USS Pueblo ?

[Kevin]

In reading all the news lately about North Korea I have come across references to the USS Pueblo. It was a US Navy ship captured by the North Koreans in 1968 (before my time.) It's now a museum in North Korea.

I guess I'm posting this because I've never heard about it, which seems kind of strange. Is it not talked about much? It is still a commissioned vessel, according to the internet. The only one still commissioned while being held captive by a foreign government.

Is there much information on this besides cliff notes from Wikipedia? Was it talked about a lot in 1968 when it happened or did it get quietly covered up because it is a supposed spy ship?

At first I thought Hollywood hasn't made a movie about it because it wasn't a military win for the US, but then neither was Pearl Harbor and there have been a few movies about it.

 

[GunnyGene]

This is probably the most comprehensive info you'll find on the Net. It should answer your questions. The homepage of the Pueblo:

http://www.usspueblo.org/

I was 24 and a buck Sergeant at the time. It was not covered up. In fact we very nearly went to war over it, and probably would have if we'd had a different President and not been up to our eyeballs in Vietnam.

 

[Kevin]

Thanks for the link! I tried to read it but I'm on my phone right now and it's pretty tiny print. I'm going to have to turn on the computer. I don't know why but things like this are interesting to me.

 

[ph_redhawk]

As my ancient mind recalls there is a movie with Steve McQueen. Or am I thinking of something else?

 

[GunnyGene]

As my ancient mind recalls there is a movie with Steve McQueen. Or am I thinking of something else?

There was. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9js945_x7w .

Also quite few documentaries/ news clips, etc. on YouTube about it.

 

[DeletedMember275]

Commander Lloyd Bucher and crew. Bucher sent Morse code messages by blinking 't-o-r-t-u-r-e' during their televised propaganda 'confessions.' I was 13, and wondered why we didn't attack North Korea.

 

[Bkat]

As my ancient mind recalls there is a movie with Steve McQueen. Or am I thinking of something else?

There was. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9js945_x7w .

Also quite few documentaries/ news clips, etc. on YouTube about it.

You may be thinking of The Sand Pebbles which McQueen starred in. I don't think he was in the TV movie
that Gunny mentions. The Sand Pebbles is a great movie, about a U.S. gunboat patrolling the Yangtze River in 1920s China and sent to rescue missionaries.

 

[Colonialgirl]

The DUMB ASS Captain surrendered his ship without even attempting to scuttle it; In doing so he compromised EVERY Confidential Code in Korea. The bastard should have been Court martialed.
How do I know all this?
US ARMY 1966-1969
Osan AFB, Korea 1967-1968
Hq, Hq Btry, 38th Arty Bde (AD)
Commo Section.

 

[Wyandot Jim]

Dang CG, There for a moment I thought you were on the ship and knew what took place and the conditions :wink:

 

[Colonialgirl]

Dang CG, There for a moment I thought you were on the ship and knew what took place and the conditions :wink:

Well; Keep in mind that I had friends in the Brigade Communications section and the Air Control center;
Besides,
I grew up US NAVY from Birth in the Portsmouth, VA Naval Hospital, early reading was the Blue Jackets manual; Saw US NAVY WW2 Combat Films UNEDITED when at the Saturday movies for dependents on the various bases and since that time have done a load of reading of Naval History.
I have NOT YET begun to Fight
Damn the torpedoes, FULL SPEED Ahead
You cant save me, Take her down.
And I lived on Ford Island not far from where the USS Arizona was resting on the bottom of Pearl Harbor in 1947-1948; Walked the beaches of Morocco where our troops landed.

 

[ph_redhawk]

As my ancient mind recalls there is a movie with Steve McQueen. Or am I thinking of something else?

There was. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9js945_x7w .

Also quite few documentaries/ news clips, etc. on YouTube about it.

You may be thinking of The Sand Pebbles which McQueen starred in. I don't think he was in the TV movie
that Gunny mentions. The Sand Pebbles is a great movie, about a U.S. gunboat patrolling the Yangtze River in 1920s China and sent to rescue missionaries.

Of course you are correct. I had the two movies tangled in my withered mind.

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[7p's]

CG is spot-on. The KW-7's went immediately to Russia. Within a couple days all traffic from China, Russia and North Korea went silent for a couple of weeks. When they came back up - our listening posts had to start from the ground up and that took some doing and advanced our adversaries capability a whole lot. He should have been shot on the spot, but in today's world, he's a hero for saving his crew. Several air crewmen died performing like missions without mention and they were hero's, unlike Bucher et al.

