6.5-300Wby Custom In The Works

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358Win

Bearcat
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
96
I have just finished negotiating a price for work on my next custom rifle with my gunsmith. I think we both are excited about my next project. I know I am excited and will have fun this spring.

In January I will begin the process of redoing my shot out 300Wby which will become a 6.5-300Wby. It will have the German Mark V receiver with a #3 contour 30" Stainless Lilja barrel, bedded in the McMillan stock, with a new Timney trigger to replace the factory trigger.


The McMillian Stock will be redone in a Green Shade like my Custom 30-06. Long Range scope yet to be decided on.

I will use this on long range shots on gas lines, across large open fields and out west. This will take care of my long range need.
 

Con

Bearcat
Joined
Jun 17, 2008
Messages
72
picketpin":18il8jyg said:
It'll be grossly overbore.

With todays availability of super-slow powders ... 'overbore' no longer applies.

It'll be hard on barrels but if looked after will be a lot of fun and fill the niche your chasing. Whether it'll be better than a 7mmSTW, only you will be able to answer.
Cheers...
Con
 

358Win

Bearcat
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
96
Decided to go with a 30" barrel to burn the 85grs of powder down a 6.5mm tube. The extra barrel length is more than reasonable and is needed if I want to get to 3400fps plus out of a 140gr bullet and not push over pressure loads. I have three months to really refine what is needed and my reading while also receiving comments from others like you all will get me in the ball park. Thank you
 

picketpin

Buckeye
Joined
Jun 29, 2006
Messages
1,544
Location
Owyhee County, ID, USA
While the slow and super slow powders have somewhat minimized the problems of overbore cartridges I'm not sure they totally overcome the problem.

As I look at it, it still appears that the heaviest bullets for caliber work best in an overbore case and that yes going to a slow or even super slow powder truley helps.

The 25-06 simply wouldn't work till IMR 4831 came out. Even then when you use powders like IMR 4831 all the way up through IMR 7828, H1000 or Retumbo it's the heaviest bullet that gains you the velocity over the more bore balanced case.

I have been playing with the 257 Roberts all my life. That and the other .257 caliber cases, 250-3000, 257 AI, 25-284, 25-06 and even the 257 STW.

The 257 STW has since been re-barrled to something else. I could fill that huge 8mm Mag case with about any slow powder I wanted and almost none got me ANY increase over the standard 257 Roberts with a 75 grain bullet out of my #1 with the 28" barrel. It did get a slight increase over the 25-06 with a 120 but at the exspense of an additional 30%+ powder charge and thus more recoil. The increase was well within the range of variation between a slow barrel and a fast barrel of the same length.

Don't get me wrong, I own and shoot a few large cased rounds, the 7mm STW is a favorite. Especially if I know ranges are really going to get long. For THAT use/occassion I'm perfectly willing to put up with the use of more powder and more recoil to get that extra 300 fps which is a real honest to god 10% velocity increase.

If it's what you want, build it. Especially in an actual hunting rifle you probably never shoot it enough to burn out the tube. I certainly can't imagine shooting my 7mm STW enough in my remaining years to ever harm the barrel.

On the other hand if I was younger and thought I might shoot it a lot, I might opt for a more bore balanced case even at the exspense of a few 100 fps. Cousin Wayne and I both own/built semi custom #1s in 264 Magnum mostly to shoot the occassional antelope. Neither one gets much work and will last our lifetimes. We are thinking about building one 6.5-284 to shoot coyotes way out there. With two of us shooting it we might shoot it enough to justify the cost.

have fun

Ross
 

358Win

Bearcat
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
96
picketpin":1s5a095c said:
While the slow and super slow powders have somewhat minimized the problems of overbore cartridges I'm not sure they totally overcome the problem.

As I look at it, it still appears that the heaviest bullets for caliber work best in an overbore case and that yes going to a slow or even super slow powder truley helps.

