Blackhawk Oversized Cylinders? (Correction)

[Hylander]

So I'm looking at a Blackhawk 45 Colt.
Sorry, 7.5" not 6" blued, very nice condition.
One issue:
I pin guaged the cylinders and they are
.454 and .4545
No, I do not want to buy a custom oversized mold.
Do you think Ruger would replace the cylinder with one more in spec?

 

[hittman]

Probably if it’s a NM

 

[XUSNORDIE]

Normally they are TIGHT if anything.....have you dropped cast or jacketed through them? (more interested in cast).

 

[hittman]

On another note you can maybe see if Fermin can help you out. His user name here is 2 dogs I think

 

[Joey]

Some good info here. Also in Single Actions forum if you are a member. Apparently it doesn't matter about oversized throats as much as I thought.
https://www.rugerforum.com/forums/ruger-single-action-double-action-revolvers.3/

 

[Neon Vernon]

I wouldn't be scared off by those throat dimensions personally. It might shoot great with .452's as is.

 

[Hylander]

Normally they are TIGHT if anything.....have you dropped cast or jacketed through them? (more interested in cast).

Yes, cast at .4525 falls right through.
I pin gauged them, a .454 slides right through.

 

[XUSNORDIE]

THAT....is unusual.....

 

[s4s4u]

So I'm looking at a Blackhawk 45 Colt.
6" blued, very nice condition.
One issue:
I pin guaged the cylinders and they are
.454 and .4545
No, I do not want to buy a custom oversized mold.
Do you think Ruger would replace the cylinder with one more in spec?

Most guys I know would take that and say thank you. What does the barrel slug at?

Gotta assume someone had the throats opened up for cast boooooolllitssssss

 

[XUSNORDIE]

Gotta assume someone had the throats opened up for cast boooooolllitssssss

Wish mine were that way......

 

[Rclark]

For accuracy, in this case, the bullets should be .454 as they should 'fit' the .454 cylinder throats (that is the theory). That allows the bullet to stay 'true' until it hits the forcing cone straight on and resized in the barrel to seal the bore (typically .451 to .452). Otherwise if bullet is smaller, it will tend to hit the forcing cone at an angle when pushed out of the larger throat by hot gases passing the bullet (deforming the bullet). Ie. The bullet wouldn't be able to obturate (bump up size) in the throat. Cause accuracy problems. At least that it how I understand it. That said, accuracy depends on the definition by the shooter doing the shooting!

 

[JMD101]

Shoot it, it may be the best you have!

 

[Johnnu2]

Personally, I'd pass on that gun. There are probably plenty of others out there that you won't have to screw-around with.... or needlessly worry about once purchased.
J.

 

[gunzo]

I know for a fact that correcting too small throats helps accuracy. Like going from .448 or 9 to .452. But a couple thou over shouldn't be detrimental. Most folks that ream tight throats in 45 BH's go .4525. So you're just a couple, or less over ideal. Still close enough to help with bullet alignment if needed.

But heck, having perfect chambers & throats are for nothing if there's chamber to barrel misalignment. Thinking it best to just not overthink it.

 

[contender]

Many good comments here about the throats.

However,, I wonder about the gun itself. It may have had someone else "work" on it.
I say this,, because you mentioned it having a 6" barrel.

Ruger made them in 4-5/8" & 7-1/2". No factory 6" barrels.

As noted,, Ruger would likely replace the cylinder with a tighter one if it's a New Model. But if it's been chopped to 6" they may also want to return it to a 7-1/2" barrel.

Now you wish to not buy a "custom" bullet mold in .454 or so. I can say I have bought standard production MP molds,, that cast a little bit oversized. And I size the bullets down to whatever dimension needed. You could easily cast some, and NOT size them to get the size you need.
Just a thought or two.

 

[Gunny268]

OP...If I were standing in your boots I'd choose to pass on the gun. Simpler to spend your money on a gun that you want and is without "issues."

