AR556 wow's ....

Hello Rick C.....

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that no, there aint no "air gun at every bench to blow the chips out". Oh, ya might find one here or there but as a rule, air guns are viewed as a safety hazard these days, and the few which can be found on a modern-day assembly line have been OSHA-ized to the point that they are perty-useless.

As far as Mr Fifer's roll in the company goes, he aint getting paid to produce a flawless product, or even close to it. What he is paid to do is ensure that Ruger turns X-amount of profit, that everyone concerned gets their bonus check, and that the stock holders stay happy.
Very little of that has anything to do with producing a flawless product. On the other hand, it has a lot to do with what management calls "continuous improvement", which in actual practice, can be boiled down to nothing more than a quest for ever-cheaper materials, methods, and seeing how many skilled workers can be eliminated.

I don't suspect that I'll ever have a conversation with "Mr Fifer", but I were to accidentally have such an encounter, I'd tell him perty-quick that he needs to keep his hands off of Ruger's Customer Service Dept because it is the ONLY reason that I even bother with the company's guns any more.

DGW

If the scope/mounts are tight it shouldn't matter if it is "dialed in or not", should group. Group may not be where youd like it, but it should group. Scope adjust turrets are to move the group on the target.

well things tool a turn on me! i want a free floater on my rifle so picked one up from a local modded it to fit around the A2 sight since ruger pins the sight on top of the barrel could not fine a low profile gas block that gets pinned the same way (oh well) trying to get the barrel nut off i bent the upper thinking i'm just a goof and didnt know what i was doing :shock: found a local shop that makes upper/lowers and they was willing to install my barrel on there new upper so after a 35 mile drive handed the gun smith my upper 10 minutes later he comes back and tells me HE could not get the nut off either :evil: WTF? called to ruger and told them its bent and even the gun smith for the local AR15 manufacture could not remove it either some thing is seriously wrong. the lady who answered tells me you need a "special" wrench to remove it so i told her its a local manufacture who makes, sells & services AR15's i'm sure they have the "special" wrench and they couldn't remove it either she tells me i'd have to ship the rifle back and repairs is on my dime. i'm very upset with there customer service i'd totally get it if it was my fault but when some one who eat sleeps and breaths AR's could not do it SOMETHINGS wrong and it should not be on my dime

any way once i got home i was so up set and at this point nothing to loose I put the "special" wrench to the side and grabbed my 24" pipe wrench put the upper in a bench vise and still could not get it off! took my heat gun out heated it for about 15 minutes still could not brake it loose so i grabbed 2ft peace of pipe slipped it over the pipe wrench and finally barely broke it loose! 35ft lb MY @ZZ!

today i was finally able to get the new upper and free floater installed so up set with this rifle nothing but fail to feed and now this i'm thinking i am going to sell it and just build one, maybe i'm just not cut out for ruger...

probably take it back to the range Monday, I'll let you guys know who it go's

Ok, so we give you suggestions to remedy your situation and you try them. However, before you test fire the rifle to see if our suggestions worked, you proceeded to hammer-hand around on the rifle enough to bend the upper. Then, after cranking the barrel off forcefully, you install it onto another upper and wonder why it doesn't work?

Regardless of whether there was a real issue with your rifle or not from the outset, Ruger is in no way responsible for any repairs after you started your hack-job on it.

And now, you're going to sell it with known problems? And going to build one?

Don't blame Ruger at this point because you cannot prove that you didn't cause your problems. Suck it up and pay the shipping to get yourself a repaired rifle. It's the cost of a lesson learned.

Aqualung

All is not lost. The hands on contines and a few tools are needed along with a book or two on the AR-15 and you can be well on your way to mastering the gun.

stroker87 said:

maybe i'm just not cut out for ruger...

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or minor gunsmithing......

huntsman22 said:

stroker87 said:

maybe i'm just not cut out for ruger...

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or minor gunsmithing......

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this really? you have no idea as to what my skills are or what i'm capable of, I have few other fire arms and have modded them with no issues at all in including my KIMBER WARRIOR 1911. Huntsman22 you maybe should of asked "if" i know my way around a firearm before you posted your one liner I personally would have respected that but you just assumed i have no skills

if i didnt take it to a gun smith that works on ar's every single day I would say yeah it was all me but when he tells me I CANT GET IT OFF EITHER you guys are willing to tell me its not a factory defect?? seriously?

stroker87 said:

huntsman22 said:

stroker87 said:

maybe i'm just not cut out for ruger...