The 25-06 simply wouldn't work till IMR 4831 came out. Even then when you use powders like IMR 4831 all the way up through IMR 7828, H1000 or Retumbo it's the heaviest bullet that gains you the velocity over the more bore balanced case.

I have been playing with the 257 Roberts all my life. That and the other .257 caliber cases, 250-3000, 257 AI, 25-284, 25-06 and even the 257 STW.

The 257 STW has since been re-barrled to something else. I could fill that huge 8mm Mag case with about any slow powder I wanted and almost none got me ANY increase over the standard 257 Roberts with a 75 grain bullet out of my #1 with the 28" barrel. It did get a slight increase over the 25-06 with a 120 but at the exspense of an additional 30%+ powder charge and thus more recoil. The increase was well within the range of variation between a slow barrel and a fast barrel of the same length.

Don't get me wrong, I own and shoot a few large cased rounds, the 7mm STW is a favorite. Especially if I know ranges are really going to get long. For THAT use/occassion I'm perfectly willing to put up with the use of more powder and more recoil to get that extra 300 fps which is a real honest to god 10% velocity increase.

If it's what you want, build it. Especially in an actual hunting rifle you probably never shoot it enough to burn out the tube. I certainly can't imagine shooting my 7mm STW enough in my remaining years to ever harm the barrel.

On the other hand if I was younger and thought I might shoot it a lot, I might opt for a more bore balanced case even at the exspense of a few 100 fps. Cousin Wayne and I both own/built semi custom #1s in 264 Magnum mostly to shoot the occassional antelope. Neither one gets much work and will last our lifetimes. We are thinking about building one 6.5-284 to shoot coyotes way out there. With two of us shooting it we might shoot it enough to justify the cost.

have fun

Ross

Picketpin, very good post and extremely accurate. My 257/300Wby taught me a lot of what you are saying. My favorite for a long time was the 7mmSTW that I had in a custom rifle and was the most accurate rifle I owned at that time.

To be honest I am about to scrape my idea because all the reading and research with what I know from experience has dampened my desire. I am at a point of just rebarreling the Mark V to 300Wby (which it was) with a new 27" #4 barrel or have it done in 7mmSTW.

Thanks for the response and impute, it along with my research has caused me to pause.
 

358Win

Bearcat
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
96
Let me come to my senses. Let me stop this before it goes any farther. Sorry for the thread. I have weighed the evidence of the 6.5/300Wby, the 270/300Wby and the 7mm/300Wby and have decided that I will chamber my rifle in 300Wby again with a 27" #4 barrel and that is that!!!!!!
 

358Win

Bearcat
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
96
DonD":25fflw0t said:
358Win":25fflw0t said:
Let me come to my senses. Let me stop this before it goes any farther. Sorry for the thread. I have weighed the evidence of the 6.5/300Wby, the 270/300Wby and the 7mm/300Wby and have decided that I will chamber my rifle in 300Wby again with a 27" #4 barrel and that is that!!!!!!

Personally, I think that's a good decision. With a 27" barrel you'll get plenty of velocity. If you're into long range paper punching, Sierra's 240gr HPBT will carry a LONG way. Don

Don, There is something delightful and almost sinful about having a rifle that is almost entirely useless and totally impractical.

But I have been there with wildcats and just decided not to go back. Got cold feet when thinking I did not want to be without a 300Wby which is my 1st love in cartridges. My gunsmith understood and in fact when I told him he said that he was not surprise that I wanted the 300Wby since he has over the years made a few for me.

I am more interested in a rifle for shooting game a long range on gas-lines and across very large bean fields and across canyons out west.
 

358Win

Bearcat
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
96
Look guys, I am not stopping the 6.5/300Wby effort for no reason.

The trouble I have discovered talking to Smith's who build F-Class rifles with big case 6.5's is high pressure in long barrels.

