John Wayne, "The Searchers," racist?

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Snake Pleskin

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We also must let go of the past at some point, pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off and move forward. There is a huge difference between remembering the past and living in the past.
I don't think that we, as a nation, are in much danger of repeating our past transgressions such as genocide and slavery.
OMG, yes, time to move forward is right!
 

black1970

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Most black Americans, and all too many white Americans know little to nothing about history of any kind. They have been brainwashed (not educated) that slavery was a unique American institution, totally run by white people to denigrate and abuse black people. They do not even know that it was other black Africans that captured those that were sold in slavery, since few if any whites would survive the diseases and other hazards faced if going into the interior of Africa. Virtually no Americans know that the very first slave holder in America's south was a black man who owned other blacks. And of course these ignorant people do not know that slavery was practiced almost universally for almost all of human history. America was unique, not as a slave owning nation but as a nation that fought an incredibly bloody civil war to end slavery. Most Americans on the Left, the ones that display the stupid "Black Lives Matter" sign on their front lawn, are unaware or do not care that slavery is STILL practiced in the world today, primarily by Muslim blacks in North Africa.

And unfortunately there are far too many Americans today that know little about the Native Americans that the European settlers conquered in the domination and cultivation of the "New World". They think of Native Americans as the "Noble savage" as portrayed in "Last of the Mohicans" (the good Indians, not the evil ones allied with the French) and "Dances With Wolves". They have no idea of the savagery of so many tribes, such as the Apaches, or about how the taking of captives for slavery, often who were maimed or disabled so that they could not easily escape, and think of the cruelty of that era as solely done by whites against these "innocent and simple people".

And so what if racism is demonstrated in some movies? That was an accurate portrayal of the times.
Hate to tell you but the Civil War WAS NOT ABOUT SLAVERY. It was about State’s Rights.
 

g5m

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Having a Brit claim "Racist" is amusing. Anyone who reads the history of the West will find plenty of reports of brutality to support whatever view they wish to claim as their "Truth".
 

Snake Pleskin

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Most black Americans, and all too many white Americans know little to nothing about history of any kind. They have been brainwashed (not educated) that slavery was a unique American institution, totally run by white people to denigrate and abuse black people. They do not even know that it was other black Africans that captured those that were sold in slavery, since few if any whites would survive the diseases and other hazards faced if going into the interior of Africa. Virtually no Americans know that the very first slave holder in America's south was a black man who owned other blacks. And of course these ignorant people do not know that slavery was practiced almost universally for almost all of human history. America was unique, not as a slave owning nation but as a nation that fought an incredibly bloody civil war to end slavery. Most Americans on the Left, the ones that display the stupid "Black Lives Matter" sign on their front lawn, are unaware or do not care that slavery is STILL practiced in the world today, primarily by Muslim blacks in North Africa.

And unfortunately there are far too many Americans today that know little about the Native Americans that the European settlers conquered in the domination and cultivation of the "New World". They think of Native Americans as the "Noble savage" as portrayed in "Last of the Mohicans" (the good Indians, not the evil ones allied with the French) and "Dances With Wolves". They have no idea of the savagery of so many tribes, such as the Apaches, or about how the taking of captives for slavery, often who were maimed or disabled so that they could not easily escape, and think of the cruelty of that era as solely done by whites against these "innocent and simple people".

And so what if racism is demonstrated in some movies? That was an accurate portrayal of the times.
Thank you . It is about time the myths surrounding Slavery and the Noble Savage are laid to rest once and for all.
 

BearBiologist

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That British gal has no place to talk since they subjugated half the colored population around the world and brought slavery to the North American colonies.
Historically, the first slaves in North America and the Caribbean were Irish (Many of them were "Indentured Servants" but there were many ways to convert them to lifetime "servants"). In Australia, the Irish slaves were convicts (often for stolen bread or corn to feed their families). In 1816 Barbados, 86 % of slaves were white and most overseers were black!
 

Snake45

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Hate to tell you but the Civil War WAS NOT ABOUT SLAVERY.
It was also NOT a "civil war," which is defined as a conflict between two or more factions for the control of a nation's central government. As the South had no interest in taking control of Washington or the federal government, the term simply doesn't apply. (We are closer to being in a state of "civil war" right now, today, than in the 1860s. It is a "cold" civil war, but it is a civil war nonetheless, and we have been in such a state since at least 2008, maybe much longer.)

Maybe the "civil war" needs a new name. I've heard the following suggested:

War Between the States
North-South War
War of Northern Aggression
War to Repel Northern Aggression
War of Secession
War of Secession and Reunification
War of Secession and Reconquest

I think probably "War of Secession and Reunification" comes closest in terms of accuracy.
 
