GunnyGene
Hawkeye
Anybody have one? If you do, it's recently become an NFA weapon, and the company is being required by ATF to recall all of them.
Here's the details (short excerpt):
Here's the details (short excerpt):
Origin SBV 'Shotgun' - Forced Recall
- Thread starter GunnyGene
- Start date
Wow, the comment section on that blog is pretty intense
azleite said:
. . . and fully expected. I seem to recall warnings from the original makers of the real "not a shotgun" models to NOT add a stock of any type to their guns. Like it or not, the current situation is the result of a firm playing games with the BATFEIEIO and losing.
At least those who bought one are being offered some recovery, which is more than was offered in the case of bumpstocks. Small consolation but better than nothing IMHO.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
powder smoke
Hawkeye
azleite said:
Don't blame them one bit. they bought them shotguns in good faith.
I'd be pissed off too, ps
Pat-inCO
Hawkeye
No they didn't.powder smoke said:
Anyone with a brain can see it is a short barrel shotgun.
They were trying to get around federal laws. :roll:
OP
GunnyGene
Hawkeye
Technicalities. The problem with technicalities is that the guy that writes/owns them gets to decide what meets them and what doesn't. It's easy to stub your toe on them.
That's where we are in the firearms world since 1934. Constantly stubbing our toes on technicalities. We are drowning in technicalities. :roll:
That's where we are in the firearms world since 1934. Constantly stubbing our toes on technicalities. We are drowning in technicalities. :roll:
bobski
Hunter
theres no reason any American needs a shotgun like that. shotguns of that design were designed for war or deception.
unless someone is planning to attack some warlord gang in a full scale assault with others, or rob a bank, for gods sake, why cant a plain ole pump shotgun that was made within the law be enough for the citizens?
answer: those that buy guns like that like to walk the fine line....just as the makers of those guns walk the fine line providing them. they got smacked.
good.
unless someone is planning to attack some warlord gang in a full scale assault with others, or rob a bank, for gods sake, why cant a plain ole pump shotgun that was made within the law be enough for the citizens?
answer: those that buy guns like that like to walk the fine line....just as the makers of those guns walk the fine line providing them. they got smacked.
good.
I won't say "good" because even though I recognize the fine line situation and find the result here to be easily anticipated, it does rub me the wrong way that the gummint can tell us what we can own and what they find unacceptable for our use . . . particularly when it's a fact that we can "buy our way into acceptability" on such items via the paying of exorbitant fees for the right to do so. Bottom line: it's all about the bux! So my overall view is that this result should not have come as a surprise, but its justification is bogus from the start.
OP
GunnyGene
Hawkeye
bobski said:
You're entitled to your opinion. However I don't share it, nor would my ancestors going back to 1632 on these shores, share it.
OP
GunnyGene
Hawkeye
Pat-inCO said:
Then so are the Mossberg Shockwave, and the new Henry .410. Except that the ATF says those models are not SBS's. But the States of CA & Mass. say they are. Curious how different people classify the same things differently. Wonder why that is? Obviously not because of differences in technical details. Must be some other reason. :roll:
GunnyGene said:
Yes, indeed . . . because GOVERNMENT!
:evil: :evil: :evil:
ProfessorWes
Hawkeye
As I said in the other thread, the SBR and SBS portions of the NFA '34 need to be ashcanned IMO. It's not the "Bill of Needs," it's the Bill of Rights.
Also, the people buying "legal, non-NFA firearms" like the Shockwave and suchlike aren't looking to break the laws. Note the "legal" part. That too was the selling point of the Origin SBV, until ATF made their ruling.
OTOH, eight decades and change of the NFA '34 have demonstrated conclusively that criminals wanting to rob banks or just slaughter folks don't care about things like barrel length restrictions or tax stamps.
I think guns like the Shockwave would be a lot more effective and easier to handle - and less concealable, for those who obsess about such things - with a proper shoulder stock. Unfortunately, putting a full stock on a Shockwave would instantly make it illegal and you a felon. Just another example of how retarded so many of our gun laws are.
Also, the people buying "legal, non-NFA firearms" like the Shockwave and suchlike aren't looking to break the laws. Note the "legal" part. That too was the selling point of the Origin SBV, until ATF made their ruling.
OTOH, eight decades and change of the NFA '34 have demonstrated conclusively that criminals wanting to rob banks or just slaughter folks don't care about things like barrel length restrictions or tax stamps.
I think guns like the Shockwave would be a lot more effective and easier to handle - and less concealable, for those who obsess about such things - with a proper shoulder stock. Unfortunately, putting a full stock on a Shockwave would instantly make it illegal and you a felon. Just another example of how retarded so many of our gun laws are.
ProfessorWes said:
Yeah . . . makes ya wonder how different this can be from the "arm braces" on the "AR15 Pistols" doesn't it?
:roll:
“theres no reason any American needs a shotgun like that.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWdd6_ZxX8c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWdd6_ZxX8c
Such firearms have a couple of good uses: personal defense foremost and fun as a spin off. I don't have one and don't expect to ever have one BUT I certainly see no reason that others should not have that option. I also don't own/use a trumpet but others do so good for them.
Most of the NFA regs stem from the inability to control the gangsters of the 1930's. The current crop of gangsters is so far beyond that era that using Federal firearms regs to prosecute them is an absurd stretch of logic. We now have state to state extradition and nation wide enforcement agreements.
4473 background checks for firearms purchases are a farce and quite often turn up incorrect results. BATFE background checks for NFA stamps has become a choke point deliberately(IMHO) slowing the legal ownership steps for NFA items.
Most of the NFA regs stem from the inability to control the gangsters of the 1930's. The current crop of gangsters is so far beyond that era that using Federal firearms regs to prosecute them is an absurd stretch of logic. We now have state to state extradition and nation wide enforcement agreements.
4473 background checks for firearms purchases are a farce and quite often turn up incorrect results. BATFE background checks for NFA stamps has become a choke point deliberately(IMHO) slowing the legal ownership steps for NFA items.
Rancher Will
Blackhawk
Where in our Constitution anywhere, especially in the Second Amendment, does it say "the right of the people to keep and bear arms, (except any arms that some government official decides is not to be permitted or any arms where government permission is required to keep and bear) shall not be infringed."?
