What is the ultimate . . . . .

[Pat-inCO]

It is amazing the number of people that buy a new .22 and immediately want to know
what the "best" or "ultimate" what-ever there is for their new toy. We see an equal
number of people that want to know what to change. Why?

The best (IMO) thing you can do is make sure the gun is clean(ed?) and take it out
and shoot at least five hundred, possibly a thousand rounds, THEN decide what YOU
want to change/improve. I have more than one gun that has "broken in" (I HATE that
phrase) and ended up either fine, or at least significantly improved. . . . Until it has
stabilized from use, you could easily be expending dollars that are not necessary, or
are based on someone (that you don't know) else's opinion.

The trigger is one of the main items that tends to smooth out from use. Why not
give it the chance to improve, by itself?

The other question to those that buy a gun and immediately want to "improve" it
is . . . . why didn't you buy what you wanted, to start with? That will save you time,
money, and in many cases, frustration.

Have fun, shoot safe.



I did this as a separate thread because I do . . not . . want to seem to be picking on
someone. If you go back and look, you will see a veritable plethora of threads on
"What should I change first", or "What is the best/ultimate . . . ", or worse yet, "I've heard
that (name your favorite item) is a problem. What should I . . . . ".
Just use it a bit, and then decide what . . you . . would like to improve.


P.S. This does not include the eternal tinkerers. 8)

 

[contender]

I think too many folks buy a gun thinking that they will improve their shooting by adding "improvements."

 

[9x19]

I'm a bit of a tinkerer, but I've been doing it long enough I don't have to ask what I might like, I already know.

With some rimfire rifles, like the 10/22, if I want another I'll buy the parts I want on it, and a receiver (lots of folks parting out new 10/22s these days).

Others, like the American bolt actions, only need a good scope on top (I know what kind of bases/rings I like too) to suit my needs.

I don't mind questions from the folks who are still trying to decide how to configure a weapon to suit them, but if they are thinking new parts will make them a better shooter, then they are indeed kidding themselves, there is no substitute for trigger time with live ammo.

 

[rugerguy]

I totally agree with pat, way too many , do NOT give what they got, a chance, let alone practice enough to get GOOD with it, then one may decide to "make it better"....... :wink:


gimmicks sell magazines and ads, and the world wants to build a better mouse trap, a dead mouse don't care... 8)

 

[Selena]

I totally agree with pat, way too many , do NOT give what they got, a chance, let alone practice enough to get GOOD with it, then one may decide to "make it better"....... :wink:


gimmicks sell magazines and ads, and the world wants to build a better mouse trap, a dead mouse don't care... 8)

Rugerguy hit it dead center. The "best" .22 I own is a Ruger 10/22. It was the rifle I practiced with my uncle rather than my Dad and the joy of a solid hit wasn't dimmed by whatever lesson was to follow. I've sent a lot of boxes of ammunition through that little rifle and it has become a part of me when I'm shooting it. Face it, when my uncle- the dyed in the wool OMB - says sometimes you can't make the machine better you have to make yourself better it pays to listen. It's not the machine it's the operator!

 

[REP1954]

I happen to like all my guns to have between 2 1/2 to 3 pounds trigger pull with zero creep. And I know for a fact that shooting a Ruger Single action with a 6 pound pull and 1/8" creep 1000 shots will never give me the precision I require from my guns. After refining my shooting skills for forty years of regular practice I don't have much time for sub par guns. If I just want to make some noise I would spend my time home rolling fire crackers or shooting a carbide signal cannon.

 

[jimd441]

I agree with the replies. Is the limiting factor on accuracy you or your gun? For most of us (benchrest shooting notwithstanding), it is the shooter that is the limiting factor so the focus should be first on improving the shooter and not the gun.

Jim

 

[GunnyGene]

All true, Pat. One of the best .22 shooters I have is a pre-war Savage 6A. All original, factory sights, and I can pop armadillos offhand with it from 75 yds or more all day long.

That said, I think part of what you talk about is somehow related to the modern era of instant gratification and the latest must have app for your 'device'. :wink:

 

[hpman66]

To take things one step further, another thing that irks me is when someone asks "what ammo shoots the best"? All shooters should quickly learn that each firearm(rimfire, centerfire, rifle, pistol, etc.) is a rule unto itself as to its likes and dislikes are for ammo. Like someone said before, put at least 1k rounds through the firearm to smooth out the action, the barrel, the trigger, etc----FIRST. AND THEN start trying as many different rounds of ammo that you can find which one of them shoots the best through YOUR FIREARM. One bit of advice, IMHO when shooting the first 1k rounds, use copper washed/plated ammo to reduce the fouling in the barrel. Then once you have found a round that fits your accuracy standards and your pocketbook, buy as many boxes/bricks of that round(that all have the same Lot Number) as you can afford to buy. This will be so that you will have consistency in the ammo that you are shooting in your firearm.

