Ruger/Lipsey's Quality Falling Fast ?

[Sugar River]

Apparently I have it wrong and can well admit it.

I'm sure y'all are tired of hearing from me so I'll shut up now.

Finally, something we can agree on.

 

[chet15]

Freemason??
Chet15

 

[BearBio]

"This is gonna be one of those 40cal vs. 9mm topics, that seems pretty obvious."

Agreed! We won't ever get to a resolution. Some have had good luck, some have not. Lipsey's COULD improve but appear unwilling to do so. Maybe it would cut their profit margin too much (?).

Me? I'll continue to buy Old Models.

 

[hutchman]

....Me? I'll continue to buy Old Models.

Then why did you post in the first place.....? Crap like your post is the reason some of us don't post here much any more.....

 

[hittman]

Lipsey's COULD improve but appear unwilling to do so.

Wondering if you read Jason's posts and still typed this. Here's a sample of what he said earlier in this very same thread.

Some people have issued concerns whether we care or not about guns with cosmetic or function issues. That is a legitimate concern and I can tell you we take it very seriously. Every time we have to take a gun back its like taking a $50 bill and setting it on fire. By the time we absorb the shipping and processing cost we lose money on that gun. When we are made aware of a problem we take that to the manufacturer so they can take measures to correct it.

Some have questioned whether Lipsey's as a company cares about its customers. All I can say is that's THE reason I even started posting on here. When some guys asked me to join the forum I told them I am not here to sell guns or shill for our company. All I wanted to do was be a resource and a contact point for guys and gals who had questions, concerns, problems, or suggestions. Lipsey's has been extremely open (some from within the industry think too open) with production numbers, qty's sold, product lead times, etc. Just ask CHET15 how easy it is to get that kind of info from other distributors. We don't have to do any of this, but we are gun enthusiast too and know info like that is something fellow enthusiast like to know. My inbox has stayed full of request for help to find a gun, to get info about a gun, help with an issue with a gun, or to give ideas for future guns. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I have responded to each and every request and have done whatever it took to make the customer happy. Some of the issues were our fault, some the maker's fault, some a dealer's fault, some the forum members fault. Either way we do our best to make you happy.

In the end, if you are concerned about the fact we do not inspect each gun that comes in our warehouse and decide not to buy one, there aren't any hard feelings here. If you would like to discuss it further I'm always available. If there's one thing you can't say is that I'm not accessible. You can email me, PM me, call me , write me, or send me your number and I will call you.

Here are all the points of contact:

toll free: 800-666-1333
email: [email protected]
mailing address: Lipsey's, LLC.
7277 Exchequer Drive
Baton Rouge, LA 70809
Jason

Y'all understand, right, that this guy has NO obligation to be here? He's certainly no obligation to state publicly who he is and where he works. Sad indeed that instead of using him as a resource to "get things done" or "make things right" some are border-line flaming him and his company. I'm just so lost on this one.

Just for the record, I'm not with Lipsey's and have never bought one of their guns or been to one of their stores. Frankly, never heard of them until I joined this board but I'm in a very small and rural Midwestern community that is (thankfully) shielded from all the sinister deeds (I'm kidding!) perpetrated on customers who shop there. :wink:

 

[mohavesam]

I was taking from my experiences at 2 wholesalers (three maybe if I can recall 40 years ago...). But then it was whatever the ATF told us to do. YMMV.

 

[DPris]

BB,
By what distorted stretch of a very off-kilter imagination are you able to conclude that "Lipsey's COULD improve but appear unwilling to do so"?

You have zero info on what Jason & Lipsey's have done in meetings with Ruger, know absolutely nothing whatever about communications between the two companies, and base a totally unfounded conclusion on...exactly nothing.

This QC thing with Ruger has gone on for a long time, not just with Lipsey's, and Lipsey's is not the only entity that's discussed (and repeatedly discussed) the issue with Ruger.

When the market slows and Ruger has time to catch up, I'm hoping & assuming they will.
If they don't, it will not be the fault of anybody at Lipsey's, or any other distributor.

You make a completely false assertion with no understanding of what goes on in reality behind the scenes.

This thread has surpassed absurdity in many of the statements made.
Anybody else is welcome to the last word(s), I'm done with it.
Denis

 

[gc70]

This thread has developed from the OP's complaints to a general discussion of whether distributors or others in the delivery chain of merchandise are 'obligated' to deliver products that meet each individual purchaser's expectations ... and I have thoughts on both topics.

The OP complained about three guns - one he refused to accept and two that he bought. Since the OP stated or suggested that he inspected the two guns he bought, his only valid complaints (IMO) were pin movement and the poor accuracy of one gun, which could not be detected by visual inspection. Sharp edges, machine marks, sharp edges, ill-fitting grip panels, sharp edges, light-strike markings, and sharp edges are all things that, as the OP pointed out, "(e)ven a blind guy could inspect/detect." Don't buy an unacceptable product when you know it is unacceptable. And certainly don't buy an unacceptable product with the expectation that the manufacturer will 'fix' the product to some level of perfection that you would like to have.

The comments about distributors seem to focus on 'special runs' commissioned by distributors. I have only owned two or three Rugers that were not 'special run' guns. I appreciate the fact that distributors listen to customers and front the money for models customers want but manufacturers would not otherwise produce. However, I cannot remember buying any 'special run' guns with significant quality differences from the manufacturer's other products from the same time period - unless some aspect of quality (i.e. finish) was an advertised feature, with a commensurate increase in price. Again, don't buy a product that is not acceptable to you. And certainly don't buy an unacceptable product in the belief that the distributor has an 'obligation' to transform a limited-production gun into a perfect collectible piece for your future financial benefit.

