years ago Ruger would reblue guns, Does anyone know if during a reblue the cylinder end remained in the white. I am asking because I have a Super Blackhawk serial number 299 Long frame HIGH GLOSS. Chad thinks that is too early for high gloss. He had me pull the cylinder and the end is NOT blued Dad bought this from Bedlan's in 1981...thoughts???
Ruger factory reblue question or ANY reblue question
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the end is usually 'white" at the end because it is 'fitted' to the gun,,,any gun I ever did or know of any other GOOD shop who did rebluing always polished off the end stub to look like it is original, that is a "restoration" and not just a "reblue", if it LOOKS like it was 're-blued', it probably was,,,,,,,when we got done ,it did NOT.......
the real 'trick' is to reblue ( after you polish the cylinder frame AND the grip frame screwed together) as they were in the beginning, blued as a "unit" and thus the bluing salts could NOT get in between and properly 'blue' the bottom ,flat surfaces of these two parts.....no, have NEVER taken a high polish version apart to look ,see for ourself,,,as that nice high polish and them pretty screws, it would be an accident waiting to happen........
the real 'trick' is to reblue ( after you polish the cylinder frame AND the grip frame screwed together) as they were in the beginning, blued as a "unit" and thus the bluing salts could NOT get in between and properly 'blue' the bottom ,flat surfaces of these two parts.....no, have NEVER taken a high polish version apart to look ,see for ourself,,,as that nice high polish and them pretty screws, it would be an accident waiting to happen........
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.....same thing, when the gun was built, (fitted) this area can be in the white (stone or filed or even wear from being "used") it will wear and be a bit "in the white"...so again, in a proper 'restoration" these areas Are addressed, and made to be "as original" and if its all dark and blued and looks like it was never used or turned it may have been freshly reblued,,,then you gotta get into colors, todays bluing is NOT the same of years and days gone by, little or NO nitre in the formula, more 'black,' than blue..........
finshes of the old days have been regulated out by the EPA, yes they still do it in the old country or south america,,,NO EPA regs to abide by........
finshes of the old days have been regulated out by the EPA, yes they still do it in the old country or south america,,,NO EPA regs to abide by........
Here is a link to the gun on Gunbroker. Plenty of pics
BTW dad has had this in this condition since 1981 when he bought it from Bedlan's
BTW dad has had this in this condition since 1981 when he bought it from Bedlan's
1959 Ruger Super Blackhawk SN 299 LONG frame High Gloss with Mahogany Case - Revolvers at GunBroker.com : 1039310600
Buy 1959 Ruger Super Blackhawk SN 299 LONG frame High Gloss with Mahogany Case : GunBroker is the largest seller of Revolvers Pistols Guns & Firearms All: 1039310600
www.gunbroker.com
Air-cooled
Single-Sixer
Looks reblued to me. Good luck getting what you are advertising it at.
what looks reblued. That is a high gloss know to have been done on some of these. All the lettering looks very crisp and unmolested to me
It is nearly impossible to determine definitively if this revolver has been reblued with the hi-polish finish from the photos. The RCA certificate doesn't state that the gun was a special edition or left the factory with a special finish and in a presentation case. It lacks the provenance to show that it was produced by the factory. Without such provenance, my guess is that someone may have created this to mimic the S&W N frame offerings of that era. Perhaps Bedlin's acquired it from an estate and sold it to your dad in 1981. However, it is a beautiful and well presented piece that should bring a respectable price.
TINCANBANDIT is back
Single-Sixer
Two things, there is no way to prevent a section of a steel part from being blued in the tank except if there is a screw or washer against the metal.
Second, an easy way to tell if a gun has a factory finish or a is a reblue is by looking at the roll marks, roll marks are usually put on right before bluing, the reason is simple, the process of installing the roll marks, pushes up some of the metal around the outside of the roll marks, like the rim of a crater, this rim must be removed or you get a shadow effect, see picture below. If the rim is removed the lettering looks shallow. The other option is to not sand anywhere near the roll marks, it works if you can get the same level of polish on all parts.
