Ia Drang

Cooperhawk

Buckeye
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East Central Minnesota
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KB-qZv2H1pE

Doesn't really tell it all and I am no fan of Walter Cronkite. Mel Gibson's movie only described about three days. The battle went on for weeks.

My partner and I were in Nha Trang doing weight and balance adjustments on Forward Air Controllers aircraft in Oct. We received orders to move to Pleiku as quickly as possible. We were flown in there on a C130 full of barrels of Av Gas. No smoking!

We got there in early Nov. We immediately started working on Gunships of MACV that were involved in the battle. The problem was the ships were so out of balance they had problems bringing the nose up for landing. We inventoried each ship fully loaded with guns, ammo, drinking water, ect. Just how they flew them.

All this time the helicopters were bringing in casualties. Helicopters came in with dead crewman hanging in straps. Two of our helpers without asking volunteered to act as door gunners and disappeared. The Graves Registration was set up not far from where we slept and each evening we searched the casualties looking for them. We found them alive and well a week later. All in all we were there two weeks of the battle.

When we were flown back to our unit in the South the First Sargent asked what had happened, so I told him. He called me a liar and said he had been reading all the dispatches and none of that happened. A week later he called me in and apologized. The Army had been keeping our losses secret.

Those are days I will never forget. We slept with loaded weapons. Artillery and flares were going off all the time. The one thing that haunts me to this day is the youth that were lying there dead. I was 25 and an old man to them. They were mostly 18 to 20.
 
I read a lot of the true history of Ia Drang back when I was in the Army,,, as Air Cav. What I read,,, I read knowing even then it couldn't have done justice to the actual event. It always gets me when I hear about it. And I wasn't even old enough to go back then.
 
And the memories come back at very unexpected times and for the slightest of reasons....
 
THANK YOU ALL FOR YOUR SACRIFICE AND SERVICE! I wish I could say more or something to help. I appreciate every one of you.
 
I'm not an overly religious person, but I do pray for all service members, daily. We as a nation owe you all a debt we can't repay. Thanks for your service.
 
I lived through that era. I was subject to the draft, and had a lottery number of 82. They drafted up to 150. I was in school to be a nurse, and the government saw fit to leave me there. In the film a Col. mentioned how well the North Vietamese fought, when asked, the Americans did well(for every American lost, NV lost 10), but didn't wish to make a statement regarding the South Vietnamese forces who fought with us! It was said they fought NV regulars, in one place, then mentioned the NV were mere children in others. A crazy war for sure. Back in 1965 I was 15, not very attuned to politics, but awakening. It seems to me that Walter Conkrite was more of a reporter then( just the facts?), and not one to "spin" things. Perhaps if I saw more of him back then through adult eyes, I would feel differently? As I have previously mentioned my father a Master Sergeant in WWII, and one of the young soldiers commented, WAR IS HELL. For you who served- THANK YOU!
gramps
 
When I returned from Vietnam I went on to my next assignment (in Denver) thinking that my year in Vietnam had little real impact on me. I had done my tour, saw my share of horror, but now I was lucky to be alive, home and uninjured. I thought myself lucky in many ways, and wondered about those who could not get back to "normal" life. I went on to serve another 19 years in the Army and then retired. Life was busy, children growing up, work often a hassle and rarely, very rarely, did I even think about my time in Vietnam. Honestly, I found myself remembering the good times during my three years in Heidelberg, Germany more than I dwelled on time with the 326 Med Bn, 101 Airborne (Airmobile), mostly at Camp Eagle, RVN).

But once, and only that once, back in 1996, fully 25 years after my return from RVN, I was jogging through a local park/museum early on a Sunday morning in the summer of 1996. A stretch of the walking path was flanked by grasses about 6 or 7 feet high, totally blocking any sight beyond. It suddenly came into my head how much this spot reminded me of parts of Vietnam. Just at that moment I heard the unmistakable sound of Huey's approaching and glanced up and saw a formation of 5 coming toward me at about 1500 feet altitude (later I realized they were likely National Guard). I paused without thinking, and there in front of me was a family coming down the path toward me. They were about 100 yards away, but it sent an instant shock through me as I saw the woman wearing the traditional Vietnamese dress, walking with a man and two little ones on bicycles. The combination of the high grass, the heat, the Hueys above me and the Vietnamese family coming toward me knocked me to my knees trembling. I truly thought that the last 25 years had been nothing but a dream, and that I was still in Vietnam. Moments later the family I saw ran up to me to ask if I was okay, since all they saw was a guy in his 50's in running clothes fall to the ground. In perfect English they helped me up and asked if they should call 911 for me. The feeling of deja vu passed just as quickly as it had come. Nothing like this had ever happened to me before, and nothing since that day almost 20 years ago. But I now had to admit to myself that my time in Vietnam had made much more of an impact on me than I had ever realized.

