The big battle ships

[GunnyGene]

There will come a day when we will wish we still had ships like the USS Missouri. Updated with nuclear power plants, and modern tech.

 

[sfhogman]

Working at the VA Med Center in San Francisco, above the Cliff House, we got to see them come through the Golden Gate from the high bluffs. Awesome and beautiful sight. Enjoyed seeing the carriers too, but nothing like seeing a battleship...

Jeff

 

[toysoldier]

I read a book about the Iowa-class battleships that had an interesting final chapter. The author explored the possible role of the battleship in modern combat.

The first point in their favor was a Pentagon study that showed that an estimated 80% of any future combat would occur within range of the ships' main armament.

The second point was survivability. They have 15" main armor, and even 5" armor further up the superstructure. No one makes bombs or cruise missiles to defeat that much armor. The British cruiser sunk in the Falklands war took a hit from an Exocet missile that didn't explode; its exhaust caught the aluminum superstructure on fire.

The third point was economy and accuracy. In 15 minutes, an Iowa-class battleship could deliver, with greater accuracy, as much explosive power as could be delivered in all-day flights from a Nimitz-class carrier---at a fraction of the cost.

But they are gone.

 

[Wyandot Jim]

What a BEAUTIFUL ship.

FWIW My Naval Aviator Daughter had her promotion and Oath from O-4 to O-5 on the Surrender Deck of the Mighty MO. Her Mother pined on the Oak Leafs while in Pearl Harbor Hawaii.

 

[bobski]

ehhhh, as nice as they are...the whole concept is obsolete or they wouldnt have mothballed them.
all out war is a thing of the past and spitting lead thru the sky has lost favor. its now laser guided anything.

64 is parked here in norfolk, va.

 

[Jeepnik]

The USS Iowa, BB-61 is local. Interestingly, it's only on "loan". Apparently anything they do to it, such as handicap access is supposed to be easily reversible in case it needs to be reactivated.

But, as someone already said, those big guns are pretty much obsolete (alien attack being the only exception). Guided munitions while more expensive, are more precise (though I've seen some pretty amazing footage of what those big guns can do).

 

[Selena]

ehhhh, as nice as they are...the whole concept is obsolete or they wouldnt have mothballed them.
all out war is a thing of the past and spitting lead thru the sky has lost favor. its now laser guided anything.

64 is parked here in norfolk, va.

By that criteria the A-10 is obsolete. Wouldn't care to argue that point with a few infantry types back from Afghanistan or Iraq would you? I remember my Dad telling me about an aircraft that Washington decided that "spitting lead through the sky" was unnecessary so they were armed only with missiles. Problem was they kept getting shot down by MIGs because they couldn't properly defend themselves.

 

[redhawker]

We've got 61 down near me. Still got to go see it.

 

[blackhawknj]

I visited the New Jersey down in Camden 10 years ago or so. After all the years of model building and watching films, to actually stand on one....

 

[m657]

I was fortunate to take the limited tour on Big Mo when docked in Astoria on the way to Hawaii about 20 years ago.

Until then I hadn't really considered just how MANY skilled hands it took just to keep it in operational condition.

And I never realized just how crowded that little 'surrender deck' really was.

Inside the Astoria Maritime Museum was a special display of a hull section from the last Japanese battle ship sunk in battle. It was hard plate armor about the size of a large refrigerator door and very thick. There was a clean cut 15" hole punched through the middle of it courtesy Big Mo, if I got my details right.

 

[GunnyGene]

ehhhh, as nice as they are...the whole concept is obsolete or they wouldnt have mothballed them.
all out war is a thing of the past and spitting lead thru the sky has lost favor. its now laser guided anything.

64 is parked here in norfolk, va.

I don't think "nice", is a word I would use to describe one of the most lethal war machines the world has ever seen. Majestic, yes. But nothing "nice" about them. :wink:

In any case, I think you missed my point. Ships like this updated with modern propulsion, armament, etc. would not be obsolete. There was, in fact, a proposal quite a few years ago to keep a couple in service with a tomahawk battery replacing one of the turrets, and other defensive and offensive upgrades. And like the carriers, these ships did not operate on their own. They were part of a battle group, just as carriers are now.

Nor is all out war a thing of the past. It is also a thing of the future, and perhaps not so far in the future.