 

[graygun]

I haven't read the link yet. I recall a former friend (dead now) who was in the Navy from 59-79 as an aircraft mechanic...mainly recip. He said the captain tried to drown himself onboard but that it's supposedly not possible to accomplish. Is he still with us?

Yes,in 68 you heard much about it.

 

[Dan in MI]

Monday morning QB question.

Per the website above

(A) DETERMINE KORCOM AND SOVIET REACTION RESPECTIVELY TO AN OVERT INTELLIGENCE COLLECTOR OPERATING NEAR KORCOM PERIPHERY AND ACTIVELY CONDUCTING SURVEILLANCE OF USSR NAVAL UNITS.


So, if the plan was to see the reactions, why wasn't the ship prepared for possible boarding or even equipped with old equipment in case the test failed? (as it did)

 

[Jeepnik]

Sadly, the Navy did do less for the ship and her crew than they did a few years later for the SS Mayaguez. But it was a different president.

 

[SR1911SHOOTER]

As my ancient mind recalls there is a movie with Steve McQueen. Or am I thinking of something else?

redhawk,
Close, the movie you are thinking about was the "Sand Pebbles". A fictional US Navy
ship, the USS San Pablo.
Blackie

 

[SR1911SHOOTER]

In reading all the news lately about North Korea I have come across references to the USS Pueblo. It was a US Navy ship captured by the North Koreans in 1968 (before my time.) It's now a museum in North Korea.

I guess I'm posting this because I've never heard about it, which seems kind of strange. Is it not talked about much? It is still a commissioned vessel, according to the internet. The only one still commissioned while being held captive by a foreign government.

Is there much information on this besides cliff notes from Wikipedia? Was it talked about a lot in 1968 when it happened or did it get quietly covered up because it is a supposed spy ship?

At first I thought Hollywood hasn't made a movie about it because it wasn't a military win for the US, but then neither was Pearl Harbor and there have been a few movies about it.

Kevin,
I was in the US Navy then, and stationed at CINCLANTFLEET HQ, as an RM1. Yes we
durn near went to war over it, and would have if LBJ were not POTUS at the time, I believe.
Blackie

 

[Ugly Hombre]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Pueblo_(AGER-2)

Here is the weki page on it.

"The ammunition on Pueblo was stored belowdecks, and her machine guns were wrapped in cold weather tarpaulins. The machine guns were unmanned, and no attempt was made to man them. An NSA report quotes the sailing order:
(...) Defensive armament (machine guns) should be stowed or covered in such manner so that it does not cause unusual interest by surveyed units. It should be used only in the event of a threat to survival (...)
and notes
In practice, it was discovered that, because of the temperamental adjustments of the firing mechanisms, the .50-caliber machine guns took at least ten minutes to activate. Only one crew member, with former army experience, had ever had any experience with such weapon"

No good...

"Close, the movie you are thinking about was the "Sand Pebbles". A fictional US Navy
ship, the USS San Pablo.
Blackie"

Its a great film!

"At first I thought Hollywood hasn't made a movie about it because it wasn't a military win for the US, but then neither was Pearl Harbor and there have been a few movies about it."

You will never see the American Media put out a movie showing murderous Communist %^&#'s!! in action.

Because the American media is infested with Communist nitwit #%^&*(!!

 

[Bob Wright]

As my ancient mind recalls there is a movie with Steve McQueen. Or am I thinking of something else?

You're thinking about the USS Panay, that incident in 1936.

Bob Wright

 

[Wyandot Jim]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Pueblo_(AGER-2)

Here is the weki page on it.

"The ammunition on Pueblo was stored belowdecks, and her machine guns were wrapped in cold weather tarpaulins. The machine guns were unmanned, and no attempt was made to man them. An NSA report quotes the sailing order:
(...) Defensive armament (machine guns) should be stowed or covered in such manner so that it does not cause unusual interest by surveyed units. It should be used only in the event of a threat to survival (...)
and notes
In practice, it was discovered that, because of the temperamental adjustments of the firing mechanisms, the .50-caliber machine guns took at least ten minutes to activate. Only one crew member, with former army experience, had ever had any experience with such weapon"

No good...

"Close, the movie you are thinking about was the "Sand Pebbles". A fictional US Navy
ship, the USS San Pablo.
Blackie"

Its a great film!

"At first I thought Hollywood hasn't made a movie about it because it wasn't a military win for the US, but then neither was Pearl Harbor and there have been a few movies about it."

You will never see the American Media put out a movie showing murderous Communist %^&#'s!! in action.

Because the American media is infested with Communist nitwit #%^&*(!!

