Getting Started: What is an ideal first press?

[Charlie U.]

I have entertaining the idea of reloading for years, but now I have a 480Ruger to feed so it's time to get this underway.
I've been doing a lot of reading on reloading equipment.....trying to decide which press is the best balance of quality and value. My shooting volume is moderate, so I don't need a progressive. I've decided to start with either a single stage"O" type press or a turret press. I will be loading a mix of rifle and pistol ammo including 9mm, 40s&w, 45acp, 357mag, 30/30win, 308win, 480Ruger, and others.

Models I'm considering:
1) Lee Classic Cast Breech Lock http://www.titanreloading.com/presses/lee-classic-cast-breech-lock-press

2) Lee Classic 4 Hole Turret http://www.titanreloading.com/presses/lee-turret-press/lee-classic-turret-press

3) Redding T-7 Turret Press http://www.sinclairintl.com/.aspx/pid=38307/avs|Manufacturer_1=REDDING/Product/Redding-T-7-Turret-Press

4) RCBS RockChucker Supreme http://www.midwayusa.com/product/646599/rcbs-rock-chucker-supreme-single-stage-press-master-kit

5) Hornady Lock-N-Load http://www.sinclairintl.com/.aspx/pid=37982/avs|Manufacturer_1=HORNADY/Product/Hornady-Reloading-Press

The Lee equipment is more affordable than the others, but I hesitate to buy cheap.......ain't worth having if it isn't going to perform as well or last as long. Are they a good value or am I better served by saving up and spending the money on the heavier models?

What do you recommend? Please share any experiences you have with these machines and the pros and cons each has.
Pics of your reloading bench would be very welcome!

Thanks

 

[Lost Sheep]

The Lee presses you name are not cheap. They just don't cost very much.

The Lee Classic Cast is a cast iron press of very high quality construction and sound design. Superior to Lee's Challenger and far superior to Lee's Reloader press (open front, simple leverage and aluminum construction).

The Lee Classic Turret is the best autoindexing turret press (currently made) in the world. Of course, there are only two such presses currently made, and the other is the Lee Deluxe Turret. If 4 die stations will do for you, it is the way to go. (And the way I chose).

I, too load for a half-dozen (or so) chamberings. The Lee is able to swap calibers faster than any other turret press (or progressive) on the market and is very fast to set up. (I keep my gear stowed when not in use).

My friend has a Lyman T-7 and he likes it as much as I like my Lee Classic Turret. A difference in taste and loading style. He loads in batch mode. I load in continuous mode usually.

I used my RCBS Rockchucker from the very beginning and will probably never part with it (unless I get a Forster or something like that). 37 years and still going strong, but it sees little use any more with the Lee Classic Turret in my stable.

The Hornady Lock-n-Load may deserve the spot above the RockChucker because of the quick-change bushings. I don't have any experience with the Hornady.

Check out Kempf's Gun Shop for their Lee Classic Turret kit. Unlike most kits, it does not require you to take anything you are likely to want to trade off (except the plastic ammo boxes). Sue Kempf knows her stuff and Kempf's will tell you beforehand if backorders are necessary. Many other retailers won't.

Midway also has (I hear) a nice kit.

I have more facts and opinions, but if we knew the quantities you contemplate loading and your shooting goals (hunting, casual plinking, IDPA, Cowby Action Shooting, 1,000 yard benchrest, etc) we could target our advice better.

Thanks for asking our advice.

Lost Sheep

 

[Charlie U.]

Lost Sheep, Thanks very much for the response.

In my search for info I have read a lot of positive as well as a good share of negative feedback about the Lee equipment. It get's kinda hard to devine the truth from all the talk. The Lee stuff sounded good, but I took a look at Lee's Reloader and Challenger models at my local gunshop and they did not make a good first impression......they seemed weak/lightly built compared to the RCBS and Hornady presses on display. However, there were none of the Lee Classic models there to make the comparison so I really need to take a look at them before I rule them out.

Thanks for bringing Kempf's to my attention. They are within driving range.....I'll be taking a little road trip over there sometime this week.

The brute size and weight of the T-7 appeals to me (in Tim Allen 'Tool Time' kinda way), but the thing costs so much more than the Lee gear........I can get the classic cast breech lock AND a classic four hole turret plus dies for the cost of just the T-7. I don't mind shelling out for quality, but if the Lee equipment is decent I don't want to spend more than I have to.
I guess that is the root of my question......How much better are the more expensive presses? Are they really worth all that additional expense?