And to reiterate: There will come a day................

 

[Jeepnik]

ehhhh, as nice as they are...the whole concept is obsolete or they wouldnt have mothballed them.
all out war is a thing of the past and spitting lead thru the sky has lost favor. its now laser guided anything.

64 is parked here in norfolk, va.

By that criteria the A-10 is obsolete. Wouldn't care to argue that point with a few infantry types back from Afghanistan or Iraq would you? I remember my Dad telling me about an aircraft that Washington decided that "spitting lead through the sky" was unnecessary so they were armed only with missiles. Problem was they kept getting shot down by MIGs because they couldn't properly defend themselves.

True the early Phantoms weren't gun fighters. But that was corrected. But truth be told, one old Phantom properly armed could take out a battleship.

 

[bobski]

if battleships were still needed, theyd be serving today. heck, last time we activated them, the govt had to give simple sailors officers pay to come back to teach the new generation how to use them.

the term 'nice' can only be understood by those that walked decks on ships at sea.

heck...men ran those ships.

today, men sit in trailers in langley and fight wars in iraq with drones.

battleships dont have men to man them anymore. they have pregnant women and gays.
do the battleship a favor. let it be retired like i am. thank GOD.

and 22 years navy gives me license to my opinion. thanks for allow it.

 

[Ruger1441]

The powers to be have been wrong how many times? The battleships have been brought back to life for the Korean, Nam and Irag wars. Sure would not hurt to have a couple ready for action.

 

[bobski]

doing what? giving support to an all out beach invasion?
hasnt anyone noticed? we switched to specops lately.
all out beach warfare is a thing of the past.

and you forget? subs have torpedoes? and what they are armed with...i wont go into.

 

[737tdi]

USS Iowa with the USS Coral Sea in 1989. I can tell you I sure felt safe with that big bomber with us. I know I have posted this pic. before but it seemed another wouldn't hurt. This was taken by me off of the flight deck. The brown haze is the pollution off of the coast of Egypt. We were also with her when the terrible explosion happened in the Caribbean. I disagree with anyone who thinks they would not be of use today. Major targets in the middle east are within her range, be it with guns or cruise missiles, those Iranian gun boats in the Persian gulf would be fodder. JMO.








Semper Fi:

Karl


Edited to add: The other ship is not the USS Coral Sea. It is the LHA4, USS Nassau, it was nice having her there as well. There was a reason for this. Things in Lebanon were not going well and an invasion was planned. That was the scuttlebutt anyway.

 

[Fox Mike]

BB-65, the USS TEXAS, just celebrated 100 years since her commissioning. My Father-in-law was a stationed on her early in his career. She is still afloat at the San Jacinto Museum of History. Lots of history for her. She was the 'flag ship' of the Normandy invasion and was also one of the BBs that pounded Iwo Jima. Some photos here: https://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images;_ylt=A0LEVxsUagJUrRgA8d5XNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTB0a2k5azRvBHNlYwNzYwRjb2xvA2JmMQR2dGlkA1NNRTU5M18x?_adv_prop=image&fr=yfp-t-901-s&va=uss+texas+battleship+museum

 

[737tdi]

Frank: The museum is always asking for volunteers to help keep her floating. I spent a bit of time on her, painting, chipping all around horrible work but it is worth it to keep her afloat. Just visit the USS Texas webpage for info.., be ready to sweat though, the humidity down there is horrible.

Karl

 

[GunnyGene]

It wasn't my intent to start an argument about the usefulness of BB's in today's world, and I know we all have our opinions on one side or another.

But, I'll make an analogous point here: Single action revolvers are also old technology. Six shots one at a time, slow to fire and reload, etc. But I notice a lot of us still have one or more in the stable that gets shot regularly, and many folks carry a wheel gun daily. Must be something to it besides nostalgia. :mrgreen: :lol:

 

[george preston]

"By that criteria the A-10 is obsolete. Wouldn't care to argue that point with a few infantry types back from Afghanistan or Iraq would you? I remember my Dad telling me about an aircraft that Washington decided that "spitting lead through the sky" was unnecessary so they were armed only with missiles. Problem was they kept getting shot down by MIGs because they couldn't properly defend themselves."

Nothing knocks the enemy back on their heels like a warthog flying low and slow! God bless those pilots!

