PC4 Accuracy
- Thread starter DJH1
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You need to understand from the get-go that the PC is definitely NOT a target rifle. With that said, there is liable to be cosiderable variation in accuracy from one rifle to the next, even though they appear to be identical. Also, each rifle will almost certainly exhibit a definite preference for one brand and/or bullet weight of ammo.
Out of the Carbine length barrel, the .40 gains considerable velocity over a handgun length barrel. If you're a handloader, you can gain even more by using heavy bullets and slow powders.
As to the "effective range"..... what's the intended target, how large a target, and how much energy is required?
Doesn't take much oomph at all to poke a hole in a piece of paper, but you need a pretty substatial whallop to kill a deer. Bullets intended for use in the .40 all have lousy ballistic coefficients, so they lose velocity (and energy) very rapidly, making even a "hot" load a short range rifle for hunting purposes. Also, the size of the "kill zone" on the target will determine the effective range.... if you can't confidently keep all your shots within the vitals, you're past your effective range.
Out of the Carbine length barrel, the .40 gains considerable velocity over a handgun length barrel. If you're a handloader, you can gain even more by using heavy bullets and slow powders.
As to the "effective range"..... what's the intended target, how large a target, and how much energy is required?
Doesn't take much oomph at all to poke a hole in a piece of paper, but you need a pretty substatial whallop to kill a deer. Bullets intended for use in the .40 all have lousy ballistic coefficients, so they lose velocity (and energy) very rapidly, making even a "hot" load a short range rifle for hunting purposes. Also, the size of the "kill zone" on the target will determine the effective range.... if you can't confidently keep all your shots within the vitals, you're past your effective range.
idoono
Bearcat
DJH1":390n3v9j said:
They are out of mine :wink:
idoono
I am definetely not planning on deer hunting with this gun and I dont reload. 100 yds would be the farthest I'd be shooting and it needs to have enough downrange energy to kill a soda can. I have no delusions about this being a "target rifle" or long range hunting gun, it'll be just for plinking and shots on the occasional running coyote at 75yds and in. Just want to know should I be able to hit cans at 100 or just count myself lucky if it would hit the broad side of a barn at 100. I have no experience with these guns and dont believe I have never seen one in person.
Rat76
Single-Sixer
Closer to can than barn door accuracy. My PC4 seems better at 100 yards than the PC9. Both are good at 75 yards with iron sights but the .40 has a little more range.
Soda cans at 100 yards is likely to be a hit-or-miss proposition (pun intended).
Unless you find a magically accurate combination of rifle and load, you're likely to be "close" every shot, with maybe a 1 out of 2 hit ratio. Think of it this way - the soda can is about 3 inches wide.... if you can shoot a 6" group (which seems about right), you're gonna hit about 50% of the time.
Since the can is a little over 6" tall, vertical group size shouldn't be a problem, unless you shoot a lot in a short period of time, causing the barrel to get excessively hot. That usually results in vertical stringing on a non-floated barrel.
If you really want to kill those dangerous soda cans at 100 yards, a target model 10/22 would be a better bet.... and, if you don't reload, shooting the .40 will give you a serious wound in the wallet area.
For "running coyotes at 75 yards", a Mini 14 .223 or .22 mag would be a far better bet. The .40 would have the energy at that range, but it's pretty slow. Without working out the numbers, I'd guess you'd need to lead it by 10 feet or better... a pretty iffy shot.
Unless you find a magically accurate combination of rifle and load, you're likely to be "close" every shot, with maybe a 1 out of 2 hit ratio. Think of it this way - the soda can is about 3 inches wide.... if you can shoot a 6" group (which seems about right), you're gonna hit about 50% of the time.
Since the can is a little over 6" tall, vertical group size shouldn't be a problem, unless you shoot a lot in a short period of time, causing the barrel to get excessively hot. That usually results in vertical stringing on a non-floated barrel.
If you really want to kill those dangerous soda cans at 100 yards, a target model 10/22 would be a better bet.... and, if you don't reload, shooting the .40 will give you a serious wound in the wallet area.
For "running coyotes at 75 yards", a Mini 14 .223 or .22 mag would be a far better bet. The .40 would have the energy at that range, but it's pretty slow. Without working out the numbers, I'd guess you'd need to lead it by 10 feet or better... a pretty iffy shot.
I read this and got to thinking. My first guess is that they would shoot around 2" at 50 yards and should. Then as I read on, others posted larger numbers than I had guessed. The one thing that we must remember is you mentioned with a low powered scope and I feel that would greatly increase your accuracy. All 3 versions of sight setups on the PC carbines were fairly vague. So I think a test is in order. Someone here has to have set up theirs with a scope and done some accuracy testing. If not I will scope up mine and test it for accuracy with a few different loads. You are interested in the 40 s+w only correct?
DJH1":1tm4bg64 said:
Dont let that stop you from getting a PC9 if thats the rifle you want. According to Rugers website they made more PC9's than they did 40's. People are probably more likely to keep them if they have a pistol to match and there are alot more 9mm Rugers on the road than 40's. So that may explain the difference in demand. If you are patient you can find a PC9 for a good price. They are out there. I found 5 carbines in both cailibers for under $525/shipped in the last 1.5 years. Good luck!