My needs are Hunting, Light varmint work, and target/recreational use. I doubt I will average more than a few hundred rounds per week. (less in the winter, more in summer and fall) My interest in reloading is as much for the fun of doing it as it is for the cost savings it will provide.

 

[Jimbo357mag]

I started a few years ago with the Lee Anniversary kit and added a few things like calipers and scoops but if I had it to do all over again I would choose the RCBS RockChucker kit to start with. I have just never been completely satisfied with the Lee stuff. :shock: :shock:

 

[Lost Sheep]

Thanks for the details. They give us an idea of your needs.

I got one of the Reloader Presses (Lee could REALLY use some better naming conventions!) because it came with the manual on an offer I couldn't refuse. Both for less than the cost of manual alone. My friend got one, too.

I gave mine away (keeping the manual). My friend used his to load 45 ACP and 500 S&W until his T-7 arrived. It worked. After that, it served only as a mount for his powder measure. That is, until he tripped one day and fell against it. Snapped it off at the base. Now, THAT is a cheap press. Still, it worked as long as you don't try to use it as a grab rail.

The Challenger is more robust, but not nearly as strong as the Classic Cast. My RockChucker is heavier than the Classic Cast and probably has a bit more leverage, but for anything up to 300 H&H or bullet swaging, I would not feel it to be underpowered.

I am on the fence as to what to recommend to you. The quantity you shoot (and the variety) tends to suggest the Classic Turret. But varmint work requires the best accuracy that load development can give. One-piece "O" frame presses (and the Forster Co-Ax) are reputed to be better than turrets and progressives (because turrets and progressives have to have some "slop" for the moving parts). The Lee Turret (secured around the periphery), however, does lift straight up, where other turrets (secured in the center) tilt. Jury is out on whether or not it makes a bit of difference.

Most loaders, no matter what other presses they have, have at least one good single stage. If you can afford both, the Turret for your high-quantity cartridges and a single stage for your high-accuracy cartridges might fill your needs best. I would suggest the Turret first and measure concentricity, runout, consistency of cartridge length, etc (and, of course, how well the ammunition performs on target, after some judicious load tuning). If the cartridge dimensions are sloppy, adding a single stage would be the next step. But only if you find the need.

Many people do like to bash Lee products. Possible reasons are jealousy, prejudice or lack of experience with the better-made Lee models. Or, they just prefer the size or operational "feel" of the other products. I kind of like the linkage of my RockChucker better than my Classic Turret (but not enough to make me switch back). It just seems to move more proportionally.

When you get to Kempf's and check out the Classic Turret kit, also check out what scales are available. The Lee Scale is as accurate as beam scales costing 4 times as much, but devilishly hard to operate. It has a vernier to read tenths of grains which was very hard for me to see until I put the scale up on a shelf at eye level. My RCBS 10-10 with the micrometer adjustment is MUCH easier to use and goes up to 1,000 grains where the Lee Safety Scale only goes up to 100 grains. If you want to weigh bullets you will want to get a different scale anyway. Lee only makes the one scale.

I like to prime on-press. Many people like to prime with the Lee Auto-Prime (a hand primer) even though it is kind of a lightweight in the durability area (in my opinion). If you get one, keep it lubricated and it will last a LONG time.

Lost Sheep

 

[WESHOOT2]

Redding T-7 Turret Press

No stress on your budget?
This one.......


Pure single-stage from your list: RCBS.

 

[Sgt Garcia]

I'd go with the RCBS.....actually I did 35 plus years ago. You get what you pay for with Lee. With a few exceptions and none of them presses, I wouldn't go there.

You won’t regret spending a little more buying the better equipment to start with. I’ve bought many other presses over the years but still have and at times use my original RCBS press.

Dennis.

 

[mikld]

How patient are you? Are you detail oriented? Do you want to reload just to feed your guns or do you want to expand your shooting hobby, fabricate custom ammo, and learn more about your guns? For new reloaders I suggest a single stage press without breech sleeve/quick change dies. I feel the single stage allows you to learn what each step of reloading is for and why/how it's done. I say standard dies w/o breech sleeves because for successful reloading (especially for semi-autos and botttlenecked cartridges) die adjusting is extremely important (just look at some reloading forums and see questions about rounds not chambering, and feed jams, from improper sizeing die adjustment or incorrect bullet seating die adjustment). A turret press can be used single stage but it's easy to get "set it and ferget it" die adjustments.