As I get older, I now find I think about that year more and more. My grandchildren ask me if it is true that I was once a soldier and that I was "in a war". The word "Vietnam" holds no special meaning for them, and I am sure none of my ten grandchildren could likely locate it on a map. The look in their eyes is the same look I used to have when thinking of my Dad and my uncles in WWII, or my grandfather who served the Czar against the Japanese in 1906. I guess this is the legacy that war leaves us.
 
Hi,

Like gramps, I watched Walter Cronkite thru eyes less jaded then than now, but I'd still rather have him on my TV screen than most of our TV "journalists" today! Regardless of his positions, he was professional in presenting them, not giggling and playing footsie under the table with the mandatory pretty female co-anchor...

I wasn't "there": the same year gramps mentions his low lottery number coming up, I was a senior in college with a number of 242. I wasn't taking enough classes to keep a student deferment, so there was 1-A draft card in my wallet. The lady at the Selective Service office told me they'd only gotten to 195 the year before, so it was up to me whether to sign up for more classes to be sure of getting the 2-S back, or take a chance and just wait it out. I chose the latter and it was a nervous year, though, as gramps points out, they only got to 150. After graduation I applied to USAF OCS, but a flight surgeon didn't like something he saw and they didn't want me. Many friends went to Viet Nam, though, where their experiences ranged from "just another day at work" sending jets off the Enterprise day after day to the absolute horrors of surviving Khe Sanh or being Navy corpsmen patching up their shot up Marines in the jungle, with a lot of things in between. Thank God, they all made it back in one piece physically, though nobody comes back untouched psychologically from such experiences. So whatever knowledge I have of what went on is all second hand.

When Mel Gibsons' movie came out, I saw it, and though I knew it was based on a real battle, it wasn't one I knew about to any degree. Some time later I read then Lt. Col. (now Lt. Gen., Ret) Hal Moore's book and got a different, hopefully more complete, view of it. Is is safe to assume Gen. Moore's book is pretty accurate?

Rick C
 
I drove to Nha Trang from Cam Ranh Bay in a 3/4 ton in late 1967. We received sniper fire on our way and the E-5 lifer with us suggested we stop and go after the sniper. The vote was 3 to 1 to step on the accelerator. The 3 short timer E-4 draftees won the vote and weren't about to walk into an ambush. :)
 
In the 90's, while waiting for a hair cut, I was reading a magazine article about the battle(s) in the Ia Drang and it mentioned the book by Hal Moore. I went out and bought it immediately. Great insight as to what that battle was like. Was excited when to movie came out. To be sure, the movie is certainly "Hollywoodized" especially the final U.S charge but still captures how badly outnumbered our troops were and how hard they fought. Also, the job done by the helicopter pilots was nothing short of heroic.
 
Yes. The sound of a chopper, smell of av gas. And the chuff of a fireworks mortar got me ready to duck. Memories of those who gave their lives. greg
 
In Vietnam we badly underestimated the enemy. And too many career types saw it merely as way of punching their tickets instead of actually leading,
 
I only know what I've seen in Gibson's movie. I have the utmost respect and gratitude for those who have served and those who now serve. "Thank you" never feels like it's enough.
 
DixieBoy said:
dougader said:
I only know what I've seen in Gibson's movie. I have the utmost respect and gratitude for those who have served and those who now serve. "Thank you" never feels like it's enough.

I feel much the same. I was 11 years old when Ia Drang was going on.

It's funny, because I had the same 'lottery' number as gramps, but I've just turned 62 in December and, as I understand
it, that year 1972 was the last year we were sending any of our boys to Vietnam. Had a surfing buddy who drew
the draft lottery number 5, was called to go to his physical exam up in Jacksonville, passed that exam, but was
never called again.

