Help w/ the 7mm Mauser

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rugerlovah

Single-Sixer
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Messages
196
I am looking for some suggestions on reloading the 7x57 ruger m77r (tang safety). I have been working on this rifle for some years ... its a labor of love. i have never gotten it to shoot well though. In fact, its my only rifle that doesn't shoot well (2 other rugers included).

I have had it carefully worked over by a trusted gunsmith, who free floated the barrel and gave it a perfect trigger pull. He says barrel looks fine, its not corroded or defective in any way. But, so far, the ONLY load it will group with is the standard remington green box 139 g. express, which groups into 2-3" at 100 yds for 5 shots.

with my handloads i have been shooting pretty much exclusively hornady soft points. I have tried 139 g. spire point, 154 RN (really thought these would do better), and 162 g. BTSP. have tried H414 and H4831SC powders, in every weight recommended in the hodgdon reloading center from minimum to max. the only pattern I have noticed is that as the bullet weights get heavier, the groups turn into patterns. I have shot some 6"-8" patterns at 100 yds with the 162 g. bullets in particular.

I have tried loading the bullets out to the lands, too. with no difference in grouping whatsoever. This is always an interesting endeavor, though, as the lands seem to be WAY out there.

So, with the only guidance so far being that it prefers lighter bullets to heavier bullets, any suggestions out there for further load development? what has worked for you in this rifle? the two components i have on hand that i havent tried yet are some 120 g. bullets and a bottle of h4350 powder.

btw, I prefer to shoot the milder loads (like the remington factory load). i know some people out there shoot "hot" 7x57 loads in the ruger m77 (that are still only moderate loads in a modern firearm). but if bigger powder charges is what its going to take to make this thing group, i guess i will be open to trying it.

thanks in advance for your input
 

agoetz2005

Bearcat
Joined
Feb 1, 2006
Messages
17
Location
Murfreesboro, TN USA
If the lands are "way out there" you may have excessive throat length.

I shoot the Barnes TTSx line exclusively (Lead Free).

I usually load the 140gr TTSX, in front of H414. Barnes lists the minimum of 44.0gr at 2,567fps,. and the max at 46.5gr at 2,719fps.

I have the extemded PDF file from Barnes with their bullets and load data for each. If you'd like it, I can email it too you.
 

Hammer

Single-Sixer
Joined
Oct 1, 2006
Messages
231
.

Have used a 7 x 57 Mauser with success on African plains game.

Used 175-grain Nosler Partitions at 2,300 fps fired from a 1895 Chilean Mauser.

Stopped kudu, wildebeest, etc all with single shots.

Have since built several more 7 x 57 on a variety of actions including the current left-hand Ruger 77 with an 8-inch twist Shilen barrel.

Have never tried to magnumize the 7 x 57, though it probably could be in the Ruger.

.
 

mattsbox99

Hunter
Joined
Jan 12, 2009
Messages
3,391
Location
Montana 'Merica
My .280 was similar, it didn't really like anything until I tried the 150 grain Nosler ETip. I went from 2" groups (perfectly acceptable for deer hunting, and I shot 7 deer with that gun) to 3/4" @ 200 yards.

280100y150net54re22319oal.jpg
 

wunbe

Buckeye
Joined
May 19, 2002
Messages
1,240
Location
Reston VA USA
I doubt that going to lighter bullets will help at all but you never know.

Had the same rifle and problems with it. Tried many of the same fixes. It had a very long throat and the only rounds it shot near 1.5 MOA were 175 gr, Federals. Lots of the early Ruger #1s in 7x57 also had the same problems. They all shot best with the original standard issue 175 gr rounds.

Newer Rugers in the caliber have much tighter chambers.

You can have the barrel pulled, shortened a bit and rechambered to reasonable dimensions for not too many $s. Or send it back to Ruger for a fix. They actually do such work these days instead of telling you that 3MOA is "good enugh for hunting".

wunbe
 

rugerlovah

Single-Sixer
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Messages
196
ok, i took a picture of a 162 g. hornady spirepoint bullet seated right behind the lands, compared to the same bullet seated to the cannelure:

IMG_0878.jpg


long throat? the serial # of the rifle is 79-68xxx, which i think puts it at about 1985 manufacture.

will ruger still rebarrel the rifle if they don't have this caliber in production anymore? i lost my gun the last time i sent a discontinued caliber gun back to them (.32 h&r revolver)
 

wunbe

Buckeye
Joined
May 19, 2002
Messages
1,240
Location
Reston VA USA
Rugerluvah,

It looks like you'l need to weld an extension on that bullet to get it anywhaere near the landes!