Just about any modern reloading press is worth purchasing (but if you see "Smart Reloader" anywhere RUN), and all will last quite a while if treated properly. I've used Lee, Redding, C-H, and Pacific single stage presses, a Leee Turret (currently using), and used, not owned a Dillon 650 (?) progressive. I have learned all have their good and bad sides and that a lot of press choice is personal (some like the name or color or a gun writer's preference, or just plain old "tool snobbery").

 

[Lee Martin]

I really like the Redding Big Boss single-stage press. Reasonably priced and very well built.

 

[Hammerdown77]

Based on my own experience, and what I tell anyone asking me what press they should get to start out, I'd say get a turret press. Lee is the most economical and while I started off with their standard turret press, if I had it to do over again, I'd get their Classic Turret. It is a much nicer press than the one I have, much more stout and with a longer arm for more leverage. Plus, once you get the basics down, you can hook it up to auto index, which will speed up the process.

This kit has got to be one of the best deals going for a new reloader:
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/785993/lee-4-hole-turret-press-with-auto-index-deluxe-kit

 

[Lost Sheep]

Which type of press is best to start with?

This thread might give some useful thoughts.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=668114

Lost Sheep

 

[Lost Sheep]

I'd go with the RCBS.....actually I did 35 plus years ago. You get what you pay for with Lee. With a few exceptions and none of them presses, I wouldn't go there.

You won’t regret spending a little more buying the better equipment to start with. I’ve bought many other presses over the years but still have and at times use my original RCBS press.

Dennis.

Yes, you do get what you pay for with both RCBS and with Lee.

With RCBS you pay for a lifetime warranty. With Lee you get a one year or two-year warranty.

My RCBS RockChucker handles spent primers poorly, the Lee handles spent primers impeccably.

My (37 year old) RCBS handles new primers fabulously, but keeps the primers stacked in a tube that I have to fill myself. My Lee press requires finesse to operate the new primer feed, but feeds directly from the primer flipper tray, a great convenience and a tiny bit safer than stacked, live primers.

You get what you pay for. In metal, in design, in warranty.

You choose the features that fit your style.

I count the (single stage) RCBS and (the better models of) the Lee presses as equal value. The differences are a matter of fitting your needs, your loading style, your taste in color.

Lost Sheep

 

[Lost Sheep]

Based on my own experience, and what I tell anyone asking me what press they should get to start out, I'd say get a turret press. Lee is the most economical and while I started off with their standard turret press, if I had it to do over again, I'd get their Classic Turret. It is a much nicer press than the one I have, much more stout and with a longer arm for more leverage. Plus, once you get the basics down, you can hook it up to auto index, which will speed up the process.

This kit has got to be one of the best deals going for a new reloader:
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/785993/lee-4-hole-turret-press-with-auto-index-deluxe-kit

That IS a good deal.

Remember, though, some people dislike the Lee Safety Scale and wind up buying one easier to operate or with greater weight capacity (though finding one more accurate would be hard). And you still have to buy dies.

As I mentioned before, the kit from Kempf's does not force the scale on you. It also doesn't have the Lee Manual. But it is the same price and DOES include a deluxe set of dies (for the cartridge of your choice).

By all means, check out both retailers.

I like Kempf's because Sue Kempf is so helpful (and she reloads herself), it is a family store and two years ago they were the ONLY retailer to offer a kit built around the Classic Turret. Everyone else's was built around the (somewhat inferior) Deluxe Turret.

Lost Sheep

 

[#1rugerman]

I started out in the late 70's with a RCBS rockchucker (after using a Lee kit-not the nutcracker) and I'm still using it. I'd hate to know how many rounds I've loaded on that old press, not counting what my son put thru it. I still use it for all my centerfire stuff, good press I've been real happy with it and their customer service is top notch.

 

[Charlie U.]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the feedback from all of you,

Does RCBS have a breech lock/lock-n-load type of quick release for their presses? So far all of the RCBS single stage presses that I am seeing are regular style. If I go with a single stage press the convenience of a quick change die setup might be a big factor in making a selection. How does Lee's Breech lock compare to the Hornady Lock-n-Load? Is one any sturdier or more reliable than the other?

I like the idea of a turret because of the flexibility.......can be used as a single stage or in series. Plus, once things are set-up you can get additional turrets.

I'll take Lost Sheep's advice and check out Kempf's gun shop. Hopefully by getting a hands on look at things there I might come away with a better idea of what will be best for me. I'll let you know what I come up with.

 

[Charlie U.]

Also,
In addition to reloading I am planning on casting my own bullets for for the 480Ruger and 357mag. I have accumulated a huge stash of scrap lead and have a Lee furnace with some Lyman accessories which I use to cast .50 cal slugs and roundballs for muzzle loading. It should be no trick to expand that setup to cover my cartridge reloading needs.