Over the years we HAVE learned some things about Vietnam, beyond how badly so many of the guys were treated
upon returning home. Someone mentioned Walter Cronkite earlier. It wasn't until years after the war that I came
to despise Walter Cronkite, for when he decided he wasn't going to be a reporter any longer, but a political activist.

My point is this: while studying the Vietnam War from the safety of my college classroom in the 1990s, I came
across a 1990s interview in the Wall Street Journal. It's accessible today. The subject of the interview was a man
named Bui Tin, who was North Vietnamese General Giap's number two. Bui Tin made clear that Tet was a colossal
failure for the communists. They had been talking surrender among themselves, and wondering how
they might regain ANY momentum, after the huge beating they got on so many fronts during Tet. But then ...

Then, Walter Cronkite got on TV, and told all of America that, after Tet, he didn't believe the Vietnam War was
winnable. This ripped the stuffing out of the entire country. I don't believe that America had any intention of letting
our boys win in Vietnam AT ALL after Cronkite spewed his poison. From my point of view, and I know I'm not alone
here, it is immoral to send men to war when the government doesn't intend for them to win.

There was so much loss of life in Vietnam AFTER our government abandoned the South Vietnamese, not to mention
the slaughter in Cambodia after we skedaddled. This short 5 minute video probably makes my case better than
I can right now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hqYGHZCJwk Watch this, and see what you think.

- DixieBoy




You are absolutely correct. The US could have pounded and fought the NVA and Viet Cong into submission and final surrender. There is no doubt. Why we did not is a subject I just don't understand. Thousands of US troops dead and we give up? Could have worn out that whole country. Why didn't we? I am just 53 and I still don't understand?

For all of the heroes who served during that war. God Bless all of you and prayers that someday you can come to some peace. I spent 10 years in the Corps but never had the experiences y'all did.

I sure hope that you all had a great life after.


Semper Fi:

Karl
 
The OP shares the same opinions about the political motivations of the war and has no objection if folks here want to discuss it. I see it as a learning potential for lots of younger folks.
 
God bless all of you who did his duty. I am a Cold War vet and have no glory to my name other that serving without dishonor. I saw the movie and have read a bit on the battle, but that means nothing compared to having lived through it. Be at peace all of you who survived. TD
 
Throughout human history all wars are the same, and all wars are different.

Through a glass, darkly:

http://www.generalpatton.com/quotes/index4.html

There's a series on the History Channel: Live to Tell, that's worth watching.
 
blackhawknj said:
One Army general said it best:
"There was a tendency to underestimate the enemy."


I don't think we underestimated the enemy, we just didn't understand the method of warfare. Major wars have known combatants. I.E., they are uniformed and easily recognizable. Also, most western armies are not prone to indiscriminate killing, meaning killing civilians. WWII was a different beast, just bomb the crap out of the whole country until you have destroyed any ability to continue the fight. Right or wrong this does work and if you really want to win it is a must. Basically submit or die. In Vietnam the French or Americans were not willing to go that far. The Korean war was a starter for a losable war. You can't bomb this or that. You can't cross these lines. IMO you can't make these choices, if it is war then you must use every thing at your disposal. I think this would actually lessen conflicts, knowing that your entire population could be exterminated. Sounds harsh but war is not something to take lightly.


Semper Fi:

Karl
 
I still feel guilty about the Vietnam war. I was drafted in 1964, a good bit older than most of the guys I was about a month short of my 22 birthday. Went to Fort Lenard Wood for basic and was sent from there to Fort Richardson, AK. did a year there and another year at Fort Wainwright, AK. I still feel guilty about not being sent to VN where so many others had to go. There wasn't much of a fight yet when I got in, the Army was just beginning to ramp up for the war but mostly it was 'advisors' there at the time. I guess none of us really had a choice of what the Army wanted to do with us, for many it was the war in Viet Nam, for me it was in a Signal Battalion in Alaska. But I have to tell you when I visited the Wall in D.C. it was really upsetting. All those young people lost for damn all nothing. So many lives cut short for politics. I deeply regret that LBJ and Robert MacNamara weren't assassinated.
 
Seems all of is in our (mainly) 50s or older are/were affected by VN whether we went there or not. It illustrated our nation's weaknesses and divisions seen earlier in post-WW2 decisions about dealing with harsh problems.

I was there as a signal-support troop at the beginning of the cowardly pullout,arriving 2-2-70. Yeah,"let's leave it to the ARVN and say we did our best".
 
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