SOOOOOOO What good would they have done against High Caliber Cannon Fire from the Frigates/Sub Chasers??? The 50 mounts didn't even have protective shields on them.

ALL OF YOU need to read the real action that took place in the link posted.
Then as a Monday Morning Quarter Back YOU can comment

 

[Thumbcocker]

There was a made for TV docudrama about the Pueblo. IIRC Hal Holbrook played the captain. Supposedly when a propaganda picture was taken of the crew they managed to all sneak in the one finger salute.

 

[Colonialgirl]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Pueblo_(AGER-2)

Here is the weki page on it.

"The ammunition on Pueblo was stored belowdecks, and her machine guns were wrapped in cold weather tarpaulins. The machine guns were unmanned, and no attempt was made to man them. An NSA report quotes the sailing order:
(...) Defensive armament (machine guns) should be stowed or covered in such manner so that it does not cause unusual interest by surveyed units. It should be used only in the event of a threat to survival (...)
and notes
In practice, it was discovered that, because of the temperamental adjustments of the firing mechanisms, the .50-caliber machine guns took at least ten minutes to activate. Only one crew member, with former army experience, had ever had any experience with such weapon"

No good...

"Close, the movie you are thinking about was the "Sand Pebbles". A fictional US Navy
ship, the USS San Pablo.
Blackie"

Its a great film!

"At first I thought Hollywood hasn't made a movie about it because it wasn't a military win for the US, but then neither was Pearl Harbor and there have been a few movies about it."

You will never see the American Media put out a movie showing murderous Communist %^&#'s!! in action.

Because the American media is infested with Communist nitwit #%^&*(!!

SOOOOOOO What good would they have done against High Caliber Cannon Fire from the Frigates/Sub Chasers??? The 50 mounts didn't even have protective shields on them.

ALL OF YOU need to read the real action that took place in the link posted.
Then as a Monday Morning Quarter Back YOU can comment

The Air Force COULD have had F-4's there in the blink of an eye; They "claimed" that their armament was "not properly configured"; In my opinion, it wouldn't have mattered, a couple of F-4's buzzing the NK patrol boats would have scared them away. I KNOW of one instance where a couple of the F-4's took off from an airfield (Inchon? or one of the other smaller fields); suddenly POPPED up into radar view like they were from the NK and Sped south and were almost to the Southern tip of Korea before anybody could get scrambled to intercept them.

 

[Colonialgirl]

There was a made for TV docudrama about the Pueblo. IIRC Hal Holbrook played the captain. Supposedly when a propaganda picture was taken of the crew they managed to all sneak in the one finger salute.

Oh wow !!

 

[Wyandot Jim]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Pueblo_(AGER-2)

Here is the weki page on it.

"The ammunition on Pueblo was stored belowdecks, and her machine guns were wrapped in cold weather tarpaulins. The machine guns were unmanned, and no attempt was made to man them. An NSA report quotes the sailing order:
(...) Defensive armament (machine guns) should be stowed or covered in such manner so that it does not cause unusual interest by surveyed units. It should be used only in the event of a threat to survival (...)
and notes
In practice, it was discovered that, because of the temperamental adjustments of the firing mechanisms, the .50-caliber machine guns took at least ten minutes to activate. Only one crew member, with former army experience, had ever had any experience with such weapon"

No good...

"Close, the movie you are thinking about was the "Sand Pebbles". A fictional US Navy
ship, the USS San Pablo.
Blackie"

Its a great film!

"At first I thought Hollywood hasn't made a movie about it because it wasn't a military win for the US, but then neither was Pearl Harbor and there have been a few movies about it."

You will never see the American Media put out a movie showing murderous Communist %^&#'s!! in action.

Because the American media is infested with Communist nitwit #%^&*(!!

SOOOOOOO What good would they have done against High Caliber Cannon Fire from the Frigates/Sub Chasers??? The 50 mounts didn't even have protective shields on them.

ALL OF YOU need to read the real action that took place in the link posted.
Then as a Monday Morning Quarter Back YOU can comment

The Air Force COULD have had F-4's there in the blink of an eye; They "claimed" that their armament was "not properly configured"; In my opinion, it wouldn't have mattered, a couple of F-4's buzzing the NK patrol boats would have scared them away. I KNOW of one instance where a couple of the F-4's took off from an airfield (Inchon? or one of the other smaller fields); suddenly POPPED up into radar view like they were from the NK and Sped south and were almost to the Southern tip of Korea before anybody could get scrambled to intercept them.