What Lube/sizing setup would you recommend?

 

[Charlie U.]

I've been busy since I started this thread....shopping around and visiting area gun shops & sporting goods stores looking at reloading gear. Yesterday I made a trip to Kempf's gun shop in Michigan City, Indiana. Sue Kempf was there and was extremely helpful in answering my questions about reloading. She was very patient and used the store displays to answer a lot of my rookie questions. (Thanks again to Lost Sheep for suggesting Kempf's) They are a very small gun shop....not a lot of guns, but they do carry an impressive lineup of Lee equipment. I got a Lee bullet mold in .476....something I have been looking for which I was not able to find anywhere else.

I took a long hard look at the Lee Classic Turret and Sue walked me thru the details of it's setup/operation. The turret looked like a pretty useful unit and I can definitely see how it would speed things up, but the auto indexer has a flimsy looking plastic part at the base and it has a loose noisy action that made the "O" press seem better to me. The Lee Classic Cast single stage impressed me much more than the Classic Turret. I like it's solid feel, it's fully adjustable linkage, and the way spent primers drop out the bottom of the ram. The rest of the lee presses felt much less sturdy than the Classic models.

From what I have seen I have come to the conclusion that my needs starting out will probably be best served with a good single stage "O" press. I can add a turret press to my bench later (if necessary).
My top picks come down to the Rockchucker Supreme, Redding Big Boss II, or Lee Classic single stage.

 

[opos]

The Lee Breechlock system is really great....I've used it a lot and load with 3 different 4 die sets. I just bought a Classic Cast Lee press because I've been very satisfied with all the Lee products I've used since I began to reload again after a many year layoff..The Classic Cast Breech lock (stress the breech lock) is built like a tank...I think that some of the "hesitation" to use Lee products is "status" and I know of one guy that bashes Lee equipment over and over as being cheap and not quality....and he's never touched any Lee equipment...Lots of us shoot Ruger guns and are looked down on by the Smith and Wesson guys and visa versa....I shoot Rugers because they work and I load with Lee because it works...that's what makes a horse race...If I couldn't get the breech lock in the Lee set up I might be inclined to at least try something else but again....it's a great feature, it's proven, and it works for me...I'm not a snob..I don't like the Lee scale as it's hard for me to read so I have an RCBS 505 beam scale...it works...but I've been told that an electronic digital scale is the only way to go...again, brand or equipment snobbery....

 

[Charlie U.]

Thanks opos,

I hope I haven't come across as a brand snob.....I am a complete newb to reloading and am not brand loyal to anything. Having seen the Lee lineup at Kempf's I came away with the impression that some of it is good, but some of the stuff was of cheaper quality than I might want. (you mentioned the Lee scales....that is one piece of kit I was unimpressed by)

I got a hands on look at the breech lock and was wondering if I should get the classic cast press with or without it.
The breech lock is something that appealed to me......looked and felt solid and I like the convenience of a quick change with the push of a button and a quick twist, but on the other hand it's just one more moving part and I was kinda wondering if there might be a risk of it developing some slop/freeplay with wear and tear over time. Maybe I should follow the KISS principle.
There is also the option of getting regular classic cast and fitting it with the Hornady lock-n-load system. That can be added rather inexpensively at a later time.

 

[Rick Courtright]

There is also the option of getting regular classic cast and fitting it with the Hornady lock-n-load system. That can be added rather inexpensively at a later time.

Hi,

I'm not sure of the TRUE value of the LnL and BreechLock systems versus their MARKETING value. I figure if I were so stretched for time that I "needed" either to save some of it, I probably oughta be using a turret or progressive to start with!

However, if I had to choose between one of the two, I'd start w/ the "conventional" style press w/ the larger diameter hole and reducer bushing, and add the Hornady LnL system. You probably won't want to load the .50 BMG or other calibers that require the larger diameter dies, but if that urge hits you, I think you'll be unable to use the Lee system w/ them. I could be wrong--I've only looked at it in passing. If you have the Hornady system, you just unscrew it and you're good to go. And you can swap the Hornady onto any press that has the larger opening available. I'm pretty sure the BreechLock is a totally proprietary design. I have a thing about that philosophy...

But all these points may be moot for you, so pick a press--all of 'em on your list are good ones--and get to learning!

Rick C

 

[CraigC]

Looking back, I'm very glad I started with a turret press. It does everything a single stage does, most notably doing everything one step at a time, which is importantly when you're learning. It also is more convenient to have all your dies preset in your turret heads so that you're not wasting time changing/adjusting them. Which might not mean much if you're doing it for fun. I don't particularly enjoy it but only do is so I can shoot more.

