Alloy steel?

[broknprism]

Tried a search, nothing came up, so....

I just bought a new model Blackhawk in 45 Colt, and when I looked at Ruger's site to get the barrel length, I was surprised to read that they described it as an "alloy steel" gun. I know the grip frame is aluminum, but I'd never thought of the steel as alloy. All steel is an alloy, right, of iron and something? Is this a new thing Ruger is doing? Cost savings? Weight savings? And while I'm at it, is the Blackhawk made from milled steel, or cast steel? Oh yeah -- one more question -- the ejector housing looks like steel, not aluminum. Are the new Blackhawks made with steel housings? Thanks.

 

[bnewberry]

Steel is an alloy. Saying alloy steel is a bit redundant, but it sounds cooler, stronger, tougher etc. than plain old steel.

Blackhawks are made of steel, the frame is cast, the cylinder is forged.

Some ejector housings on the Blackhawk family are steel, some are aluminum. So depending on the model you could get either.

 

[TiteGroups]

Agree with everything above but I don't think they forge the cylinder, without seeing the process in person I believe it's cut from round bar stock and machined to shape. I really hate when people use the term alloy when referring to aluminum common amongst the S&W crowd.

 

[jpdesign]

the bar stock is forged befor machining to make it denser and stronger.

Steel is not an alloy. An alloy is a melted mix (mecanical process) of two or more metals. Steel is a type of metal made by a chemical reaction between iron and carbon (not a metal). Saying alloy steel is saying that there is some other metal added to the steel after the steel has been created and solidified. first you make the steel, then you make the alloy from the steel. Chromium is a common alloy component. Also nickle, zinc, copper, and tin. Chromium and nickle together added to steel create stainless steel.

Saying carbon steel is what is redundant. all steel is carbon steel. it should be either hig or low carbon steel.

Jimmy

 

[broknprism]

Thanks guys. Alloy steel is redundant. 'Cooler' is probably the reason they say it.

I'm sure I got a steel housing. A nice improvement.

 

[Marthor]

Do you know the riddle of steel?

 

[mustang99]

Alloy is distinguishing between carbon steel and stainless. No cylinders are forged at Ruger. All recent ejector housings are made from steel.

 

[rugerguy]

Ruger guns for the most part ( blued) are a 4140 chrome -moly castings....the stainless version has changed and not sure what that alloy series is, they redesigned ,for strength these alloys ,also cast.......this alloy was noted in a metalurgical magazine when they started the Super redhawks, in 454 & 480's some time back.................

 

[K. Funk]

Steel most certainly is an alloy. And there are hundreds of varieties of alloy steels. I know this because I am a metallurgist. I am also directly involved in making the hundreds of tons of stainless steel used by Ruger in their handguns and rifles every year. For the non-stainless guns and components, 4130 and 4140 are probably the most common grades used. 4130 contains about .3% carbon, about 1% chrome and about .25% molybdenum in an iron base, ie chrome-moly steel. For the stainless guns, Type 416 is very common. For the more demanding applications, there is 17-4, 15-5 and Custom 465.

krf

 

[TiteGroups]

+1 There.

 

[Sugar River]

Steel most certainly is an alloy.

Beat me to it!


Pete

 

[CraigC]

My lovely leatherbound Merriam-Webster's dictionary defines "alloy" as "a substance composed of two or more metals or of a metal and a nonmetal intimately united by being fused together and dissolving in each other when molten".

Steel is an alloy so "alloy steel" is redundant. It is also very silly and tweaks my OCD to hear aluminum referred to as "alloy", like Ruger and S&W do. Then again, I don't like my information to be dumbed-down to the lowest common denominator.

PS, stainless steel is any steel alloy with a chromium content of 11% or greater. Nickel is of no consequence in that regard.

 

[broknprism]

My alloy question has been owned, so thanks everybody for that. Since we're on the subject of steel, I've always been curious about the difference between cast steel and forged.

It would seem to me that casting is fine for an object that has no real demand placed on it -- like a cast iron door knocker -- but that you would want to forge (fold and beat, right?) steel for something that undergoes the stresses common to a firearm. I was surprised (and disappointed) to read that my 2nd gen Colt Navy was made from cast parts, but the forces in black powder are comparatively low to say, a gun for which super hot RUGER ONLY loads are routinely made. I guess cast steel can handle that because Rugers don't blow up. Is the thickness of the frame one of the reasons? Where do the stresses occur? Chamber walls (which look thin, to me)? Frame? Forcing cone? All of the above?

