10-22 TD Accuracy Story

[mickeyboat]

Purchased a new 10-22 TD and ran rounds through it-all shots at 50 yards. Used a variable 4-9 scope mounted via quick disconnect rings. First days shooting of about 250 rounds with 6 different ammo types (from sub sonic match, to very high velocity, round nose and hollow point) results varied from not so good to awful.

I blamed the trigger, so got a new trigger assembly from Hornet. New trigger was terrific, zero creep, zero takeup and crisp 2.5 # trigger pull. Old trigger measured just a 7#.

Went to range today expecting wonderful groups. Well, the trigger did improve groups but the groups still varied from 2.5 to about 4 inches at 50 yards depending on ammo. I tried about 8 different kinds of ammo today all with varied results but none that I would consider good. When I had about 200 rounds through it today, I discovered I had yet to shoot from an old box of CCI Mini Mag hollow points. In order to be complete about it, I decided to try these rounds. Shot several 1.5 inch measured groups and the last 5 rounds were a measured 1.25 inches :lol: :lol: . Just went to Sportsman's Warehouse and loaded up on CCI Mini Mag hollow points.

All thorough this exercise I did notice something a little strange. After the guns sits for a bit, i.e. changing targets, the first round out of a cooler barrel is a flier, usually high but not always. If I let the barrel cool between 2 or 3 shots the accuracy is not good at all. Not sure what is causing this. My best groups were always with a barrel that was pretty warm. That thin short stainless barrel in the TD does warm up more than a lot of 22 barrels I have shot.

For good or bad I have not cleaned the barrel since the rifle was still in the box.

If anyone else buys a 10-22 TD, I recommend trying the CCI Mini Mag hollow points first. Somewhere else I read a shooter had excellent luck with this round in their TD. I do not believe there is anything that can be done about the first shot flier as the 10-22 barrel is what it is.

Some of rounds experimented with included:
Rem match ammo
Russian Olympic match ammo
CCI Stingers
Rem bulk hollowpoints
Win bulk hollowpoints
CCI subsonic
Win bulk round nose
Finally CCI Mini Mag hollow points-the winner by a lot

 

[Pinecone]

First off, I recommend you clean the rifle after "every" shooting session. Why? Because I have been working on and shooting .22 rimfires as a gunsmith for 46 + years and a clean barrel shoots better almost without exception from my "findings". Secondly, You did right by trying various types of ammo. That's also a given with .22 rimfires. There are many factors involved in how a specific rifle shoots. Barrel anomalies, chamber dimensions, scope mount or sight rigidity, alignment of bolt to chamber repeatability, triggernometry, (as you found out), etc., etc., not to mention that all .22 rimfire ammo "is not" created equally! Spend a few extra bucks and "try" some match grade ammo in it. The "good" stuff! You might be pleasantly surprised!.....................Dick :wink:

 

[mickeyboat]

First off, I recommend you clean the rifle after "every" shooting session. Why? Because I have been working on and shooting .22 rimfires as a gunsmith for 46 + years and a clean barrel shoots better almost without exception from my "findings". Secondly, You did right by trying various types of ammo. That's also a given with .22 rimfires. There are many factors involved in how a specific rifle shoots. Barrel anomalies, chamber dimensions, scope mount or sight rigidity, alignment of bolt to chamber repeatability, triggernometry, (as you found out), etc., etc., not to mention that all .22 rimfire ammo "is not" created equally! Spend a few extra bucks and "try" some match grade ammo in it. The "good" stuff! You might be pleasantly surprised!.....................Dick :wink:

I will try to find some higher quality ammo. Only match ammo I had was the aformentioned Rem match ammo left over from shooting the Olympic trials about 50 years ago at Camp Perry and some 5 year old Russian match ammo their team used in the Olympics in China. Who sells good match ammo today? Not sure if a plinking rifle like the Takedown deserves such ammo tho.

Still do not understand the reason the barrel shot so much better hot than cooler tho (ref the fliers).

