Difficulty Ejecting 357s After Shooting 38s Due to Erosion?

[Arctos]

I was recently watching an older Massad Ayoob video where he was speaking to police trainers.

He stated that many departments train with 38s and carry 357s in their revolvers, but when you shoot 38s it causes a little bit of erosion in the chamber ahead of the 38 brass. Then when you shoot a 357, which is longer and has higher pressures, the brass case can get fireformed into that erosion and make it difficult to eject.

What is your experience along those lines? How many rounds of 38 Special would you have to shoot before that becomes a concern?

https://youtu.be/YtJJQTPa9gY?t=32m24s

 

[WIL TERRY]

MY S&W M19 4" has 49M rounds through it, almost evenly divided between 38SPL and 357MAG cartridges. IT HASN'T HAPPENED YET !!! Furthermore he is confusing two phenomonons, erosion is one thing you will RARELY IF EVER see from shooting 38SPL cartridges. The Crud they leave behind right at where the casemouth is in the chamber is something else again and THIS is what causes the problems Mas notes when shooting 357MAG cartridges locks the brass in place on that crud-ring. THIS can be avoided by shooting six[6] 357 cartridges when you are through shooting your 38sPL ammunition. The crud-ring is still soft at that time and it will then be of no further problem . NONE !!
And so it goes...

 

[Jim Puke]

I have never heard of the "erosion" but, there is certainly a "carbon" build up that will make it hard to chamber 357rds.

 

[coach]

I never new of or thought about erosion on the cylinder, but was aware that a dirt ring forms ahead of the .38 round and always cleaned the cylinders after shooting. I never had the .357 stick. I probably never shot or used that much .38 ammo without cleaning and shot enough .357 to know things still worked properly.
Interesting video. I only had time for about half and will try to watch the rest later.

 

[rugerguy]

...doubt if its really "erosion" , but simply as noted above , a build up of carbon fouling, thus looking and acting like a "rough" surface, thus causing extraction problems with the longer 357 mag cases....happens in other calibers as well when you can shoot "other" ( shorter) rounds in the same chambers..................happiness is a clean & dry chamber 8) :roll: :wink:

 

[eveled]

After shooting my .38 only revolvers, I push a spent brass .357 into the chambers, it works like a scraper, amazing what gets dislodged. Off and on, I have thought about how to make a similar scraper, that is longer, to reach the end of the .357 chambers.

I never thought about making sure to shoot .357's on purpose at the end of a session, but I tend to do that anyway. So I have been benefiting without knowing it.

 

[jgt]

Brownell's has a reamer you can buy made for just this situation. The only time you would have erosion is if you were shoot hot plus P loads with light bullets and ball powder on a regular basis. That does happen in some cases usually in large N-Frame type revolver. The thinking is the heavier magnum revolver is easier to shoot with such loads than a K-Frame size 38 revolver. The 357 round sticking in a dirty chamber due to shooting 38 target loads is a lot more prevalent scenario.

 

[stevemb]

A thourough cleaning with your favorite solvent should do it. Been shooting specials in mags for a few decades now. My mag loads still work.

 

[Mtneer]

After shooting my .38 only revolvers, I push a spent brass .357 into the chambers, it works like a scraper, amazing what gets dislodged. Off and on, I have thought about how to make a similar scraper, that is longer, to reach the end of the .357 chambers.

I never thought about making sure to shoot .357's on purpose at the end of a session, but I tend to do that anyway. So I have been benefiting without knowing it.

For making such a tool, would it be possible to use .357 Maximum cases? Just curious - sounds interesting.

 

[whichwatch]

THIS can be avoided by shooting six[6] 357 cartridges when you are through shooting your 38sPL ammunition. The crud-ring is still soft at that time and it will then be of no further problem . NONE !!

As will a good cleaning with solvent and a brush.

 

[Bucks Owin]

MY S&W M19 4" has 49M rounds through it...

Huh?!? :?

 

[Hondo44]

M = 1000. 49,000.

 

[Hondo44]

It's not the shooting of the 357 rounds at the end of the session, it's the inserting the 357 rounds with their longer cases that pushes the still soft crud out. A fired .357 case works as good or better because the crimp has been blown open and leaves a nice square scraping edge.

And yes, a 357 Max. fired case works. And there's more case length to hang on to and pull the case back out.

 

[427mach1]

M = 1000. 49,000.

K = 1,000
M = 1,000,000

49M = 49,000,000

 

[Hondo44]

M as in Roman Numerals. Not metric system where the M would be a metric (SI) prefix of 1000 to the 2nd power. He didn't shoot 49 million rounds.

 

[RoninPA]

Slightly off topic but to clarify.

M is 1,000 in Roman numerals Thus 2015 is written MMXV (1000+1000+10+5) 1998 is MCMXCVIII

I=1
V=5
X=10
L=50
C=100
D=500
M=1000

If the lower letter is in front of the larger letter it is subtracted IV=4 CM=900
If the lower follows the larger letter it is added VI=6 MC=1100

In most every day use K=1000, M=1,000,000 ( 20KHz = 20,000 Hertz, 20MHz= 20,000,000 Hertz)

Then it gets funny. In US English 1 Billion is 1 thousand millions (1,000,000,000) In the past, in British English (IIRC) 1 billion used to be considered 1 million millions (1,000,000,000,000) but that has been dropped and the 1 thousand millions is now the standard.

So 49M rounds could be 49,000 or 49,000,000 depending on the numbering system the person is using. I suspect the 49,000 is what he meant.

 

[GhosT]

Yes,
EROSION was the wrong word.

But as "Massad Ayoob" said it.....IT MUST BE ALLOWED!

Learned alot from his book "In the gravest extreme"......DECADES AGO!

Before the internet existed , This man taught us well/FREE PASS! :lol:

I will never forget, in the early 80's at the range.....
Shooting 100 .38 special rounds through a Ruger stainless Security six, then tried to load it with 125 grain,.357 Magnum JHP's.

No gun cleaning kit there, shooting was done for the day.

A lesson every revolver guy should go through once at the range!

 

[timalso]

Brownells used to carry the chamber scraper. They currently carry the Lewis Lead Scrapers.

 

[cadillo]

Slightly off topic but to clarify.

M is 1,000 in Roman numerals Thus 2015 is written MMXV (1000+1000+10+5) 1998 is MCMXCVIII

I=1
V=5
X=10
L=50
C=100
D=500
M=1000

If the lower letter is in front of the larger letter it is subtracted IV=4 CM=900
If the lower follows the larger letter it is added VI=6 MC=1100

In most every day use K=1000, M=1,000,000 ( 20KHz = 20,000 Hertz, 20MHz= 20,000,000 Hertz)

Then it gets funny. In US English 1 Billion is 1 thousand millions (1,000,000,000) In the past, in British English (IIRC) 1 billion used to be considered 1 million millions (1,000,000,000,000) but that has been dropped and the 1 thousand millions is now the standard.

So 49M rounds could be 49,000 or 49,000,000 depending on the numbering system the person is using. I suspect the 49,000 is what he meant.

I used to work for an import company and had to purchase Mexican currency to pay for our imported inventory. In Mexico the word "Billon" equates to our "Trillion". What we refer to as a billion is in Mexico "Mil Millones" or a thousand millions, not to be confused with 'Un Billon" or our trillion.

 

[SPBhawk]

It's caused by the Carbon ring from the shorter 38special case, needs to be cleaned that's all.