Woods, Trail, and Field

Varminterror said:

Easy math here - A 158grn pill pushed to 1500fps is going the same speed at 150yrds than a standard 158grn load at 1250fps has at the muzzle. Why would that bullet not kill a deer? You said it yourself, a 357mag is a 50-75yrd revolver - why would the same bullet at the same speed not kill deer? It just happens to be at 150yrds instead of 50-75yrds.

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Yes, easy math. Actually, your 158gr load would be running 1000fps at 150yds with 8" of drop with a 100yd zero. At 200yds, make that 23" of drop. Now tell me again how the .357 is a good 200yd deer cartridge? As my dad would say, that's stretching a little thing a long way.

CraigC said:

Varminterror said:

Easy math here - A 158grn pill pushed to 1500fps is going the same speed at 150yrds than a standard 158grn load at 1250fps has at the muzzle. Why would that bullet not kill a deer? You said it yourself, a 357mag is a 50-75yrd revolver - why would the same bullet at the same speed not kill deer? It just happens to be at 150yrds instead of 50-75yrds.

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Yes, easy math. Actually, your 158gr load would be running 1000fps at 150yds with 8" of drop with a 100yd zero. At 200yds, make that 23" of drop. Now tell me again how the .357 is a good 200yd deer cartridge? As my dad would say, that's stretching a little thing a long way.

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by the way....if ya look alittle closer....i make alot more than just franken-rugers....or hand rifles...or whatever you want to call them.

you can take drop out of your figures....maters little if you can compensate for it....with the equipment that we have available today...dialing drop just takes some practice.

plenty of energy left....seen many a deer dropped with a 38 special going about 8-900 fps at the point of impact...deer and the like are actually quite easy to kill...just have to place the shot...

so where does the distance argument start and stop...is the guy wrong who shoots 200 yards with a 45-70....or a mile with a 338....or 200 yards with a wheel gun..this argument has no place here...you just like to flap your gums....dont bother replying....since i could care less what you think.

Im done with replying to you. There is no point...you dont doubt the results so then there ya go...whats the point in arguing.

Go ahead and jump on that high horse you got there and ride into the sunset.

Wow, thread gone ugly. But lets back up a bit. Thread starts out as pretty much an advertisement. I've read all of bcgunworks posts with interest myself. Not sure how the folks running this place feel about that. It's questioned by someone thats been here for Thirteen yrs.. Then...well, as I said, it went ugly.

stevemb said:

Wow, thread gone ugly. But lets back up a bit. Thread starts out as pretty much an advertisement. I've read all of bcgunworks posts with interest myself. Not sure how the folks running this place feel about that. It's questioned by someone thats been here for Thirteen yrs.. Then...well, as I said, it went ugly.

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It's constant negative comments from the one....kinda funny when others I don't know called the one out....

And now he is so bold as to do it on other forums

I only know of what I've seen here. BC, you r machinist skills are amazing, after that, I'm quite put off. I'm practicing my decorum, was told I lack it.

stevemb said:

I only know of what I've seen here. BC, you r machinist skills are amazing, after that, I'm quite put off. I'm practicing my decorum, was told I lack it.

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Ok...your honesty is noted

I see Chris's work all the time. And on just about any firearm there is. He don't accept anything less then perfect. He puts out more work in a short time then any gunsmith I know. Not really sure why the guy from Tenn. always has to comment. I don't think anybody really give a rats ass what he has to say to begin with. Like I said before...He has issues :roll: Keep up the great work Chris :wink:

"Constant negative comments"???

I asked you about lineboring, you said it wasn't necessary. That your "shooting system" was the most accurate available. I asked you to go into detail about how your setup was better than all the rest and you danced around it. Then came the insults.

I asked you about blocking the action and fitting an oversized bolt. You danced around it with crap about "doing what is needed". I asked you what that meant, more tap dancing, then insults.

I asked you to explain the concept and testing behind the floating shroud, more tap dancing, then insults.

I began asking valid questions and not only did you never answer them, you got defensive and responded with inflammatory personal crap. If I call any of the gunsmiths I mentioned in our first exchange and ask them about what they do and why, I would get a straightforward explanation. I stood in Jim Stroh's shop and got a detailed explanation of Taylor throating, how it works and when it's necessary. I ask you about your work and you get defensive.

Since you've shared your opinion of me (how's that relevant?), here's my personal opinion of you. I think you didn't answer those questions because you can't. I think you have limited skills and are trying desperately to find your niche. I think your lack of knowledge and experience leads you to believe that you are better than you are. I don't think you understand what it means to say that yours is "the most accurate shooting system anywhere". I held my tongue until you made that statement. Your work doesn't hold a candle to that of the aforementioned `smith's and you're too arrogant/ignorant to realize it. I don't think you understand what it means to claim that the .357Mag is a 200yd deer cartridge. Ever heard of the Dunning-Kruger effect? That's you, on the left.