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or minor gunsmithing......

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this really? you have no idea as to what my skills are or what i'm capable of, I have few other fire arms and have modded them with no issues at all in including my KIMBER WARRIOR 1911. Huntsman22 you maybe should of asked "if" i know my way around a firearm before you posted your one liner I personally would have respected that but you just assumed i have no skills

if i didnt take it to a gun smith that works on ar's every single day I would say yeah it was all me but when he tells me I CANT GET IT OFF EITHER you guys are willing to tell me its not a factory defect?? seriously?

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First off, we didnt assume anything. In your own words, you're "new to the rifle world", and regardless of whether you've experience with handguns, they're different in their own ways.

I stand by what I said earlier, you may have made changes that may have fixed your problem, but you didn't test them. Then, you damaged your upper by working on the rifle yourself. You only took the rifle to the gunsmith after you cranked around at it...

And as I stated before, whether there was a factory defect or not is beside the point because you didn't prove that the problem continued before you tried to remove the barrel. So, while it may have been Ruger's responsibility before you tried to make your modifications, after you did them, they're not liable.

What you should have done was to stop trying to remove the barrel and send the rifle back to Ruger. At that point it would have been their responsibility and their dime. However, after you performed your alterations, there is no guarantee that you didn't damage the rifle and cause the issues.

Should the barrel nut be that hard to get off? No. Is it likely to be a factory defect? Probably. But, how can you *prove* to Ruger that you didn't put your pipe wrench with the 2' pipe "cheater bar" on the nut and turn it the wrong way first?

Ruger has repeatedly taken responsibility for their proven factory defects and made it right with consumers. However, just as repeatedly, they don't stand by and take responsibility for failures caused by user alterations. This is why any after-market springs, hammers, triggers or other mods are immediately removed at the factory if a modified gun is sent back in for repairs.

What I had an issue with is that you came to the forum asking advice. We took the time and effort to give you sincere advice and you seemed to be taking it. However, you didn't tell us the outcome of our advice. Did you test fire it after tightening the block and cleaning? If so, you never told us.

No, you then talk about how you bent your upper trying to wrench the barrel off.

Remember, all we know about you at this point is "new to the rifle world". We gave you advice and you didn't take it...so yes, we're going to give you flack.

So, spare us your indignation.

Aqualung

Stroker-I hope you don't stick another shooter w/ something that wont shoot..

stroker87 said:

you have no idea as to what my skills are or what i'm capable of

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Sure I do. YOU told us......

stroker87 said:

trying to get the barrel nut off i bent the upper thinking i'm just a goof and didnt know what i was doing

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stroker87 said:

Huntsman22 you maybe should of asked "if" i know my way around a firearm before you posted your one liner

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stroker87 said:

grabbed my 24" pipe wrench put the upper in a bench vise and still could not get it off! took my heat gun out heated it for about 15 minutes still could not brake it loose so i grabbed 2ft peace of pipe slipped it over the pipe wrench and finally barely broke it loose!

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Do you REALLY think I should have 'asked'?....

Mebbe you 'know your way around a firearm., Bench vises, pipe wrenches, cheater bars and heat guns are some really cool tools. Didja need them to 'mod' the 'few others' and that bishin' Kimber Warrior?

stroker87 said:

I have few other fire arms and have modded them with no issues at all in including my KIMBER WARRIOR 1911.

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i guess you guys are just ruger dies hard's lol

I had it locked in a vice using a ar15 vise block with the special barrel nut wrench and yes bent it, thinking at the time maybe i did do something wrong as I said before but the gun smith couldn't get it off either, I didnt try to make ruger fix it did you guys miss the part that i said i replaced the upper??? my problem with ruger is the lady said right off the bat it was on my dime! now if that lady said we have to see it to determine whos at fault that would have been acceptable to me but with out seeing it said it my fault. I know you guys didnt see me do it and have no clue of my skills but even a pro could not do it and the force it took to finally get it off was not normal so IMO i feel it was not my fault but still fixed it any way on my dime

langenc no i would not try to pass this off as a perfect working rifle, i had my fun with karma in my younger days lesson learned!

huntsman22 no it didnt & the kimber it bishin'

Aqualung had problems before i "hack-job on it" and still do, i'm not sure how installing a new upper with a free floater is a hack-job :shock:


