shock: :shock: :mrgreen: :shock: :shock:

 

[5of7]

Lunchbox specials?

I would not write to Ruger about it....they just might want them back as stolen property. 8)

 

[Ale-8(1)]

Good point.

 

[contender]

It would be VERY interesting if they have absolutely no serial number markings. All the experimental ones I've seen had some form of marking. Besides, if you are building prototypes, and testing something, you'd need a way to record the results to a specific gun.

 

[Lee Martin]

I'm looking forward to seeing pictures. I'm guessing one of three things:

1) They are true unmarked prototypes in those calibers
2) They were 256 prototypes that someone converted
3) They were original 256 guns that someone converted and removing the factory inscriptions.

Either way they sound like really nice pieces.

 

[Sixer]

Lunchbox specials?

I would not write to Ruger about it....they just might want them back as stolen property. 8)

Funny that you mention that. I bought a Bisley .45 off Guns America. It was ugly with a chopped down 4 5/8 barrel. About 5 yrs past and I wanted that barrel changed. Ruger said with a barrel change, they throw in the blueing for no charge. Sounded great so I sent in the gun. After about two weeks I get a call from Ruger. They tell me that according to their records the gun never left the factory. I asked what next. They said that the gun was a very early Bisley(1984) and was a lunch box gun or that "the family" used to give guns away at gun shows without paperwork. They were happy to just get the gun off the books. They let me keep it, I just had to fill out a 4473 when it came back to the shop. All ended well.

 

[T.A. WORKMAN]

Lunchbox specials?

I would not write to Ruger about it....they just might want them back as stolen property. 8)

Funny that you mention that. I bought a Bisley .45 off Guns America. It was ugly with a chopped down 4 5/8 barrel. About 5 yrs past and I wanted that barrel changed. Ruger said with a barrel change, they throw in the blueing for no charge. Sounded great so I sent in the gun. After about two weeks I get a call from Ruger. They tell me that according to their records the gun never left the factory. I asked what next. They said that the gun was a very early Bisley(1984) and was a lunch box gun or that "the family" used to give guns away at gun shows without paperwork. They were happy to just get the gun off the books. They let me keep it, I just had to fill out a 4473 when it came back to the shop. All ended well.

Good Info!
Thanks for sharing.
Terry

 

[flatgate]

"Lunch Box Specials"? Possibly. I'll refer the interested parties to read Chapter 9 The Hawkeye in John Dougan's wonderful book on Ruger Firearms, Ruger Pistols and Revolvers The Vintage Years 1949-1973.

flatgate

 

[chet15]

Any additional news on this?
Chet15

 

[HAWKEYE#28]

Poster told me that the guns were sold.................. :?

 

[Hondo44]

Someone must have PM'd right away and made an offer that was accepted. Or maybe the poster bought them.

 

[HAWKEYE#28]

WAS ALLEGEDLY AT THE TOP OF THE LIST, BUT SALE WAS CLAIMED TO BE OUT OF HIS CONTROL.......

 

[rugerguy]

so once again, ANOTHER "Ruger story" all speculation and hoopla, get everyones shorts all up in a "snit" and leave the interested hanging , and from this day forward will go down in and as "Ruger lore",, someone will "see & read" this post and tell all their friends and buddies, they heard this and that and was on the 'forum', so is "cut in stone"............aah such is life...............

Heck, I would like to hear the "true" story of the "known" prototypes, that we have 'seen' on display fromn time to time, and "out of the factory"..... 8)

LIke I often say, "like sand through an hour glass, another day of our life, and another round down the chamber,this is "As the Cylinder Turns", another tale of Ruger lore"....yes, MY quote !! :roll:


Merry Christmas !! :wink:

 

[radicalrod]

Well I am late to this party.....BUT why would the factory make "PROTOTYPES" with "no markings what so ever".....seems like it would be difficult to tell which was which when done testing.....and the one "PROTOTYPE" I have seen was marked with an X followed with a number....these are well documented guns.....sounds like a REALLY GOOD STORY to me :lol: :lol: :lol: it sure would be tough getting a letter from RUGER on these without a serial number of some sort.....for me the price would need to reflect the lack of authentication rather than the sizzle of a good story.....JMO and YMMV.....RR.

 

[HAWKEYE#28]

UNLESS..............JD had them................ :roll:

 

[Ale-8(1)]

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[flatgate]

I'm guessing JD got 'em........

I was going to suggest the Owner remove the grips and inspect for any sort of markings.