CraigC said:

Varminterror said:

Easy math here - A 158grn pill pushed to 1500fps is going the same speed at 150yrds than a standard 158grn load at 1250fps has at the muzzle. Why would that bullet not kill a deer? You said it yourself, a 357mag is a 50-75yrd revolver - why would the same bullet at the same speed not kill deer? It just happens to be at 150yrds instead of 50-75yrds.

Click to expand...

Yes, easy math. Actually, your 158gr load would be running 1000fps at 150yds with 8" of drop with a 100yd zero. At 200yds, make that 23" of drop. Now tell me again how the .357 is a good 200yd deer cartridge? As my dad would say, that's stretching a little thing a long way.

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I'm not following this logic - 23" of drop (11.5MOA) at 200yrds doesn't have anything to do with the load's ability to kill deer. I've killed lots of game at ranges where shots were over 10MOA. The bullet still has the punch left on it to kill, what does the drop matter?

Again - I don't know Chris any more than encountering him on forums like this, nor do I know Ernie (although he's helped me out on the phone a few times regarding Specialty Pistols, very gracious guy), and the FR is largely irrelevant in my life. BUT... I've been killing game past 100yrds with revolvers for a long time, and I'm currently working on my own project to produce a 250yrd deer killing revolver that throws 357cal bullets.

So I don't really care whether the FR's are legit or not - although I trust Ernie enough to believe that they are - but it just doesn't make sense when someone's so closed-minded about the lethality of 357grn pills at extended ranges.

stevemb said:

I only know of what I've seen here. BC, you r machinist skills are amazing, after that, I'm quite put off. I'm practicing my decorum, was told I lack it.

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I agree. Been following the feud since the beginning. BC, wants people to think he knows it all, when somebody asks legitimate questions, instead of answers, he resorts to insults.

From the start his posts have been sales pitches, I ain't buying.

I also have been following all of these posts. And BC wasn't just asked legitimate questions, he was told that he is no Bowen, Hamilton, etc. Because he doesn't have the well known name he couldn't know anything. I have never seen where he has posted that he know's it all, only that he has some specialty guns that he has shown here.

I sent a Super Redhawk to him for some work and couldn't be happier. He got it done before promised and was cheaper than quoted. I bench rested this gun before and after and it definitely shoots better now.

Prior to his posting on this forum I had never heard of him or his work. Some of his stuff is definitely not traditional but has not been claimed as such. I really like his Franken-Ruger but don't see myself owning one. I for one like his posts as well as those from others using his products.

I am impressed with the Franken-Ruger concept.
I have now shot three different 357 magnum FR's (8", 10" and my 15").
My 15" barrel will be shortened at some point.
At least, that is my current plan... :mrgreen:

Next FR will be in a bore larger than 357 magnum, with a 8" or 8 3/8" barrel.
Haven't decided on scope yet.
This has been a fun ride with group sizes that just seem wrong for a revolver.
Couple of years ago I never dreamed I would be shooting wheel guns like this, especially with a Ruger

bcgunworks said:

CraigC said:

And you've never explained how this "floating barrel" concept works on a revolver. You just got defensive and snippy.

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Nope...I told you...but you told me it was not true and bs....guess it's not bs since we're shooting sub Moa groups all the way to 500 yards...do that consistently with your SRH.

To help you out craigc the expert on the world:

By eliminating all the stress on the barrel and removing the ejector rods, sights, under lug, and so on we have a more harmonically sound platform.

The optimal outer dia for barrel for each caliber was found.

The shroud gives you a stable place to rest the gun that does not change point of impact.

The proof this works is out there. And it's mounting up....not much point in arguing it anymore.

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I would love to hear more about the harmonics in a revolver, and how ejector rods, front sights, and an underlug affect the platform?

To the OP, nice guns! Sorry to see a potentially fun thread reduced to name calling and choochery...

My Ruger option for woods carry (since I don't live in Alaska anymore) doesn't need to be able to agitate big bears. It is there as a lightweight comfort when hiking or as a backup when hunting with a long gun.

That option for me is the Ruger LCRx 3"... Light to carry, easy to shoot, and effective for any needs I might have.

Edmo

Thank you Edmo.

Those little streamlight penlights are amazing aren't they.
For kicks you could frankenruger it and have yourself a maglight.
They both put out nice light for what they are.