I think if you check out a 175 gr. round, you may find it has a 'stubbier', round nose profile that engages the landes earlier than the sleakier more modern rounds. (I do not have both bullets here to compare them.)

My expereience with Rugers has been that they did not really start paying serious attention to modern chamber dimensions -- particualry on old classic rouns -- until around the early 1990s well after they also started making their own barrels.

Re: Ruger not returning your rifle in the same caliber. You could ask about that in advance. They st8ill are making 7x57s and have the reamers around the shop. Could be other complications twixt the MK Is and MK IIs too but that should not be a major stumblng block for the origional manufacturer.

Good luck,
wunbe
 

rugerlovah

Single-Sixer
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Messages
196
response from ruger customer service is to make sure that barrel bedding screw is torqued to 95 ft lbs. if that doesn't help, send in for review. $370 estimated cost for rebarreling. thoughts? opinions?

i dont THINK there is anything wrong w/ the barrel bedding screw tension. im thinking i might at least give the 175 g. RN bullets a try. thats the cheapest option, at least.

on an unrelated note, im actually impressed that i received such a detailed response. seems like ruger customer service used to be non-existent.
 

agoetz2005

Bearcat
Joined
Feb 1, 2006
Messages
17
Location
Murfreesboro, TN USA
that is a ridiculous amount of torque. Most car lug nuts are 75-85 lb/ft.

I think you mean 95 in/lb. which is still high.

Talk to a couple local smiths. all they have to do is set the barrel back to .005-.010 short, and rechamber to normal dimensions. Shouldn't cost $400 to do that.

If you do, get a good smith that will index it for you putting the caliber markings back where they belong. You might have a little more gap in the barrel channel after this, but if it shoots, then there ya go.
 

GRAMPS 51

Buckeye
Joined
Feb 19, 2007
Messages
1,407
Location
wtn ct usa
Hi I have a 70 prefix 7x57 that I played with for quite a while and the best round was factory rem 140 pt soft pt cor lokt 1 1/2 groups this is my go to deer rifle . This is only 1 of 2 m77s that I could not get to shoot under 1 moa the other is in 35 whalen

GRAMPS
 

pete44ru

Hunter
Joined
Dec 6, 2004
Messages
2,176
Location
Rhode Island
Years ago, I had to finally sell off a M77RS Mark I (tang safety) in 7x57 that I couldn't get to shoot the 175gr slugs I preferred - even going so far as to keyhole some.

(Believe me, when I tell you - I WENT OVER that rifle !)

Come to find out - back in the day, when Ruger was subcontracting their barrels, quite a few that were NG made it onto rifles.

You might have one of "those" barrels on your rifle.

.
 

agoetz2005

Bearcat
Joined
Feb 1, 2006
Messages
17
Location
Murfreesboro, TN USA
Having to set the bullet that far out tells me that the throat is excessive (read Weatherby-like freebore).

For 1/4-1/3 of the cost of rebarreling, you can have it set back and rechambered.
 

rugerlovah

Single-Sixer
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Messages
196
sorry to revive an old thread ... im just obsessed with this thing. its the only rifle i have that i cant get to shoot. everything other rifle i own (two other rugers included) shoots o.k. even w/ the worst loads, its just about making them shoot better ... but not this one. im just trying to get this one to shoot decent.

anyway, this time i tried some 120 g. hornady softpoints. i believe that these are probably made for 7x30 waters shooters ... deer hunting bullets, but made to go at slower velocities. i used H4895 and loaded them down to what should be about 2600-2700 fps. kind of whimpy, but certainly adequate for the kind of deer hunting i do w/in 150 yds or so.

started out at 50 yds:

IMG_0880.jpg


the shot to the left (but within the green circle) was the 1st shot off a cold bore. the next 3 actually went into a group! 1st time with this gun, literally!

i was pretty stoked ... so i moved the target on out to 100 yds

IMG_0879.jpg


2.1" for the last 7 shots i had remaining. blech ... actually, im trying to look on the bright side. its adequate for hunting as-is. not terrible ... just adequate. i just don't think it's going to do any better. btw, that's a REAL pleasant load to shoot.

had the steyr .243 out at the same time ... it shoots about anything less than 100 g. bullets well. it spoils me:

IMG_0881.jpg


IMG_0882.jpg
 

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