The reason the PC9s are hard to find is some of us are hoarding them... I've got two and want one more....
I think 100 yards with either the 9 or 40 is really pushing it. I can do about 3" groups with my PC9 at 50 yards and the iron sights.... which is minute of head at what I consider the rifles optimum range of use.
I think 100 yards with either the 9 or 40 is really pushing it. I can do about 3" groups with my PC9 at 50 yards and the iron sights.... which is minute of head at what I consider the rifles optimum range of use.
Hi all,
I just took my PC-4 to the range today. It was a police turn-in and has very little wear. I tried it with three loads at 100 yards, Federal 180 gr. flat point, Speer 165 gr. Gold Dot, and 165 gr. reloads. Shot it both with iron sights and a 4 power scope. For both my brother and myself it shot right around 12 inch groups. Does this sound reasonable? I was hoping for a little better since my Hi-Point 9 mm carbine will put them into 3 - 4 inch groups all day. Thanks for the help.
Mike
I just took my PC-4 to the range today. It was a police turn-in and has very little wear. I tried it with three loads at 100 yards, Federal 180 gr. flat point, Speer 165 gr. Gold Dot, and 165 gr. reloads. Shot it both with iron sights and a 4 power scope. For both my brother and myself it shot right around 12 inch groups. Does this sound reasonable? I was hoping for a little better since my Hi-Point 9 mm carbine will put them into 3 - 4 inch groups all day. Thanks for the help.
Mike
DJH1":diqk32vk said:
Went to the range today and thought I'd work my way out, short to long. Started (and finished) at 25 yards. Best group off of sand bags with a scope was right at 5". I know this isn't a target rifle, but it should shoot better than my P94. It looks to be in almost new shape. Is there any known issues that I could address, internal or otherwise to tighten up my groups?
Thanks, Mike
Thanks, Mike
halfmoonclip
Bearcat
- Joined
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- 84
I've had some acceptable groups out of my PC9 at 25yds and hit things at 50. All pistol caliber carbines can hit the wall... of ballistic coefficient at about 75 yards. I wouldn't want me shooting at me at 100 yds, but it's got to be a slow and blooping shot. I've taken deer with a .44 mag carbine, and the same thing holds true; good to about 75 yds, but you better figure on a good bit of holdover at 100.
Pistol caliber carbines extend the range and hit probability of a handgun; they aren't a satisfactory replacement for a rifle.
That said, short of a end of life as we know it event, it's hard to make a case for civilians shooting in anger beyond 25 yds, so it's a non issue.
Let your pistol carbine be what it is.
Moon
Pistol caliber carbines extend the range and hit probability of a handgun; they aren't a satisfactory replacement for a rifle.
That said, short of a end of life as we know it event, it's hard to make a case for civilians shooting in anger beyond 25 yds, so it's a non issue.
Let your pistol carbine be what it is.
Moon
Moon,
I'm not expecting a target rifle, but my Hi-Point carbine shoots less than half the group size at 100 yards that my PC-4 does at 25. Heck, even my $40 paint ball marker with no sights will print better groups at 25 yards. I was just wanting to know if there was any known problem areas that could affect accuracy.
Mike
I'm not expecting a target rifle, but my Hi-Point carbine shoots less than half the group size at 100 yards that my PC-4 does at 25. Heck, even my $40 paint ball marker with no sights will print better groups at 25 yards. I was just wanting to know if there was any known problem areas that could affect accuracy.
Mike
petenh
Bearcat
I have an early PC-9 carbine...and although I havn't shot it for a while I know I got some nice groups...I do remember at 25 yards all rounds would be in one hole...also shooting at 75 and 100 yards,the accuracy was acceptable or the carbine would be gone by now...I'll have to get out and shoot to see again...They are a neat gun thats for sure...
bandit320":2sf8kxma said:
Wowzers! Check your action screw and barrel band for tightness. Certain SN#'s required a washer on the action screw also. Perhaps the LEO agency that had the gun did not not exercise much care while cleaning and damaged the crown? Other than that I dont get it because my smooth bore 12 gauge will group slugs into half that size of groups. Let us know!
I can do about 3 or 4" at 50 yards with my PC9 using a rest shooting cheap ammo.. which is about as good as I can do with any rifle and iron sights.... except for my space monkeyed 10/22.
halfmoonclip
Bearcat
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2008
- Messages
- 84
bandit320":5jj6d9yh said:
Uhhh, either you have the all time golden Hi-Point carbine that you shoot uncommonly well, or there is something really wrong with the Ruger.
Follow up on Al James' suggestions, and let me ask, are you using the OEM sights, either peep or open rear? The sight radius is quite short on the open sight, and the older peep has a large, ghost ring aperture that takes some getting used to. I love peeps, but find the PC one a little large (tho' speedy) for finest accuracy. I can dance a can at 25 yds and generally hit claybirds (on the GROUND; you in the back, sit down and keep quiet! :wink: )at 50.
Other than getting a zero, shooting for group is probably not what the PC9 does best.
Moon
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