On some guns you have to be really careful in the sanding/polishing process not to remove too much metal around the roll marks as they are shallow to start with. Old Colt revolvers are a good example.
On the gun in question, it appears the "rim" around the roll marks have been removed, which means it is probably a reblue and a very good one at that. Those old Rugers often turn plum if the right mixture of bluing salts is not used (Ruger had to perfect this).
Second, an easy way to tell if a gun has a factory finish or a is a reblue is by looking at the roll marks, roll marks are usually put on right before bluing, the reason is simple, the process of installing the roll marks, pushes up some of the metal around the outside of the roll marks, like the rim of a crater, this rim must be removed or you get a shadow effect, see picture below. If the rim is removed the lettering looks shallow. The other option is to not sand anywhere near the roll marks, it works if you can get the same level of polish on all parts.
On some guns you have to be really careful in the sanding/polishing process not to remove too much metal around the roll marks as they are shallow to start with. Old Colt revolvers are a good example.
On the gun in question, it appears the "rim" around the roll marks have been removed, which means it is probably a reblue and a very good one at that. Those old Rugers often turn plum if the right mixture of bluing salts is not used (Ruger had to perfect this).
If you're looking for a high gloss reblue I wouldn't send it back to Ruger. They just did a MkII target pistol for me and the upper is now a matte blue while the lower is gloss blue. It's fine for my purposes and looks better than when I sent it in but their blueing process must have changed between 1986 and now.
GypsmJim
Single-Sixer
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Excellent job, but the screw holes look dished. I vote re-blue.
not dished ..clearly
T.A. WORKMAN
Hunter
As it was explained to me the guns are blued then reassembled and the last step is then installing the firing pin bushing & pin in the white.
Guns sent back to Ruger for re-bluing never had the firing pin bushing removed unless it was faulty, therefore the old bushing was re-blued with the rest of the gun.
Terry
I think you will find they polish the outside of the recoil shield AFTER the pin is in place, do not recall ever seeing a pin ,in the white, nor any sign of being hammered in place "after the fact" unless it has been replaced, reinstalled "after the fact",,,,all too good of a job to have to rely on ANYONE pounding in a pin, on a slant ( angle) and NOT doing any damage or show any signs of being hammered into place.........
the face of the recoil shield is what is often "fitted" by filing; if ANY "protrusion" off the face, when the cylinder, with cartridges in it, has to "clear", and be able to cycle the action, sometimes a firing pin bushing may extend ( be proud/stick out) thus needs to be "polished/filed "down, flush....besides the pin /spring/bushing maybe flushed out to remove any salts, prevent bleeding......also a good maintainance point to keep in mind over time and over oiling to flush out the firing pin bushing hole, work the pin in and out at the same time, keep the pin from cruding up or staying stuck in the "out " position.....also lets you know if the pin spring ever failed ( broke).
all this info for "free"............ ( now look closely at YOUR guns)
the face of the recoil shield is what is often "fitted" by filing; if ANY "protrusion" off the face, when the cylinder, with cartridges in it, has to "clear", and be able to cycle the action, sometimes a firing pin bushing may extend ( be proud/stick out) thus needs to be "polished/filed "down, flush....besides the pin /spring/bushing maybe flushed out to remove any salts, prevent bleeding......also a good maintainance point to keep in mind over time and over oiling to flush out the firing pin bushing hole, work the pin in and out at the same time, keep the pin from cruding up or staying stuck in the "out " position.....also lets you know if the pin spring ever failed ( broke).
all this info for "free"............
( now look closely at YOUR guns)I believe what rugerguy is saying is what I was given to understand about "fitting" AFTER the blueing is complete "the face of the recoil shield is what is often "fitted" by filing". This is what I've been told, so take it FWIW.
RE-BLUEING would NOT require this fitting because it was already done when the gun was originally manufactured; consequently, the recoil shield would not show any "white" after a RE-blue; it would be all blued and thus indicate a re-blue job has been done. The pic below is a little dark, but it does show the original fitting "filing" white around the firing pin bushing (and could also shop up anywhere on the recoil shield depending on the individual casting); this is what an original gun that has not been reblued would like like.
