Genuine Ka-bar

[Robes]

My dad was very proud of being a US Marine. At 17 he enlisted for WW2 and was in on the invasion of the Marshall Islands and Saipan. I remember as a kid wearing his leggings for a Halloween costume. He had a trunk that had all of his uniforms and other stuff he brought back after the war. He still had his Ka-bar knife that my brother and I always cherished. When my dad died, my brother and I decided to use Ro-Sham-Bo to see who got the knife. I lost...

I'd like to buy my own and I found one that looks exactly like it, right down to the sheath. What I want to know from those who are more familiar,.... is this the real thing, or is it a knock off. I hate cheap knives.... http://www.grunt.com/kabars/usmc-american-legend-ka-bar

As a side note,...when I was a kid, my dad showed me how to make my "bunk" so that you could bounce a quarter on it. Being as I didn't have a flat spring (had a box spring and mattress) I would slide under the bed and pull the sheets real hard to get more tension. My mom chewed him a new one when I ripped the top sheet ,....for the second time :mrgreen: . To this day, I can still hear it go "Riiiiiiiiiiiiiip" :shock:

 

[GunnyGene]

The size and general design is the same, although the blade thickness may not be as thick as the original. The USMC 1219C2 had a slightly thicker blade than the Navy version. Also the steel used in modern reproductions is 1095 chrome-vanadium alloy (better corrosion protection). The originals were a higher carbon content low chrome alloy, which held an edge well, but were somewhat susceptible to corrosion.

This all means that if you compared them side by side, the older knife would likely be a little heavier and different balance than the reproduction knife. Not saying one is inherently better than the other, just different.

Edit: USMC original blade & tang was 3/8" thick. Reproductions and newer models are 1/4" thick.

 

[Rick Courtright]

Hi,

As Gunny notes, there are some subtle differences between the original and today's version, but how important they are probably depends on whether you're "barstool racing" or want a working knife. Once in a while one can find what are advertised as "original" WWII-Korean era Ka-Bars and the Camillus version of the same knife. Most I've seen were pretty rugged due to use, age and neglect, but they still seem to bring high prices on the auction sites...

For an everyday working knife, the #1217 is the "copy" of the original most true to it. That's probably the one shown in the OP's link judging by the SKU. If one's not sure, these guys sell a ton of Ka-Bars, and have not only the "original" styles at very good prices, but commemorative versions as well as "updated" ones with various steels and other details not found on the original. They've also got plenty of interesting tidbits to read about on their site:

http://www.tomarskabars.com/1217_INFO.html

A buddy has one of their #1217s and is quite happy to use it as a working knife, while keeping his Dad's Viet Nam era Ka-Bar in the safe...

Rick C

 

[GunnyGene]

Hi,

As Gunny notes, there are some subtle differences between the original and today's version, but how important they are probably depends on whether you're "barstool racing" or want a working knife. Once in a while one can find what are advertised as "original" WWII-Korean era Ka-Bars and the Camillus version of the same knife. Most I've seen were pretty rugged due to use, age and neglect, but they still seem to bring high prices on the auction sites...

For an everyday working knife, the #1217 is the "copy" of the original most true to it. That's probably the one shown in the OP's link judging by the SKU. If one's not sure, these guys sell a ton of Ka-Bars, and have not only the "original" styles at very good prices, but commemorative versions as well as "updated" ones with various steels and other details not found on the original. They've also got plenty of interesting tidbits to read about on their site:

http://www.tomarskabars.com/1217_INFO.html

A buddy has one of their #1217s and is quite happy to use it as a working knife, while keeping his Dad's Viet Nam era Ka-Bar in the safe...

Rick C

There's some interesting history on these knives. For example, some early designs used a threaded nut on the pommel, others the tang was peened over, and others pinned (which won out in the end). The USMC Quartermaster originally rejected the entire Ka-Bar design, but was over-ruled by the Commandant.