 

[LuckenbachTexas]

Deleted

 

[dad11345]

I tried to post a comment earlier about dealing with customer service being a part of the adult process, I guess it got deleted. The one thing I will take away from reading this topic is respect for Don44 (Jason). Not many folks like him in business today.

 

[don44]

No sir, I'm not Jason, but he is a good guy.

 

[dad11345]

My bad. Sorry. Assumptions are like diarrhea, too fluid in occurring to control and not the best of conclusions.

 

[clayflingythingy]

BB,

This QC thing with Ruger has gone on for a long time, not just with Lipsey's, and Lipsey's is not the only entity that's discussed (and repeatedly discussed) the issue with Ruger.

When the market slows and Ruger has time to catch up, I'm hoping & assuming they will.
If they don't, it will not be the fault of anybody at Lipsey's, or any other distributor.

Denis

Running at maximum capacity does not in itself excuse poor quality.

Ruger sales this year are in a decline.

http://www.ruger.com/corporate/news/2014-10-29a.html

 

[protoolman]

Of course Rugers sales are in decline, did you think they could maintain their meteoric rise in sales forever? I'm betting sales are still better than any 10 of the smaller companies. I also applaud Jason for being here. Awesome that he takes the time to help us out. Not many other companies that treat us that well. As for these quality issues well just chill a bit and buy your .327s from a stocking dealer so you can look them over and pick a good one. Collectors drove Bill Ruger crazy he made good guns for shooters. I hope I never buy so many guns I start ordering them sight unseen regularly. I just can't wrap my head around someone having problems with 3 guns in a year. Lipsey's is selling over 1000 guns a day and what's the return rate? .5%? Any yet one guy got 3 bad ones? What are the odds? I think I just figured it out. None of my 30+ guns has perfectly fitted grips, a few had shipping handling marks etc. I guess all of them are defective and should have been returned! Mine are all fairly accurate too, hope I don't get accused of having them all cherry picked for me.

 

[buckeyeshooter]

"If Davidson's passes on a defective Ruger (or Smith, or Charter, or Hi-Point), do you hold them responsible for defective merchandise?"

Answer: Yes. In fact Davidson's as everyone knows, actually has a lifetime warranty on the Ruger guns and guns from other makers, that they take responsibility for maker's defects. That is a stand-up plan born from customer dedication.

Yep, plus one on that. I bought a Winchester 1895 takedown in 30-06 that had a bad quality case finish and a big scratch on the magazine from the lever not being properly fitted.
I called Winchester/ Browning and got some bull hockey from customer service and a promise of a return call later. Then, a call to Davidson's..... gun replaced the NEXT DAY VIA OVERNIGHT SHIPMENT with a gun that had a note from the Customer Service rep that I talked to saying, he personally checked this gun over and selected this one because the wood had good figure.
I am a Davidson's Customer for life on any new gun I buy these days.

 

[JustsayMo]

I very much appreciate Lipseys for the products they bring to the market. I'm 100% happy with all of mine. High quality at a price even I can afford. I'll buy more and fully expect they'll be just as excellent with the added bonus that there are men like Jason standing behind it.

My Single Seven has exceeded my high expectations in every way. Thank you Lipseys!

 

[rugerguy]

bottom line is that folks like 'Lipseys' are the ones who are really getting the factory to make things that the buying public wants, and yes, Jason, Lipseys for one are getting this done,it is NOT their fault that any ones QC is slipping, they do not actually open and check ever gun that comes through their distributorship...obviously the chain of supply , is multi faceted, going from there , to here, and NO one along this way does any sort of "checking it out"...nature of the beast and the system...YES< any gun shop upon getting the stuff, should indeed , open it up, look it over, check oit out BEFORE it goes into the show case, again, two or more folks NOW have the chance to look it iver as they are handling it, the shipping/receiving guys and then the actual salesman, I was in a shop the other day (Fin Feather & Fur) here in Middleburgh Hts ,Ohio, and that monday there must have been almost a dozen sales people behind the counter, I know I talked with MOST of them, and YES,for the most part, they do take it upon themselves to "look over the product" and made comment as to such.........we were able to ,in our shop , we were small , looked over every gun, cleaned them off, and worked the actions, and back then I can count on ONE hand how many of any we ever had to "send back",of ANY maker, even the low budget guns of small companies.......

now I can also say that back then in the mid 70's I was at a few of the different companies, , learning their products, on the lines, and in the fitting rooms....and back THEN< they about ALL had a "senior" person, some had MANY years, some close to retirement, or on a slight disability , could not walk the floor , stand up for long time,s whatever, BUT management kept them around, out them in the FINAL QC check out and they did NOT miss a thing...today its all about the numbers, get it out fast as one can, and as I say ALL the time, "there is not enough time to built it and test it, right , the first time around, but always enough time to recall it and do it over again....." and this is what I see all too often, and now the "bull rush" is over, production is slowing down, the market is flooded with everything BUT ammo.........wake up corporate America, please.

and as for the folks like Jason, THANK YOU Sir, marketing is still where its at and what we need.

 

[Jason at Lipsey's]

Thank you JustsayMo and rugerguy!

 

[PriseDeFer]

As you can see from this conversation when you stamp your name and make your mark on a product it still means something to some folks. If the obligation grows onerous just be another nameless, faceless distributor.