J.
RE-BLUEING would NOT require this fitting because it was already done when the gun was originally manufactured; consequently, the recoil shield would not show any "white" after a RE-blue; it would be all blued and thus indicate a re-blue job has been done. The pic below is a little dark, but it does show the original fitting "filing" white around the firing pin bushing (and could also shop up anywhere on the recoil shield depending on the individual casting); this is what an original gun that has not been reblued would like like.
J.
T.A. WORKMAN
Hunter
Dan,
I am talking about the firing pin and firing pin bushing NOT the pin that goes through the recoil shield !! I don't know where you got that idea.??
As to the fitting of the cylinder to the gun I fully understand you, but the fitting is done before the gun is blued, not afterward. So if the bushing were installed before bluing
they would be blue not white as all new guns are.
Now show me a picture of a N.I.B. gun from the factory with a blued bushing. As to the bushing's installation my understanding is it is pressed in not hammered in
place. My opinion is worth exactly what it cost you...nothing !
Maybe Chad will chime in.
Terry
I am talking about the firing pin and firing pin bushing NOT the pin that goes through the recoil shield !! I don't know where you got that idea.??
As to the fitting of the cylinder to the gun I fully understand you, but the fitting is done before the gun is blued, not afterward. So if the bushing were installed before bluing
they would be blue not white as all new guns are.
Now show me a picture of a N.I.B. gun from the factory with a blued bushing. As to the bushing's installation my understanding is it is pressed in not hammered in
place. My opinion is worth exactly what it cost you...nothing !
Maybe Chad will chime in.
Terry
I got that "idea" from your first sentence of your first post......its is NOT installed after the gun is blued......
the 'cross pin that goes across the rear of the frame is what holds the busing in place, not the firing pin ,that goes in when the bushing is inserted, tapped or presssed into place, then the cross pin , the gun is polished and blued, blended in to the area above and below it in the rear sculpted area of the cylinder frame...... You stated that the ends of the cross pin were "in the white"???cannot be, and if the bushing sticks out or drags or rubs against anything to do with the cylinder, it gets polished, if its replaced it will be "in the white, same goes for the area off to either side of the recoil shield, may get filed, fitted....if all is smooth, and NO fitting required, this surface will be ALL blued, smooth, across the recoil shield...you can see the file marks in the picture above, we';ve seen a lot of them with NO marks or filing or fitting, all was OK when the gun was built took them a few years to get things down pat.........
and your statement as to the cylinder, above .same thing the ends are fitted ,filed to the gun AFTER it is blued, if it "drops in", no fitting, needed the ends could be blued., dark and only show some 'wear' from turning...........front AND rear of the cylinder.
it does not have to have been 'NIB' to have a "blued" firing pin bushing as this picture shows a OM ,used and the bushing is still blued......
the 'cross pin that goes across the rear of the frame is what holds the busing in place, not the firing pin ,that goes in when the bushing is inserted, tapped or presssed into place, then the cross pin , the gun is polished and blued, blended in to the area above and below it in the rear sculpted area of the cylinder frame...... You stated that the ends of the cross pin were "in the white"???cannot be, and if the bushing sticks out or drags or rubs against anything to do with the cylinder, it gets polished, if its replaced it will be "in the white, same goes for the area off to either side of the recoil shield, may get filed, fitted....if all is smooth, and NO fitting required, this surface will be ALL blued, smooth, across the recoil shield...you can see the file marks in the picture above, we';ve seen a lot of them with NO marks or filing or fitting, all was OK when the gun was built took them a few years to get things down pat.........
and your statement as to the cylinder, above .same thing the ends are fitted ,filed to the gun AFTER it is blued, if it "drops in", no fitting, needed the ends could be blued., dark and only show some 'wear' from turning...........front AND rear of the cylinder.
it does not have to have been 'NIB' to have a "blued" firing pin bushing as this picture shows a OM ,used and the bushing is still blued......
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