 

[Rumrunner]

Many barrels need a fouling shot (sometimes 4 or 5). If I have a hunting rifle that the first shot from a clean barrel is off, I will shoot a fouling shot and not clean until done hunting for that period. Not sure why the warm barrel would out shoot a cold barrel. My TD shoots a variety of ammo well, and the CCI MiniMag HP's are right at the top.

 

[Pinecone]

mickeyboat, When barrels are manufactured, drilled, rifled and contour turned, stresses are set up in that barrel for pretty much the life of the rifle. This also includes the original stresses put into the blank or billet when it was made. These stresses are brought more into play when the barrel is "heated" by firing. Often times that barrel will give optimum accuracy at a "specific" temperature and be not as accurate at lower or higher temperatures. Stresses also have a great effect on barrel vibrations and how "they" effect accuracy. Since it's extremely unlikely that any two barrels will be exactly the same throughout, each rifle has to be tested for it's maximum optimum accuracy. Eley makes a very good match .22 rimfire round. The only reason I mentioned it, is that it would probably show you the "best" accuracy for your rifle. As an example, I have a 10-22 made in 1967 that is extremely accurate out to 25 yards with Eagle Brand HV solid point ammo (easy head shots on squirrels) but falls off at 35 to 40 yards quite a bit. Since most of my shots are 15 to 20 yard shots, it works well for me. Hope this helps you out...................Dick :wink:

 

[Snake45]

I have been working on and shooting .22 rimfires as a gunsmith for 46 + years and a clean barrel shoots better almost without exception from my "findings".

My findings are different from yours. In my own tests, some .22s shoot better clean, some don't seem to care, and some shoot better dirty. I have two accurate bolt actions in particular that shoot so-so with their favorite ammo but tighten up signficantly after several hundred shots--and then will maintain that level of accuracy with that ammo indefinitely. Clean them and they go back to shooting worse again (so I don't).

I don't think these two rifles are "exceptional." (I've seen it in other rifles, I've just kept very detailed records on these two.) I do think that if you're looking for all the accuracy you can get, clean vs dirty is definitely something to test for to see what works best for any particular gun/ammo combination.

To the OP: CCI MiniMags have shot well--sometimes very well--in every gun I've tried them in. The only other ammo I've seen that does so well in so many different guns is Winchester Dynapoints. Still, the improvement from 2.5 to 4 inches with other types to 1.5 or less with MMs is pretty dramatic, and I wonder if something else isn't going on here. :? :? :?

 

[GasGuzzler]

Whether it shoots better clean or not will have to wait because if it's a Ruger, it needs cleaned before shot the first time no matter what. They are stuffed with grease when built.

 

[mickeyboat]

Whether it shoots better clean or not will have to wait because if it's a Ruger, it needs cleaned before shot the first time no matter what. They are stuffed with grease when built.

I did not clean the barrel when new, it looked clean, ran a patch thru it and it came out clean. Did not see any grease. Completely cleaned barrel for first time after shooting today and found almost nothing in barrel. First patch with cleaner was only very slightly darkened. Second dry patch came out clean. This after about 500 rds.

 

[GasGuzzler]

Put the 1st 100 through mine and it looked like it had been slathered in WD-40 then dropped on the beach.

 

[mickeyboat]

Put the 1st 100 through mine and it looked like it had been slathered in WD-40 then dropped on the beach.

Maybe the barrel heat treatments Ruger had to add to the mfg process to prevent damage to barrel end from the bolt melted the grease out??

 

[GasGuzzler]

Mine's not a TD and was built before the issue I believe.

 

[Pinecone]

"My findings are different from yours"...............Snake, Your findings have always been "different" than mine. Good to see your still the self-proclaimed "expert" on this forum..................Dick :wink:

 

[Snake45]

"My findings are different from yours"...............Snake, Your findings have always been "different" than mine. Good to see your still the self-proclaimed "expert" on this forum..................Dick :wink:

I haven't proclaimed myself an expert on anything, merely shared my experiences, just as you have, Dick.