 

[volshooter]

Moth balling the A10 or the big battle ships is a mistake. Both are proven platforms. Damn shame.

 

[Fox Mike]

Frank: The museum is always asking for volunteers to help keep her floating. I spent a bit of time on her, painting, chipping all around horrible work but it is worth it to keep her afloat. Just visit the USS Texas webpage for info.., be ready to sweat though, the humidity down there is horrible.

Karl

The wife and I were there during the celebration and spent the week in the same motel as Bruce Bramblett (sp). Got to talk a LOT about what is happening and what is needed to happen to keep her afloat and in condition. Were you, by any chance at the dinner, on Saturday night, for the former crew-members and their families? It is a bit of a drive for use to help out since we are in Maryland. Have you seen these videos?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vncKxAOeCM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rByaOHfnaU

 

[Colonialgirl]

Anybody visited the USS North Carolina in Wilmington, NC ?
We did once on our way to vacation at Myrtle Beach. Fascinating !!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_North_Carolina_(BB-55)

(BB-55)
Namesake: State of North Carolina
Ordered: 1 August 1937
Builder: New York Naval Shipyard
Cost: $76,885,750
Laid down: 27 October 1937
Launched: 13 June 1940
Sponsored by: Isabel Hoey
Commissioned: 9 April 1941
Decommissioned: 27 June 1947
Struck: 1 June 1960
Nickname: Showboat

 

[737tdi]

Frank: The museum is always asking for volunteers to help keep her floating. I spent a bit of time on her, painting, chipping all around horrible work but it is worth it to keep her afloat. Just visit the USS Texas webpage for info.., be ready to sweat though, the humidity down there is horrible.

Karl

The wife and I were there during the celebration and spent the week in the same motel as Bruce Bramblett (sp). Got to talk a LOT about what is happening and what is needed to happen to keep her afloat and in condition. Were you, by any chance at the dinner, on Saturday night, for the former crew-members and their families? It is a bit of a drive for use to help out since we are in Maryland. Have you seen these videos?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vncKxAOeCM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rByaOHfnaU

Frank: We did not get to go because it was a weekend. Wow, deja vu. I try to support a lot of different causes and sometimes I run out of time, especially if they do it on the weekends. I have Thurs/Fri. off so it does not bode well for some of this stuff unless I take vacation days. The real world seems to think that everybody has Sat./Sun. off. It is not fair. LOL.

Karl

 

[k22fan]

[...] Inside the Astoria Maritime Museum was a special display of a hull section from the last Japanese battle ship sunk in battle. It was hard plate armor about the size of a large refrigerator door and very thick. There was a clean cut 15" hole punched through the middle of it courtesy Big Mo, if I got my details right.

Splitting hairs here. I hope this is slightly interesting and not just annoying. The Mighty Mo was the last USN battleship to become operational. She arrived in the Pacific to late to fire her guns at Japanese warships. She did shore bombardment and screened carriers with her AA guns. She was hit by 3 Kamikazes but for USN battleships that hit other warships with cannons you have to look at older classes of battleships. The surrender was signed on her deck for the same reason she was named Missouri. Pres. Truman ordered her named for his home state and ordered the surrender sighed on her.

Incidentally, the last Japanese battleship sunk during WWII was Yamato. She was not hit by ship cannons. She was overwhelmed by those pesky little airplanes.

 

[blume357]

Does anybody remember that from 1914 - 1918 'we' had the war to end all wars?

 

[toysoldier]

Does anybody remember that from 1914 - 1918 'we' had the war to end all wars?

Of course. The USS Texas is from that war. Still served n WWII.

 

[Sturgis270]

Some years ago I swung by Norfolk on my way to North Carolina. I had always wanted to see one of these ships in person. The Wisconsin, BB-64 was awesome! Was able to walk on deck and since that time has been opened for tours below deck. I really want to go back for the below deck tour. Will be attending a wedding in Virginia this October so may make it happen. I also had a chance to tour the North Carolina. Very impressive.

 

[The Blackhawk Kid]

If Freedom could be a vision it would be a Big Battleship! Makes me proud to be an American!

 

[Selena]

Does anybody remember that from 1914 - 1918 'we' had the war to end all wars?

Come on blume, that was five wars ago!