 

[s4s4u]

Having .454" throats are not "issues". Many shooters ream the throats to .454" because that is the size that their molds drops bullets at. Ever heard of the 454 Casull? That number wasn't pulled out of someone's azz

It is better to have larger throats than too small of a throat. The forcing cone will swage the bullets down to the groove diameter when fired. As it appears that the revolver in question has had some custom work done to it, I wouldn't be surprised if the forcing cone has also been tweaked. Depending on the price, I'd be interested to know where the gun is located.

 

[Hylander]

Sorry, posted the wrong barrel length.
It is 7.5"
And the price is $399. I think cheap, as it is very nice condition and everything else seems spot on.

 

[Jscb1b]

Buy it!

 

[hittman]

Cheap if it’s an OM

 

[bisleyfan41]

Sorry, posted the wrong barrel length.
It is 7.5"
And the price is $399. I think cheap, as it is very nice condition and everything else seems spot on.

Yeah, any decent NM for $400 is worth it.

 

[Rclark]

Yeah, any decent NM for $400 is worth it.

If you actually want it .... Just to buy ... not so much .

It is better to have larger throats than too small of a throat.

I'd say it is better to have the correct sized throats (.4525) than .454 . Two small of throats is ' quick and easy' to fix by reaming to .4525 so not a problem either . But .454 means special sized bullets....

 

[Neon Vernon]

.454 is not a Special Size Bullet, as evidenced by the Ideal/Lyman/Keith mould 454424.

The RCBS 45-270SAA throws a 454 bullet as well.

$400? I'd have that home already.

 

[contender]

Ok,, so it does have a 7-1/2" bbl.

That reduces the chance of it being a "custom."

Now,, as I also mentioned and is mentioned above,,, several molds actually do drop a bullet that's a bit oversized.
Cast a few,, lube or PC them,,, then test them.

At $400 a NM is a good deal. If it's an OM,, it's a steal!

 

[protoolman]

Most have undersized cylinder throats .454 is actually the original size for .45 Colts so as many have pointed out its not a bad thing. If you're A caster just buy the older sized molds. If you don't cast most casting companies offer .452 or .454 sizing. Since most have undersized throats - most Rugers have a "problem" oversize is almost never a problem especially if its one 1 1\2 thousands. Actually if you shoot it with lead bullets they will swage slightly and grip the rifling tight and you should have stellar accuracy. I would buy this on purpose for lead bullet shooting. Remember oversize is better than undersize.

 

[Rclark]

.454 is not a Special Size Bullet,

If you say so... But when I go, to say, rimrock bullets to order some, all I see is .452 (just checked for .45 Colt). My eyesight may be bad though. There is probably some commercial casters that do .454. Just have to find them... If you cast yourself, then any size bullet is fair game depending on your molds.

 

[Neon Vernon]

Most commercial casters also size their bevel base 44 bullets to .429. That's a useless setup at anything over rock throwing distance.

I had one of those notorious S&W 25-5's with the .457-458 throats. It was abysmal with bevel base .452's but well beyond acceptable with flat base .454's (from a commercial caster).

As mentioned earlier, 454 was the original bullet diameter for the 45. It's only been in relatively recent history that the move to 452 throats occurred, and one has to wonder if that isn't at least partially due to Ruger's inability to properly dimension a 45 throat.

Bearing surface length and a good flat base are of as much importance as diameter (within reason).

 

[s4s4u]

If you say so... But when I go, to say, rimrock bullets to order some, all I see is .452 (just checked for .45 Colt). My eyesight may be bad though. There is probably some commercial casters that do .454. Just have to find them... If you cast yourself, then any size bullet is fair game depending on your molds.

Nothing bad will happen if you send a .452" bullet through .454" throats. I reamed my 45 Colt to .4525" but have shot a pile of .451" bullets through it. The forcing cone has the final say.

 

[Neon Vernon]

To reinforce this idea, the Lipsey's 44 Flattops have a nearly unanimous reputation for good to great accuracy. The throats are pretty uniformly .433 and most of us are probably launching .429 jacketed or 430 cast from them.

 

[bisleyfan41]

.454 is not a Special Size Bullet, as evidenced by the Ideal/Lyman/Keith mould 454424.

The RCBS 45-270SAA throws a 454 bullet as well.

$400? I'd have that home already.

Those are 2 of my favorite bullets. Not much they won't do.