Ammo For Snubbies - Short People Got... No Reason to Live !

[Hazama Yakiba]

OK, so I put a dumb song title in the subject of my post cause I thought of it as I was typing !

With that being said, my LCR is always loaded with WINCHESTER Bonded PDX1 38 Special +P 130 Grain JHP @ 950fps, but recently I read that SPEER "Gold Dot Short Barrel" [product code # 23921] +P 135 Grain Ammo with a lower velocity of 860fps is "THE BOMB".

I always carry Speer Gold Dot 124 Grain 9mm +P in my SR9c and know its great history, but I don't know anything about the ballistics of the Short Barrel 38 Special +P stuff.

Am I missing something here [advantages? disadvantages?], since the Gold Dot Short Barrel round seems sold out all the time, but that don't mean much to me since I'm looking for a hot round that will give me "The Biggest Bang for My Buck" [metaphorically speaking that is].

So...do any of you ammo Gurus know if the Speer round I speak of is just hype and I should hang with what I normally shoot? Or Jump ship to the Short Barrel ammo ???

[This post has been edited 250 times do to my lack of concentration in the face of no spell-check function within this forum] :roll:

Haz

 

[steve b]

The "short barrel ammo" will deliver the aimed for 8-10" of penetration that ammo makers aim for. Some forego that reasoning and stick with the regular variety for a bit more penetration. Other factors may become more of an issue. In my Kahr P-9, the bigger HP opening of the short barrel stuff, means poor feed issues. So...no short barrel stuff for the Kahr. My Glock chugs thru anything. Since you were talking .38's. Feed no issue, choose as to what penetration you desire. Its getting into winter up here, heavy clothing,etc.. another factor. steve b

 

[steve b]

That particular loading though, is very well thought of on a forum of more serious bent, tactically speaking. Me ? I'd not want to be hit by either. I'm allergic to bullets, they make me break out in holes.. Doc says to avoid if possible. steve b

 

[wwb]

First.... ignore the published muzzle velocity - it's not likely that you'll get it anyhow, as it's from a closed-breech test barrel, and usually a longer barrel than what you're using. The "short barrel" stuff has a faster powder, giving a quicker pressure rise to try and minimize the velocity loss seen in shorter barrels when using conventional slower powders.

In real-world terms, the difference between the two .38 Spl loads you mentioned is diddly point squat. If it comes to self sefense, you're better off worrying less about your ammunition and more about your ability to hit what you're shooting at.

 

[Tarheel]

I'm thinking I also read that the short barrel, also due to the quicker burning powder, produced less muzzle flash - which it theory should help in a night time defensive situation....

 

[Jimbo357mag]

Most handgun ammo meant for revolvers is tested with vented test barrels now-a-days and the barrel length and other pertinent info is available so reasonable velocity comparisons can be made. There is not much snubby velocity testing done by the manufactures and so you have to take them at there word, I guess. If they say 'faster powder' ok, but faster than what? The data I have seen for Speer 'short barrel' ammo seems to back up what they say, but not to any great difference. There is much aftermarket testing being done by individuals and published on the Web and elsewhere; everything from gelatin to water jugs to wooden planks. Take your pick.

For my money I think any 'self-defense' ammo, so listed by a major manufacturer, would be a good choice if it meets your expectations for accuracy, flash, power, etc. 8) 8)

...JImbo

 

[Dale53]

I am from the "more important is to hit where you NEED to hit) school. However, my preference in self defense for the .38 Special snub nose is the FBI load (158 gr Hollow Point lead) +P. I am currently using Federal brand in that load.

I slightly lean to factory loads for self defense but if I were loading my own for self defense, then a cast "soft" lead hollow point of about 158 grs would be my choice. The record is excellent on that load in actual case files (about equivalent to .45 ACP Hardball) and my daily carry is a Smith 642.

FWIW
Dale53

 

[ASRuger]

Out of all the common .38 hollowpoints the Gold Dots have the advantage of being able to be purchased in 50 round boxes for ~$30. That makes it among the least expensive of the premium (and non premium like the Remington 158gr+P LSWCHP) so you can buy more to practice more with them. Like you I've found they can be hard to find so when I do I usually buy a couple of boxes. Ayoob reports that the NYPD which issues the 135gr+P Gold Dot has been happy with it's performance for what that's worth.
It truly is more important where you hit them than what you hit them with. I would be happy with the Winchester PDX load if I couldn't get the Gold Dot.

 

[Enigma]

I am from the "more important is to hit where you NEED to hit) school. However, my preference in self defense for the .38 Special snub nose is the FBI load (158 gr Hollow Point lead) +P. I am currently using Federal brand in that load.

I slightly lean to factory loads for self defense but if I were loading my own for self defense, then a cast "soft" lead hollow point of about 158 grs would be my choice. The record is excellent on that load in actual case files (about equivalent to .45 ACP Hardball) and my daily carry is a Smith 642.

FWIW
Dale53

^^THIS^^ Shot placement is king. Penetration is queen. All else is just angels dancing on the head of a pin.

 

[mike7mm08]

I loaded some of these for my LCR. 135 grain around 830 fps.They shoot very well. And I was very impressed by penetration. At seven yards I got full penetration,both sides, on an old chest freezer. Thin layer of mild steel wrapped around two inches of dense foam. There was about a twenty four inch gap between the two sides. Entrance showed no sign of hyper expansion and the exit was about 45 caliber. Hard to ask for much better performance than that.

 

[Keltyke]

And I was very impressed by penetration. At seven yards I got full penetration,both sides, on an old chest freezer.

If I'm ever attacked by an old chest freezer, I'll keep that in mind.

 

[GaryA]

Dang, Haz, in South Florida can you just carry one of your beautiful swords? At bad breath distance, I think you'd be better off and you wouldn't have to worry about only five shots or reloading.

I don't know if the Speer load is better than what you currently carry, but it does have a good reputation and looks good in testing. It generally does come close or exceed advertised velocity and, reportedly expands very well. It certainly has a very aggressive hollowpoint.

 

[Jimbo357mag]

Hornady 'Critical Defense' looks good in testing also but hasn't been around long enough to have a track record. I'll stick with my Hydra-shoks. 8) 8)

...Jimbo

 

[tgs33]

I bought a couple 20 round boxes of Speer gold dots 327 mag for my sp101, and one of the rounds has a bulge in the case. Bad cartridge. I called Speer three weeks ago and left a message. Still waiting for a reply. I know Speer has a good reputation, but I won't buy any more of them. Although new to shooting- probably less than 3000 rounds down the range- the Speer is my first bad round, and on the most expensive ammo I have. I shoot ruger sp101 in 327 and 357, an lcr 38 sp and a Beretta 92F.

 

[44shootist]

Sounds like you need to buy the new speer reloading manual gives you all the specs. for the short barrel 135gr loads.

 

[mike7mm08]

And I was very impressed by penetration. At seven yards I got full penetration,both sides, on an old chest freezer.

If I'm ever attacked by an old chest freezer, I'll keep that in mind.

I was actually surprised by the performance. Good test media for a bullet. Dense foam and steel can really slow a bullet down.

 

[WESHOOT2]

1) First it MUST go bang;
2) It must do so with CONTROLLABLE accuracy.

So to the OP: Can you consistently ACCURATELY fire your current +P load?
If yes, you good to go.
If not, the reduced-recoil Speer "Short Barrel" choices might make more sense.


I mean, hits matter.....then comes with what.....

 

[writwing]

Have you looked at Buffelo Bores hard cast wadcutter? They cut and do not mushroom. Looks to be a good stopper.