There were Two MIG 21s in the area that might have given the F-4s a run for their money. Remember NK was engaged and firing on us. Would the F-4s have fired back??? Who knows. :wink:

 

[wunbe]

IMO the USSR helped the Norks set the whole thing up and shared in the take of intelligence gained from the equipment and docs and debriefs of prisoners captured on the Pueblo.

wunbe

 

[Ugly Hombre]

http://www.jackcheevers.net/

A recent book on the incident "Act of War"

http://www.allenhemphill.com/first_week.htm

A blog by a serving naval officer in 1968 Allen Hemphill who helped the Pueblo Commanders wife- real time. Lots of interesting information in his blog.

IMO the capture of the Pueblo was a massive mistake a failure by high command, no effective plans were in place to come to her aid. The crew was denied requests for better shredding/destruction equipment resulting in a massive intel coup for the Communists- the serious nature of which has only recently come to public light.

There had been previous incidents that indicated the Norks may have been intending to attack and capture a intel collecting ship such as the Pueblo.

The crew did a good job with what they had- and held up well under the savage Nork torture and mistreatment but still, the lack of prep for things going to hell by high command- including having no means to resist capture at all- and buy time to destroy classified information and equipment- not good IMO.

YMMV.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/nation/2014/01/01/pueblo-north-korea-act-of-war-cheevers/4277449/

Article on the book "Act Of War" and the recent release of classified documents on the incident.

"One key document I uncovered was a secret, 236-page history of the Pueblo affair, written by the National Security Agency in 1992, indicating that the ship's capture was one of the biggest intelligence debacles in U.S. history — 'everyone's worst nightmare,' as one NSA historian put it," Cheevers told USA TODAY.

A former reporter for the Los Angeles Times, Cheevers made several discoveries in Act of War, including:

•An internal White House report conducted while the Pueblo was still in captivity that determined the fault for the ship's loss was with high-ranking Navy leaders who sent the ship into dangerous waters without adequate preparation and equipment.

•How the loss of the Pueblo's intelligence was aggravated by a spy ring run by a Navy enlisted man, John Walker, who sold the Soviets classified intelligence information that allowed U.S. enemies to compare that with the data collected from the Pueblo. Walker, his son and other associates were not arrested until 1985. "Thanks to the traitorous radioman, the Russians knew the tactics American aircraft carriers would use in wartime and how to sabotage U.S. spy satellites," Cheevers said."

Not good. If it had came to a shooting war with the Communist block, the loss of the Pueblo would of cost us big time.

 

[Jimbo357mag]

Any wonder they surrendered? Perhaps it was the Navy that was responsible for sending the ship into hostile waters without an escort.

from wiki- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Pueblo_(AGER-2)

quote> According to the American account, the following day, 23 January, Pueblo was approached by a sub chaser and her nationality was challenged; Pueblo responded by raising the U.S. flag. The North Korean vessel then ordered it to stand down or be fired upon. Pueblo attempted to maneuver away, but was considerably slower than the sub chaser. Several warning shots were fired. Additionally, three torpedo boats appeared on the horizon and then joined in the chase and subsequent attack.[citation needed]

The attackers were soon joined by two MiG-21 fighters. A fourth torpedo boat and a second sub chaser appeared on the horizon a short time later. The ammunition on Pueblo was stored belowdecks, and her machine guns were wrapped in cold weather tarpaulins. The machine guns were unmanned, and no attempt was made to man them. An NSA report quotes the sailing order:
-------------------------------------------------
The North Korean vessels attempted to board Pueblo, but she was maneuvered to prevent this for over two hours. A sub chaser then opened fire with a 57 mm cannon, killing one member of the crew. The smaller vessels fired machine guns into Pueblo, which then signaled compliance and began destroying sensitive material. The volume of material on board was so great that it was impossible to destroy it all. An NSA report quotes Lieutenant Steve Harris, the officer in charge of Pueblo's Naval Security Group Command detachment:<end quote

 

[blackhawknj]

John Anthony Walker has sold the codes used by the Pueblo to the Soviets, they wanted the ship to get the hardware used.

 

[Jeepnik]

Since we've already strayed into the Yangtze river with Sand Pebbles I thought I'd show something the family recently found.

I've mentioned that my grandfather was a China sailor, Sand Pebbles was pretty close (read cleaned up) regarding those stout fellow. Here is what we found.

Considering the condition of a few other medals I'm thinking this meant more than the others.

 

[Ugly Hombre]

Very cool!-Thanks for posting that!

If you have not and are interested- the novel "The Sand Pebbles" was written by a China service gun boat sailor- it is damn good- better than the movie IMO. You may have read it already..