 

[5Wire]

When you assemble the rifle, do you dry fire it as Ruger recommends before shooting? Made a difference for the first shot for me, not so much a flyer as on the outside edge of average..

 

[Richbaker]

"My findings are different from yours"...............Snake, Your findings have always been "different" than mine. Good to see your still the self-proclaimed "expert" on this forum..................Dick :wink:

I haven't proclaimed myself an expert on anything, merely shared my experiences, just as you have, Dick.

Most .22 rimfire Benchrest competitors give the same recommendation as Snake..... Fouling the barrel after cleaning, and NOT cleaning until the accuracy starts to degrade. They say it should take several HUNDRED rounds before that happens with a good barrel.

 

[Snake45]

"My findings are different from yours"...............Snake, Your findings have always been "different" than mine. Good to see your still the self-proclaimed "expert" on this forum..................Dick :wink:

I haven't proclaimed myself an expert on anything, merely shared my experiences, just as you have, Dick.

Most .22 rimfire Benchrest competitors give the same recommendation as Snake..... Fouling the barrel after cleaning, and NOT cleaning until the accuracy starts to degrade. They say it should take several HUNDRED rounds before that happens with a good barrel.

You wouldn't believe the crapstorm that happened when I published my results--with the actual numbers--on Rimfirecentral.com! The thread ran to 7 or 8 pages, and that was AFTER the mods went through and culled quite a few posts that were extremely abrasive, abusive, insulting, obscene, and so forth. You'd have thought that I'd personally attacked people's mothers, wives, daughters, dogs, or religions, ferpissake! :shock: :lol: On the other hand, there were quite a few posters who reported findings similar to mine, or described that they'd run tests similar to mine and their gun shot more accurately clean, which was fine with me, as I wasn't advocating cleaning or not cleaning them, just trying to get to the truth. And I never said that MY results applied to ALL guns, or even MOST guns, but they applied to the guns I tested and they were what they were.

The only topic I've ever seen at RFC that almost as contentious as whether or not to clean, is HOW to clean a .22. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I've said this many times and will probably say it many more: Every gun and ammo combination is a law unto itself. YOU have to test YOUR gun with YOUR ammo to see what works and what doesn't. There's just no other way. :wink:

 

[wwb]

[.......I've said this many times and will probably say it many more: Every gun and ammo combination is a law unto itself. YOU have to test YOUR gun with YOUR ammo to see what works and what doesn't. There's just no other way. :wink:

+1

My late 60s vintage, bone stock 10/22 shoots cheap CCI Blazers better than Eley match ammo. In fact, the hotter the load, the happier it seems to be. Savage bolt action .22 is exactly the opposite.... loves match ammo, hates any of the "hyper-velocity" loads.

Go figure.

 

[Snake45]

[.......I've said this many times and will probably say it many more: Every gun and ammo combination is a law unto itself. YOU have to test YOUR gun with YOUR ammo to see what works and what doesn't. There's just no other way. :wink:

+1

My late 60s vintage, bone stock 10/22 shoots cheap CCI Blazers better than Eley match ammo. In fact, the hotter the load, the happier it seems to be. Savage bolt action .22 is exactly the opposite.... loves match ammo, hates any of the "hyper-velocity" loads.

Go figure.

I don't doubt it for a minute. My Anschutz 64 simply loves the cheap Federal Walmart Bulk, and shoots that stuff more accurately than any other gun I own shoots any other ammo. The kicker is that the Fed Bulk ammo finished dead last or almost last in my accuracy tests of some two dozen other rifles. Out of six types of ammo tried, it was 5th or 6th in accuracy in every single one of them except the Anschutz. As you said, go figger. :wink:

 

[dacaur]

I have never owned a .22 that liked to be cleaned. All of mine have always shot like crap when clean, then tighten up after 50-100 rounds. I clean them once every year or two out of general principle, but they sure arent happy about it...

 

[Swampman]

I've never found a clean barrel to shoot well. It's a shame that these new designs aren't sorted out before they start shipping. My Ruger GSR wouldn't shoot worth a crap either. I loved the gun but it was so inaccurate I sold it.