To give an example of what I am speaking about, a friend of mine was shooting a new .308 rifle and was not getting very good groups at a 100yds with round nosed bullets. He talked to another friend who was also shooting a .308 rifle. The second friend suggested that the first friend should try of his spitzer bullet ammo in the new .308. The spitzer ammo made all the difference in the world as to the vastly improved accuracy of the new .308. and made the first friend very happy.

 

[Pat-inCO]

To give an example of what I am speaking about, a friend of mine was shooting a new .308 rifle and was not getting very good groups at a 100yds with round nosed bullets. He talked to another friend who was also shooting a .308 rifle. The second friend suggested that the first friend should try of his spitzer bullet ammo in the new .308. The spitzer ammo made all the difference in the world as to the vastly improved accuracy of the new .308. and made the first friend very happy.

While that is a bit beyond where I was headed, I . . do . . agree, completely.

I bought a .222Rem rifle about fifty years ago, for $45. Found out why it
was so cheap, as soon as I had a scope on it. If you didn't have the EXACT
load it wanted (I mean to the tenth of a grain) the group size was about
two inches at 100 yards. With the exact load, it shoots under half minute
groups all day long. - - - - YES, ammo can easily make a significant
difference. OR, like one .270 I have, makes very little difference.

You have to shoot it first, then shoot it some more, THEN think about what
"needs" done.

 

[SGW Gunsmith]

I totally agree with pat, way too many , do NOT give what they got, a chance, let alone practice enough to get GOOD with it, then one may decide to "make it better"....... :wink:


gimmicks sell magazines and ads, and the world wants to build a better mouse trap, a dead mouse don't care... 8)

AMEN! It's foolhardy to think some "gizmo" will turn you into 'Brian Enos' immediately after you install it. :lol: No two Ruger Mark Target pistols are the same, even after they've been assembled in sequence, with all the same part numbered items. Too many variables involved with tolerances of pivot pin holes and ALL the internal parts have a tolerance range also. I think it's a GOOD recommendation to shoot and LEARN, first, before you start with the plastic card and the internet.

 

[wwb]

Of my 10/22s, all have been "improved".... some rather dramatically (the one dedicated to protecting me from marauding paper targets), and then there's my "bunny hunter" - added a fixed 2.5X scope, and cleaned up the trigger. Still about a 4 pound trigger, but no creep and a crisp letoff.

My hunting guns are just the way they came from the factory, except for a trigger on the tang safety M77.

As stated earlier, gimmicks and doo-dads won't compensate for poor shooting skills. Everybody really ought to go through the Appleseed program.

 

[BlkHawk73]

I think too many folks buy a gun thinking that they will improve their shooting by adding "improvements."

Well of course. It's always the gun's fault for not shooting good. Never, ever the person attached to the trigger finger. :roll:

 

[blume357]

I don't disagree that shooting skills are number one ... but it sure is fun to tinker and change ......
I've got a new trigger group for a 10/22 that I got to figure which one I want to install it in.

 

[Ale-8(1)]

I always wonder about folks who have to come onto an internet site and ask what they should like.

:roll:

 

[Pat-inCO]

I always wonder about folks who have to come onto an
internet site and ask what they should like. :roll:

Love it!

 

[longspurr]

Gunsmithing just after you buy a gun is not new. I remember it was standard procedure to buy a Colt 45 auto and give it to a gunsmith so it ran right.

I like to speed up the break in period of many guns by swabbing the barrels liberally with Flitz on a tight patch. This cleans up the machining edges and reduces leading. Even works on shotguns.

My favorite 22 is a Remington 581. It comes up and points like a part of me. I do like the 10/22 of course. It is my almost never fail semi auto.

Now I see some folks think asking for advice on "what gun?" is laughable. Well if you see enough of the uninformed public, then coming to a internet site to ask questions is better than asking the guy across the counter at the gun shop what to buy.

I just bought new tires for my truck based on what advice I got at an internet site. Tirerack has reviews and feedback from owners on about the tires. Why should guns be any different than tires for needing advice what to buy?

 

[REP1954]

"The Lounge."
"This Area is for Relaxing and Discussing Issues for Any Subject on Your Mind So Long as it is in Good Taste."

I guess this is why this thread hasn't been moved to the the Lounge by the moderators yet.

 

[SGW Gunsmith]

I always wonder about folks who have to come onto an internet site and ask what they should like.

:roll:

Now......that's funny. True though. :lol: And I'm SURE that nobody "lies" concerning internet reviews. :roll:

 

[Pat-inCO]

I guess this is why this thread hasn't been moved to the the Lounge by the moderators yet.

Possibly, but more likely that it is about the .22 rim fire.
(as stated in the initial post).