One smith who does know his stuff said,


"The most common chambers I do for these F-Class rifles are the 6.5x.284Norma and .308win. The 6.5x.284 will shoot faster in a 27" barrel than in a 30"......??????........I am no engineer but I think in our testing is that the super long VLD's in 6.5mm....worse than any other caliber.....have a ton of bore drag and the longer they are in the barrel (longer barrel) the more pressure they build up. We are using 3grs more powder with lower pressure and higher velocity in the shorter barrel. I tested this with a customers gun. Started at 31" at shortened to 26 1/2" a inch or so at a time. Using the strain gauge it all played out.

One shooter had a similar, but lesser extent, experience with his 31" 338edge.

Back to the big cases. A 6.5x300 will not out run a .264wm by enough to matter. I don't think a 300wby case will get near 3400fps with a 140. A .264 will just do 3000 and a 284 will do 2900. 10grains more powder probably won't get 400fps.As for pressure, all the 6.5's when loaded to the top have spooky pressure curves. I think it goes back to the bullet bearing surface."

These are just a few of the comments that I are consistent with other shooters and smith's who have experience with the 6.5mm in large cases.

I will be happy as a rat alone in a corn bin with a 300Wby with at #4 or #5 contour 27" or 28" stainless barrel pushing a 208gr Amax or 210gr Berger
 

picketpin

Buckeye
Joined
Jun 29, 2006
Messages
1,544
Location
Owyhee County, ID, USA
358: I think it's a smart decision but I'm a bit prejudice. Add to that you 300 WBY will be worth more re-barreled to original than any wildcat.

I have run across exactly what your smith quoted. I don't shoot "F" class or even bench rest but I do shoot a few coyotes out there across the county and have buit a bunch of rifles for that task.

One of the reasons I'm such a Ruger #1 fan is the rifle with a 26" factory barrel up to a custom 28" barrel is right there in terms of ballistics and is yet still pretty easy to carry and points well.

I have talked to a few really serious bench rest guys, Doug Shilen and the guys at Douglas and Sierra and all recomend the 6.5-284 over all of the grossly overbore wildcats.

I also think he is spot on in terms of barrel length and velocity gains. The nice thing about the 6.5s is that really long bullet with the huge B.C. numbers. On the other hand that's a lot of bearing surface. The comment is born out by the chapter in P.O. Ackley's book on barrel length versus speed versus chamber pressures and the effect of the bearing surface and thus increase in friction. Ackley's conclusion was that most cartridges simply didn't get you much if anything once you got up near or past 28".

Of course that work predates all the really slow powders and even IMR4831 but I just can't think it makes THAT much difference.

I only own the "little" MKVs, 224WBY, 240WBY and 270WBY but they sure are fun. ;-)

I'm OLD, my big "30" is a #1 in 30-338.

the best

Ross
 

63November

Single-Sixer
Joined
Oct 20, 2003
Messages
249
Location
Alaska (63 North, 162 West)
I was going to say, if you can burn out the throat in only 800-900 in the 300 configuration, just imagine how quickly a 6.5 would burn out.

Another thought is simply to have the original barrel set back a thread or three to get some of the good out of what's left. Surely the whole barrel isn't trash. (And, of course, Weatherbys have considerable free-bore anyway so losing the leade isn't necessarily bad. It's only bad when accuracy goes south.) Then again, if you have $5-600 burning holes in your pocket, get a new barrel.
 

358Win

Bearcat
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
96
63November":zlsi6et7 said:
I was going to say, if you can burn out the throat in only 800-900 in the 300 configuration, just imagine how quickly a 6.5 would burn out.

Another thought is simply to have the original barrel set back a thread or three to get some of the good out of what's left. Surely the whole barrel isn't trash. (And, of course, Weatherbys have considerable free-bore anyway so losing the leade isn't necessarily bad. It's only bad when accuracy goes south.) Then again, if you have $5-600 burning holes in your pocket, get a new barrel.

I shot 900 rounds but a friend of mine who own it before me put around 400 through it. I want to start over and also put a heavier contour barrel on the rifle.
 

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