The one I had in VN had the shallow "S" shaped guard, but post war versions often have straight or simple curved guards.

 

[CLAYPOOL]

There is "D -2" steel in some of the newer ones. As another poster stated there is a LOT of veterans stuff on the market now that they are passing. its a shame, but if you watch the various sites, stuff can be bought.

 

[cruzerlou]

Hey Robes, I have a original WW II K Bar and you,ve been given sound advice here .
Mine is an Army knife ,but aside from the Army emblem on the sheath, its the same knife and one way to tell an original WW II Korea knife is the sheath.
The early sheaths were both stitched and rivited with brass rivets.
Viet Nam and later eara sheaths were stapled and stiched instead of rivited ,also the staples are galvanized, I have a Viet Nam Marine issue K Bar the was issued but never used,this one has the staples.
Lastly,the earilre Army knife has a straight guard and the pinged over tang.
My later V.N. Marine issue knife has a very slight downard angle the the guard 1/2 way from the end on both ends of the guard.
Let me know if you would like pics of the two different knives and I'll be glad to P.M. them to you.
Your Friend,
Lou

 

[k22fan]

A knife made from 3/8” stock certainly would whack the tails off salmon but I prefer a much smaller knife. However, the historical details here are interesting for those of us who like collector knives and WWII non-fiction books.

 

[prairieviper]

The USMC KA-BAR is made to the exact same standards as it was in 1941. You can watch the video on KA-Bar's homepage at the link below and check out the knives too. Pretty cool!

http://www.kabar.com/

 

[GunnyGene]

Here's the 1982 Mil-spec. . Couldn't find the 1941/'42 spec. http://everyspec.com/MIL-SPECS/MIL-SPECS-MIL-K/MIL-K-20277G_20509/


And some history of USMC fighting knives: http://www.network54.com/Forum/220604/thread/1052681319/last-1052681319/USMC+Knives+Of+WW+II

 

[Robes]

This is going to be a working knife. No wall decor. I went to the site Rick put up and liked what I saw, BUTTTTTT...then I saw they made one with a partially serrated edge (#1218). That is an option that comes in REAL handy for what I do. All my knives have a serrated edge. I'll be ordering up next week!

 

[WAYNO]

This post, as other Ka-Bar posts, have caught my interest.

I have searched for the knife we were issued as Army aircrew members, with sporadic results. I always thought ours were Ka-Bar, but I don't get any results using Ka-Bar in my search. I do find what looks to be correct, but it's an Ontario. Does anybody know if Ka-Bar made this knife also?



Thanks.

WAYNO.

 

[GunnyGene]

This post, as other Ka-Bar posts, have caught my interest.

I have searched for the knife we were issued as Army aircrew members, with sporadic results. I always thought ours were Ka-Bar, but I don't get any results using Ka-Bar in my search. I do find what looks to be correct, but it's an Ontario. Does anybody know if Ka-Bar made this knife also?



Thanks.

WAYNO.

Ka-Bar was, and still is, somewhat of a generic term for this style of knife, even tho Ka-bar (the company) was originally Union Cutlery Co. The first 1219C2 knives were produced by Camillus, which also manufactured more of them than any of the other companies that were contracted, including Union/Ka-Bar. These same companies also produced the Army and AF versions.

During WWII, Camillus, the Union Cutlery Co., Robeson (ShurEdge) Cutlery Co., and the PAL Cutlery Co. all provided these. Post war, Utica Cutlery Co., Conetta Cutlery Co., Camillus Cutlery Co., and (beginning around 1980) the Ontario Knife Co. all produced the Mark 2. Ka-Bar is owned by Cutco. Ontario Knife Co also makes and brands them as Case XX, as well as under the Ontario brand, for the last few years.

Ka-Bar, Ontario, and others make a modern 1219C2 that is identical to the USMC version except for the Army (or Navy) stamping.

What you're showing is the Knife, Pilots, Survival. Shorter blade (5"). They were made by Camillus, Ontario, and a few others. Used to have a couple of them from the '60's. Same knife was issued to USN and USMC aircrew.