Learn the process thoroughly before moving up to a progressive.

 

[Donaldjr1969]

Charlie, with regards to the auto-index rod in the Lee turret presses, both standard and classic cast, can be removed very easily. All you need to do is lift out the rod with a turret removed. I removed mine before I even put any dies in the turret. I batch-process my cartridges when I reload so for the, the auto-index would serve only to slow me down.

 

[Sugar River]

Been loading since ca. 1975 and have never regretted paying a little more for Redding products.


Pete

 

[cruzerlou]

I have a lee load all single stage press .I bought it as a kit a Lee load all starter kit .It came with a powder mesurer, a beam scale ,and lee primer kit with all the case incerts you should need unless your loading something real odd.The press it's self is an "o" or "d" type, made of cast iron and has worked like a charm for 20 years .All you need to buy is dies for the calibers you plan to load and lee sells a case triming tool that you just clamp the shell holder into the chuck on your drill and it comes with a burr remover that works for removing burrs inside and out side the case mouth and a trimmer tool .You buy calibler spesfic spacer that screws into the case trimmer and your all set. This starter kit cost about 100 bucks last time I looked a few months ago and for 50 bucks more you can get the same kit with a 3 stage non progresive press .with this one you can buy diffrent heads and just leave youe dies set up in each head.
This makes it easier to swich calibers .The only other thing you really need is a reloading manual and is a powder trickler and their cheap.
lou

 

[Wyandot Jim]

From a previous post.
Lot of good info also.
Jim
http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=135951&p=1368291&sid=3d65f47f1c55e15953031eb6c9b114e3#p1368291

Hey Guys,
I thought I would give my 3 cents worth on using a Lee Classic Turret Press. I won this about 3 years ago at a CAS shoot and have not used it a lot. As luck would have it I also won a Square Deal B that I sold to a RF member. I have probably loaded around 1000 rounds. I also have a RCBS Rock Chucker and a Dillon 650. Use the 650 most of the time and the RSBS for 45-70s.
This isn't about which is the best press, or the one you like. It is about what I think of this one for the guy starting out or someone that wants to load faster than you can on the RCBS single stage type. This whole package cost around $225, I did buy the micrometer adj. charge bar. Lot easier to use. IMHO
All I have loaded so far is 45 Colt and 44-40 with 700X, Triple 7, Pyrodex and Goex. All loaded great. One advantage loading BP is that you CAN double charge so it allows you to fill the case at the powder station. Can't do that with the 650. Mic. on the Lee will not allow a full case full to drop.
I plan on loading some 45-70 and 30 carbine in the future. (Have now loaded 30 carbine) The only thing I don't like is the way the primers are fead into the machine. I just install them with by fingers. Works for me. (WELL I now got the primer thing set right)
I know it's hard to tell in the pictures but my RCBS and Lee are just C Clamped in place and the 650 is bolted to a 3/4" ply and C clamped to the table. Makes it easy to move stuff around
Anyway a good press for the money. Is it a $900, 650 with case feed and powder check??? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOo way
Jim

 

[Charlie U.]

Thanks to you all for the great feedback.
After much deliberation I boiled it down to the Redding Big Boss II and the Lee Classic Cast single stage presses.

As a new reloader I felt a basic single stage would be best to start with....The Redding was very impressive and I liked it a lot, but the Lee looked almost as solid and shared almost all of the features that I liked in the Redding and at $75 less (comparing new presses)
so I plunked down on the Lee Classic Cast and a set of Hornady dies.

That will get me started. If reloading proves as enjoyable as I hope it will be I can save up and add a Redding T-7 in future.

Cheers,

 

[Ale-8(1)]

Darn, got here too late to vote.

Oh, well . . .

 

[Wyandot Jim]

Thanks to you all for the great feedback.
After much deliberation I boiled it down to the Redding Big Boss II and the Lee Classic Cast single stage presses.

As a new reloader I felt a basic single stage would be best to start with....The Redding was very impressive and I liked it a lot, but the Lee looked almost as solid and shared almost all of the features that I liked in the Redding and at $75 less (comparing new presses)
so I plunked down on the Lee Classic Cast and a set of Hornady dies.

That will get me started. If reloading proves as enjoyable as I hope it will be I can save up and add a Redding T-7 in future.

Cheers,

Good choice. Like I said I'm happy with mine for small loads. Also the Lee dies are great