 

[jpdesign]

even after 20 years experience with metal i learn something new. Although I never looked up alloy and just went with what i was taught. granted the materials iwas studying were kind of old.

 

[Danjet500]

It is also very silly and tweaks my OCD to hear aluminum referred to as "alloy", like Ruger and S&W do.

There are very few uses for pure aluminum. It is much too soft and ductile. It is commonly alloyed with copper, silicon and other metals to create "alloys".

The definition you posted also says one of the characteristics of an alloy is "intimately united by being fused together and dissolving in each other when molten". Just because you melt two metals together does not mean they fuse together and go into solution with each other. You can melt lead and copper togther but they do not necessarily fuse together. It may depend on the amounts of the alloying agents in the mix. There are many instances of this characteristic the the metallurgical world.

 

[CraigC]

There are very few uses for pure aluminum but "alloy" indicates aluminum about as much as it does anything else. The whole sixgun is composed of alloys, some are based on aluminum, some not. "Alloy" is far too ambiguous a term to be used in such a manner.

 

[TiteGroups]

Forgings are typically stronger than castings but castings can be quite strong, most engine crankshafts and pistons are castings. The cylinder in a revolver is exposed to the highest stress, that's why it's machined from solid bar stock that was forged, the frame is stressed less so you can get away with using a casting, rugers are investment cast. That's why the frames are a bit larger(more cross section) on the rugers, it takes a larger casting to compensate for the weaker process, not that Rugers are weak. The cylinder is the key component.

 

[Egg]

Stainless Steel is a alloy....

 

[GasGuzzler]

Aluminum alloy wheels was a sales gimmick on cars in the 1970's and '80's...

I guess they were made of aluminum alloyed with magnesium or something.

Anyway, I think although redundant, Ruger calls it that to note the difference in stainless steel.

 

[Dan in MI]

I’m just glad alloy is confusing to some people. We were upgrading a lab I worked in. To save costs the mgr would not let us order Stainless for the exhaust system. From past experience we knew it would rot in less than two years. So we ordered high nickle content steel so it would get approved.

 

[DeletedMember275]

Cast steel can be very strong. In addition to Ruger cylinder frames and Springfield M1A rifle receivers, for many years tank hulls (and other tracked vehicles) and turrets were/are cast. The M1 Abrams tank is the first American tank to use strictly welded hulls and turrets. In fact, the US Army no longer has the capability to manufacture cast tank hulls.

 

[gnappi]

TMI!

I'm a simple shooter... I just want to know that click, bang results in a target being hit and I don't lose an eye or ruin my face in the process.

Cast, forged, MIM, or aluminum alloy it's all good if it works.

 

[Jeepnik]

Ever notice that metals all are identified by numbers? That number tells you what metals were "alloyed together" to make that steel.

 

[chet15]

the bar stock is forged befor machining to make it denser and stronger.

Steel is not an alloy. An alloy is a melted mix (mecanical process) of two or more metals. Steel is a type of metal made by a chemical reaction between iron and carbon (not a metal). Saying alloy steel is saying that there is some other metal added to the steel after the steel has been created and solidified. first you make the steel, then you make the alloy from the steel. Chromium is a common alloy component. Also nickle, zinc, copper, and tin. Chromium and nickle together added to steel create stainless steel.

Saying carbon steel is what is redundant. all steel is carbon steel. it should be either hig or low carbon steel.

Jimmy

Forged or extruded? I would say it is probably extruded which is quite a bit different than forging

 

[crstrode]

ALL steel comes out of a big hot furnace. A furnace so hot as to melt the ingredients into an amorphous (look that one up in your Funk and Wagnalls) steel alloy.

From there it is cooled and shaped. The actual shaping process - be it hammering, extruding, molding, etc, - enhances differing characteristics of the steel itself.

 

[Ale-8(1)]

The term "alloy" has been so misused as to become basically a marketing term instead of an engineering term . . . except to the engineers/metallurgists who understand its true meaning.