Merry Christmas to all.

flatgate

 

[jmfc606]

My guess is that this was a whole made up story. It all happened so fast he couldn't take a picture. Oh wait this thread is 2 months old, we could have had a whole photo album. I call oldfashioned BS. Until we see pictures of these so called guns they don't exist.

 

[Ale-8(1)]

Kinda begins to feel that way, doesn't it?

 

[BlkHawk73]

But they got the minute of fame they sought. With anything like this, heresay is worthless.

 

[rugerguy]

well in a chat the other day with our friend Bob C, he recalls many years ago, down south at one of the NRA conventions or such, he recalls that Willis Sprunger??? had some "unmarked" guns, he thought were ala "Hawkeyes" NO markings and a couple of different calibers, small ones, like a 22 or such...not sure if Willis is even still around, and Bob said Lynn Laudise was there and others he doesn't remember, MAYBE one of you guys from "down south" and the "old days" may recall this?????
I had talked with Willis years ago, when we did some of the Ruger "cutaways", he had done some for the military for training, instyruction purposes, and his cutaways had "yellow " paint in the 'cutouts as I recall...ssssooooo, if Willis could do that , he certainly could redo or built ,mill out ANY gun frame...also remember someone south of us near Mantua, Ohio had a few "copies" of various fireasm, ,oneColt I rememebr built from "scratch" and an "exact copy" of a Colt SAA...they were in a hardware store after the guy died, Carlton Hardware??? wow, its been a LONG time..........................anyway, that stuff is out there.

 

[HAWKEYE#28]

I saw and held the "Sprunger" NM SS 9 1/2" Single Six that he had modified into a single shot 22 caliber "Hawkeye", and this occurred at the NRA Annual Meeting in New orleans in 1986. He noted it was not for sale and was destined for an unnamed Ruger Collector. Willis Sprunger was a true Gentleman and master of metalwork, and did so with a seemingly bare minuimum of high end tools(ala CAD/CAM). The projects he completed took time, as he did all by hand. Had he been properly supported with advanced machining tooling, he could have produced far more pieces. Personally, I was never able to get on his build schedule, as it was, according to Willis, full for another individual. My perception is that he was never really recognized for his skills and expertise, nor was he properly rewarded financially for his works. He left us for the Big Gun Show in the sky some years ago.

 

[Ale-8(1)]

Wouldn't it be fascinating to read a big, nicely-illustrated book covering all the strange and wonderful "home shop" stuff that has been created over the years in the Ruger history??

That book is crying out for one of you "senior Rugerphiles" to compile.

I'd buy it.

 

[rugerguy]

I'd bet it has something to do with having a "manufacturing license" and paying all the appropriate taxes ,etc...............
we would NEVER know about or have any idea or clue as to what ANY person, with a lathe and a file and time on their hands could "re-create" and this has been going on since firearms were invented,,,which country does one start in????
Thanks for the info 'Splitz' I kinda was wondering if it was something like that , that Bob recalled....I know what a lablor of love those kinds of things are, we made cutaways ourselves many years ago, and not being a machinist, I too did them ALL by hand, by eye, with a dremel and some files,talk about WORK!!!

 

[HAWKEYE#28]

PM sent, Dan............... :wink:

 

[chet15]

Manufacturing license? Nah...the guns Willis worked on had serial numbers on the frame before he ever started. Willis wasn't the kind of person to circumvent state and federal laws.
We were lucky enough to have Willis build a Hawkeye for us (I think there were only 4 or 5 ever done by him, with one in stainless). Ours started life as an early 81- prefix Super Blackhawk that had been in a fire, so we salvaged the frame, Willis came up with a .256 cal. Marlin barrel and did the rest. Then we had it engraved and gold inlaid with the eagle logo on the back of the grip frame, and put it in one of our green interior french fit cases.

Now the three MK678G's that Will turned into cutaways for Rock Island Arsenal didn't have any serial numbers on them, and they were given to him by Steve Vogel who was in charge of the project.
Chet15

 

[rugerguy]

here you go, another case of "someone" taken a gun ,already built, and doing "custom work", another one of HOW MANY ?? hundreds and hundreds of gunsmiths, gun shops, and THOUSANDS of "machinists" quite capable of building, customizing, converting any firearm...yessir, list goes on and on....the point of the original post was "no markings" ?? or was it said a serial number 1? this calls for proper licensing to manufacture, which was our reply as to what is 'required by law", and why many will NOT go through the time, effort, or jump through hoops...............I know, we inquired, and talked with Ruger when we made our 'cutaways' back then, NO problemo!! just no interest in the project................. :roll: