Ruger Old Army, what powder do you use?
- Thread starter ruger22
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Single-Sixer
Goex is all I've ever used and always found it to work great. I'm curious about the substitutes but never got around to it.
ruger22 said:
Well,
What are you using it for??? How many grs. balls or bullets?? A full cyl. of 777 makes a pretty stout load. 777 has 15% more power than Goex.
I use about 25 grs. of 3f Goex in ROAs with a 147gr. ball and 3f triple 7 in 357 rifle.
Jim
gunman42782
Hunter
You will get the best ignition with real black powder, FFF.
Driftwood Johnson
Blackhawk
Howdy
Swiss is the best of the Black Powders on the American market, but it is also the most expensive.
If you can find Schuetzen, it is about the same price as Goex, but it is a superior powder. Schuetzen is made by Wano in Germany. Schuetzen uses the same Buckthorn Alder charcoal that Swiss uses, which results in a cleaner burning powder with less fouling. I am using nothing but Schuetzen in all my Black Powder cartridges now, it leaves behind less fouling than Goex. Graf also sells a powder under their own house name that is actually Schuetzen in their own bottle.
I buy Schuetzen in 25 pound lots with a friend. We buy it from Maine Powder House. You don't have to buy it 25 pounds at a time, they will also ship in 5 and 10 pound cartons.
http://mainepowderhouse.com/
Swiss is the best of the Black Powders on the American market, but it is also the most expensive.
If you can find Schuetzen, it is about the same price as Goex, but it is a superior powder. Schuetzen is made by Wano in Germany. Schuetzen uses the same Buckthorn Alder charcoal that Swiss uses, which results in a cleaner burning powder with less fouling. I am using nothing but Schuetzen in all my Black Powder cartridges now, it leaves behind less fouling than Goex. Graf also sells a powder under their own house name that is actually Schuetzen in their own bottle.
I buy Schuetzen in 25 pound lots with a friend. We buy it from Maine Powder House. You don't have to buy it 25 pounds at a time, they will also ship in 5 and 10 pound cartons.
http://mainepowderhouse.com/
rugerlovah
Single-Sixer
- Joined
- Jun 8, 2009
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i have a little stash of goex 3f, and thats what i use in the old army. 30 g. w/ a wonder wad and .457 hornady roundball hits to POA w/ the sights. it is dirty, but consistent. and its got the right smell for a BP revolver.
if i clean the revolver same day i shoot it, cleanup isn't a big deal. wait longer than that and the fouling will harden and be more of an issue.
if i clean the revolver same day i shoot it, cleanup isn't a big deal. wait longer than that and the fouling will harden and be more of an issue.
VAdoublegunner
Single-Sixer
I use Goex 3F, but have been thinking about getting some Triple 7 because of the higher velocity. I like full cylinder charges in mine, and it sounds like something decent to use with harder 1:20 cast balls.
Goex gives me really decent accuracy, but I do need to wet patch the barrel after about 3 cylinders to maintain best accuracy. Running a slightly wet patch in the front third of each cylinder at that time helps with seating the ball too.
I have some Elephant 3F, which looks more like 4F, as is also pretty dirty so I use it for flintlock priming. I like Swiss, but it is more difficult to get all the time.
Goex gives me really decent accuracy, but I do need to wet patch the barrel after about 3 cylinders to maintain best accuracy. Running a slightly wet patch in the front third of each cylinder at that time helps with seating the ball too.
I have some Elephant 3F, which looks more like 4F, as is also pretty dirty so I use it for flintlock priming. I like Swiss, but it is more difficult to get all the time.
STGThndr
Bearcat
I no longer have an OM sad to say, had to sell it off to get a duty revolver back in the day. (Bad trade). I did hot-rod the bp loads with conicals and crushing the load as hard as possible...Got 40 grains under a ball, a bit less under the conical. It being a Ruger and all I was sorely tempted to try 4 or 5 grain Unique loads, a lower-end .45acp level... Never did do it, tho. Not sure a perc cap would ignite the smokeless.. MAIN reason I was tempted was the godawful frequent cleaning, the thing gumming up in twelve shots.. Got rid of the pistol rather than my fingers! Wouldnt have considered it with any other bp BUT a Ruger.
Later I was tempted by the "ivory"-gripped 5 inchers but Ruger discontinued the OA before I knew it. Tho the grip was a bit small... The OM was my intro to "horse-pistols" and Ive always kept some form of .44 or .45 around. That OM accompanied me on several trips and long termed backwoods stays.
Anyone ever chrono the OA with various loadings? Would be interesting.
Later I was tempted by the "ivory"-gripped 5 inchers but Ruger discontinued the OA before I knew it. Tho the grip was a bit small... The OM was my intro to "horse-pistols" and Ive always kept some form of .44 or .45 around. That OM accompanied me on several trips and long termed backwoods stays.
Anyone ever chrono the OA with various loadings? Would be interesting.
I use GEOX FFF, works great and my Ruger Old Army is one of the most accurate sixguns I own.
STGThndr
I can give you the phone number of a shop that has a blued OM in beautiful shape with a very nice, heavy leather holster for $395 if you're interested. PM me. Not my gun but the dealer is a straight shooter and it is too nice to be sitting in the showcase tempting me every visit! BTW, he will do lay away, another reason it is one of my fav. shops. Holster alone gotta be worth $45.00
Vern
STGThndr
I can give you the phone number of a shop that has a blued OM in beautiful shape with a very nice, heavy leather holster for $395 if you're interested. PM me. Not my gun but the dealer is a straight shooter and it is too nice to be sitting in the showcase tempting me every visit! BTW, he will do lay away, another reason it is one of my fav. shops. Holster alone gotta be worth $45.00
Vern
Don't understand this. I shoot mine for two days at matches for 50 rounds each gun. All I do is wipe off the face of the cyl. and the nipples. I don't use grease over the balls either. Gumming could be from using a hydocarbon base oil. I use Ballistol.
Ruger states in their manual the most accurate load is 25grs. 3f with a filler and a ball loaded to 1/16" of the face of the cylinder.
Jim
Trinidad Bill
Bearcat
I just launched 18 balls this morning! About 22gr of Elephant FFFg and Pyrodex with CornMeal filler.
I continue to be amazed at the accuracy of the Old Army!
Now if I could only find a replacement base pin!
I continue to be amazed at the accuracy of the Old Army!
Now if I could only find a replacement base pin!
CraigC
Hawkeye
I like Triple7 in rifles but use strictly Goex FFFg in pistols, although mine are 1860's.
Well What I do works for me
Jim
Jim
STGThndr
Bearcat
Vern thanks for the heads up. Must "pass" at this time, as cash for guns right now is mighty thin.
Reading some of these responses, I'm wondering if part of the problem with gumming up may have been due to TOO much powder and grease. At the time I was under the impression that the front of the cylinder had to be greased to prevent chain-fire. With large enuf balls (.457) or conicals, this is not the case, apparently. I wonder if the same is true with the Uberti Remington copies?
Reading some of these responses, I'm wondering if part of the problem with gumming up may have been due to TOO much powder and grease. At the time I was under the impression that the front of the cylinder had to be greased to prevent chain-fire. With large enuf balls (.457) or conicals, this is not the case, apparently. I wonder if the same is true with the Uberti Remington copies?
Driftwood Johnson
Blackhawk
Howdy
I shoot lots and lots of Black Powder in CAS. There is no such thing as too much grease. But there is such a thing as a grease which is not compatible with Black Powder. With the wrong kind of grease, you can get a hard fouling that is difficult to scrub out of the bore. But with a good BP compatible lube, like SPG, the more lube, the more it helps keep things rolling. There are also lots of home made concoctions. I used to use a 50/50 mix of Crisco and beeswax.
The 1858 Remington is particularly difficult to keep rolling with Black Powder. I have two of them. But it is not because of the character of lube, it is because the front of the cylinder is flat and there is no raised bushing to deflect powder fouling blasted out of the barrel/cylinder gap away from the cylinder pin. Fouling quickly builds up on the pin and causes binding. I have shot all kinds of BP guns, and the 1858 Remmie is the worst to keep rolling, because of the lack of a cylinder bushing.
As far as preventing a chain fire, lube really is not very effective for that. Back around 1968 when I bought my first C&B revolver the standard advice to avoid chain fires was to slather Crisco over the balls. What really happened was the Crisco in the chamber next to the one that was being fired melted, from the hot blast out of the barrel/cylinder gap. A thin runny layer of melted lube is not a very good spark arrestor.
The best spark arrestor is felt wad between the ball and the powder. Yes, you should always use an oversized ball, and a nice ring of lead should always be shaved off. But if the ball is misshapen, or dented, and shaving the ring does not obliterate a void created between the surface of the ball and the chamber wall, you have a nice path for an errant spark to follow down to the ball. And yes, I have experienced a chain fire, it will really wake you up. But with a nice felt wad about 1/8" thick between powder and ball, even if a spark gets past the ball, it will not reach the powder.
I shoot lots and lots of Black Powder in CAS. There is no such thing as too much grease. But there is such a thing as a grease which is not compatible with Black Powder. With the wrong kind of grease, you can get a hard fouling that is difficult to scrub out of the bore. But with a good BP compatible lube, like SPG, the more lube, the more it helps keep things rolling. There are also lots of home made concoctions. I used to use a 50/50 mix of Crisco and beeswax.
The 1858 Remington is particularly difficult to keep rolling with Black Powder. I have two of them. But it is not because of the character of lube, it is because the front of the cylinder is flat and there is no raised bushing to deflect powder fouling blasted out of the barrel/cylinder gap away from the cylinder pin. Fouling quickly builds up on the pin and causes binding. I have shot all kinds of BP guns, and the 1858 Remmie is the worst to keep rolling, because of the lack of a cylinder bushing.
As far as preventing a chain fire, lube really is not very effective for that. Back around 1968 when I bought my first C&B revolver the standard advice to avoid chain fires was to slather Crisco over the balls. What really happened was the Crisco in the chamber next to the one that was being fired melted, from the hot blast out of the barrel/cylinder gap. A thin runny layer of melted lube is not a very good spark arrestor.
The best spark arrestor is felt wad between the ball and the powder. Yes, you should always use an oversized ball, and a nice ring of lead should always be shaved off. But if the ball is misshapen, or dented, and shaving the ring does not obliterate a void created between the surface of the ball and the chamber wall, you have a nice path for an errant spark to follow down to the ball. And yes, I have experienced a chain fire, it will really wake you up. But with a nice felt wad about 1/8" thick between powder and ball, even if a spark gets past the ball, it will not reach the powder.
I use both GOEX FFFg and Triple7 FFF granulations. Both work great but the Triple7 is sensitive to compression so more thought has to be put into the ball loading process. 30 to 35 grains by volume is a typical load for me with a lubricated felt wad and a 0.457 RB on top.
Bucks Owin
Hunter
What about SR4759? Wasn't that a smokeless alternative for FFG in BP cartridges "back in the day"? (Altho seems I heard somewhere that the original 4759 had a different burn rate than now?)
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