 

[GunnyGene]

As long as were on the subject of military knives, I still have a 1945 Collins Legitimus machete that was also popular in the Pacific campaign. It's lost about 1" of it's original blade length (18") from decades of sharpening and use. Still use it regularly. Don't have the original sheath, but made a leather one about 20 years ago for it.

 

[stevemb]

I've the slightly dressier version, brown handle/sheath. When I handgun hunt, it and a 'hawk go on my belt. Think if you stick with KA-BAR, from Olean NY, you will be happy and honor Dad.

 

[GunnyGene]

Since there are some knockoffs that are sold with forged markings, a couple things to watch out for:

1. Poorly compressed grip leather - there should be 22 cowhide rings compressed at around 1000lbs.
2. Loose guard or pommel
3. Poorly pinned pommel
4. Other than 1095 steel

 

[xtratoy]

A buddy has one of their #1217s and is quite happy to use it as a working knife, while keeping his Dad's Viet Nam era Ka-Bar in the safe...

Rick C

I have a 1217 also. It is a workhorse.

 

[k22fan]

While they do not draw any where near as much collector interest the 5" navy deck knife is the best of the WWII military knives for hunting, camping and general use around the house. It is logical that would be the case. Sailors were too far away from their opponent to have any interest in fighting knives so they ordered the best working knives for the rope sailors frequently need. Other than being shorter and lighter navy blades have some good curve for skinning. They were made from thinner stock and are flat ground from the back to the edge bevel so they will slice cheese easily. Their design was not as well standardized as the 7" fighting knife but they are still readily recognized.

 

[GunnyGene]

While they do not draw any where near as much collector interest the 5" navy deck knife is the best of the WWII military knives for hunting, camping and general use around the house. It is logical that would be the case. Sailors were too far away from their opponent to have any interest in fighting knives so they ordered the best working knives for the rope sailors frequently need. Other than being shorter and lighter navy blades have some good curve for skinning. They were made from thinner stock and are flat ground from the back to the edge bevel so they will slice cheese easily. Their design was not as well standardized as the 7" fighting knife but they are still readily recognized.

My fathers Marlin spike:

 

[Tom W]

This post, as other Ka-Bar posts, have caught my interest.

I have searched for the knife we were issued as Army aircrew members, with sporadic results. I always thought ours were Ka-Bar, but I don't get any results using Ka-Bar in my search. I do find what looks to be correct, but it's an Ontario. Does anybody know if Ka-Bar made this knife also?



Thanks.

WAYNO.

When my Dad was alive and in the Corps, he gave me a knife that was just like that one, but stamped U.S.N.
I wish I knew what happened to it.....

 

[k22fan]

There were also issue hatchets. All this stuff was sold dirt cheap in surplus stores for camping. When I was a kid we used surplus mess kits, a canteen and a hatchet. I only still have the hatchet which, unfortunately from a collectors stand point, my father painted red so he could easily find it around the camp fire. There was also a dull "Kabar" that we used to dig in the dirt. It is long gone.

 

[Virginia Boy]

The Ontario Knife Co., makes The Old Hickory Knives, of which they have sold quite a few.
And , I think that they made the original Air Force Survival knife.

 

[WAYNO]

So, because of this thread, I've finally discovered the actual model number of our old issue knives, and I can get one ordered. Even though the Ka-Bars are similar, they are different.



Thanks.

WAYNO.

 

[eveled]

Wayne I've always called those knives "Nut knives", because of the shape of the pommel.

A friend of mine had one & was bragging it could be used to open a can. Another friend called him out saying there was no way it could go through a can. We got a can of cat food put it on the coffee table.

I suspect the friend who owned the knife had his doubts if it really could penetrate the can, so he hauled back & stabbed that can w/ everything he had. He stuck that knife right through both sides of the can & through the other friends mother's coffee table.