Now took it out today and it still has the fail to feed problem! tried 3 different mag's i had on hand 2- 30 rounders and 1 - 10 round didnt make a difference every shot or every other shot failed to feed. this time it was totally cleaned then "lightly" oiled. one thing about this rifle is if i try to unload a live round pulling back the charge handle is very very hard, i though it would get easier once i had some rounds though it but its still hard as last time i took it to the range so what to check now?

on the upside the group's was the size of a quarter



now if you guys are done picking and having fun I'd like help to try and get to the bottom of my problem that i started this topic for (before mods)

Aqualung had problems before i "hack-job on it" and still do, i'm not sure how installing a new upper with a free floater is a hack-job :shock:

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It's not one until you start using heat guns, cheater bars and the like until you bend the upper receiver.

And your story keeps changing, as you told us that your second call to Ruger resulted in the CS person telling you the repair was on your dime. In your narrative, this came AFTER you wrenched around at the barrel.

My points still stand.

Moving on...

As for your current issues, I honestly don't have any more ideas. Anything else that I've heard around here is more involved than any "quick fixes" that we may suggest. Feed ramp burrs, or possibly a set-back barrel (if that's possible in an AR), or burrs in the chamber.

Maybe take a clean, unmarked round and chamber it, then manually cycle it out. Then inspect the round for scratches which may give an indicator as to what may be hanging up. Maybe even do like a metal worker does and color the whole round with a magic marker and somehow mark an index on the round to show top. Wherever the marker is scribed off and the extent may give an indicator.

Aside from the barrel removal thing, did the gunsmith have any suggestions for what may be causing the ftf issues?

Aqualung

Aqualung i never changed my story I didn't wait for ruger to fix my rifle, I said i bent it then took it to the gun smith and he could not remove it so then I grabbed a pipe wrench and went at it finally got it off, my first call was about the fail to feed and she said try different ammo nothing more

any way

this pics are from me trying to feed and eject the round after reading your reply about checking the cartridge case for marks and there is some, the other picks shows how its getting stuck when it fails to feed, again trying to pull the charge handle back when there is a cartridge in the chamber is very hard to do

this been happening since day one

stroker87 said:

...
any way

this pics are from me trying to feed and eject the round after reading your reply about checking the cartridge case for marks and there is some, the other picks shows how its getting stuck when it fails to feed, again trying to pull the charge handle back when there is a cartridge in the chamber is very hard to do

this been happening since day one

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The barrel overhanging the two feed ramps on the upper receiver is a big problem for FTF. Do you see it? Did it come from Ruger this way?

If this is how it came from the factory, you may have a misaligned barrel extension, when the pin hole may be off, so when it was installed in the receiver the M4 feed ram in the receiver did not align with the M4 cuts in the extension. Could be bad machining on the receiver (extension pin slot off timing) incorrectly timed in hole in the extension, or if drilled when the barrel is installed, it was not timed correctly.

In terms of barrel nut torque, typical minimum is 35 ft lbs, but to get the barrel nut, gas tube and receiver to align without the gas tube rubbing/binding, the torque can go much higher, sometimes a lot higher. Lots of builders use plenty of anti-seize compound here, but some of the accuracy guys red loctite things into place. No idea what Ruger does, but thinking the anti-seize would be more common with factory guns.

On the barrel torque, that's why some of the high quality hand guards that are free floating have gotten away from the gas tue scallops, and only have a diameter that allows the gas tube to pass over. Easier to hit needed minimum torque and not worry about timing the nut so the gas tube does not bind.

Just an FYI and my 2 bits.

steelshooterco so your saying the barrel is not deep enough in he upper receiver?

Actually, i believe hes saying it's too deep into the receiver and causing a "lip" at the top of the ramps upon which the bullet is hanging...

At this juncture, I think your only move is to get another barrel, tube and block. At least the lower isn't a loss.

Aqualung

would this also be the reason its so hard to un-chamber a live round?

stroker87 said:

would this also be the reason its so hard to un-chamber a live round?

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I thought about that too.

Is it hard to unseat, then easy (like the bullet is jammed into the rifling when chambered), or tough all the way back?

How does a round drop into the chamber without the bolt following? Drop right in, or do you need to shove it in? How about getting it out?

Wish you had some dummy rounds for safety...

Aqualung