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Gopher

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Before we canceled Disney+ they started putting "warnings" before the cartoons essentially saying the movie was racist
Have they run Song of the South lately? By today's standards, they probably won't run half of the shows they ran in the 50s and 60s as either racist or too violent.
 

vito

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Racism is a word used to describe the American treatment of the Native Americans as part of the effort to portray the settlement of North America in a very negative light. But throughout human existence, more advanced or powerful groups of humans took over and occupied land by less advanced or powerful humans. Was the Roman conquests of most of Europe racist? Were the Persians “racist” as they subjugated people throughout their vast empire? Europeans coming to the “New World” just did what people have always been doing. And we had better technology, organization and numbers over the aboriginal natives, living in Stone Age like circumstances so we readily prevailed. The movie “The Seaarchers” was probably an accurate portrayal of how the more advanced Americans saw the savages still around at the time. We should feel no guilt at all for our national ancestors behaving as humans have always behaved. Native American should be grateful that their conquerors didn’t totally exterminate them or force total assimilation into American culture and values, although as individuals they would be far better off than they are now living on squalid “reservations”.
 

JackBull

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Last night, on TCM, they played the movie, "The Searchers" with John Wayne.
Now, if any of y'all don't watch TCM,, (Turner Classic Movies,) they usually lead into a movie with commentary about the film, or other stuff about the filming etc. Usually, it can be enlightening & enjoyable.
Last night I was a bit shocked.
They called the film racist, and that John Wayne's character was a bad guy & the racist person. They said that John Ford was trying to portray that I in his own way advance the injustices to the Native Americans.
They had the normal host,, and 2 others. One of the others was a female british media type. Now before the film aired, she spoke of how she wasn't a big fan of American Westerns with all the macho stuff. And after the film said that while John Ford did try to show how racist Wayne's character was,, he could have done more.
I found it funny in light of how BADLY racist the british media have treated Meagan Markle.

But beyond all that,, I was shocked in general by the attitudes of the host & both commentators. I have seen the movie numerous times,, and NEVER looked at it as they described it.
Sure, I KNEW that the Native Americans got a raw deal from the US Government, white people, for a few centuries. And yes, I knew that times have changed, and it's not as bad as it used to be.
But I also knew that the movie was based upon a true story somewhat, AND,, it portrayed exactly how people USED to think about Native Americans, (in the 1800's roughly.)

I just never felt the need to call it racist, or even consider that John Ford was trying to make a film with a message. I always felt it was a movie, for entertainment, and was filmed at a time when that was a common thought about how life was in the 1800's.

Now, I'm part Cherokee.
And I have always lived with the facts that Natives were basically an occupying people, that Europeans came here & took over & conquered them. No different than what has been done all over the world for centuries. Europeans did this constantly. The whole concept has always been conquer & take by a stronger people or army. World history has countless accounts of such things.

But the whole attitude of these commentators last night, while proclaiming to really enjoy the movie in one moment, trashed a lot of things in the movie the very next. I swear, it was amusing to see such double-speak.

But it was a movie.

I truly think the whole world in all forms of public media are trying to see just who can be the most politically correct & outdo the others. Sooner or later,, there will be nothing that isn't offensive to someone, and it'll be condemned in such public fashion as to destroy any & all forms of honest historical fact to where nothing will be allowed by anyone.

Sheesh,, those folks know how to really look stupid.

BTW; I don't think this conversation is political, as much as it is societal in what I'm trying to convey. Please try & keep all the political stuff in check.
Native Americans, blacks, Irish, Poles, Italians etc got a raw deal from the Government and those few ethinic groups power. Most white people were too busy trying to stay alive and had no real power. Hollywood is biased to this very day. When was the last time you saw a movie or TV show with a Polish lead character? Did you know there were Poles in the west during the cowboy era, but you can mention a single Pole in a western. There were only a very few countries involved in the slave trade, most of this peoples made up the majority of the US when founded. Take a look at the nationality of our presidents, not a very diverse group, English, German, French and one muslim interloper.
 

JackBull

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Messages
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The things I miss by not having TV. Will they go after Gone With The Windnext ? In The Birth of a Nation after one scene with the black actors and a white actor in blackface there's an inter title card which says "These scenes are meant to portray historical times and are not meant to cast aspersions on any race or people of today."
IMHO people have every right to be racist.What we have decided as a nation is that it will not be government policy or legally supported.
More accurately it is not a bias against a persons color or nationality but thier CULTURE.
 

kean57

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Akron, Ohio, United States
It was also NOT a "civil war," which is defined as a conflict between two or more factions for the control of a nation's central government. As the South had no interest in taking control of Washington or the federal government, the term simply doesn't apply. (We are closer to being in a state of "civil war" right now, today, than in the 1860s. It is a "cold" civil war, but it is a civil war nonetheless, and we have been in such a state since at least 2008, maybe much longer.)

Maybe the "civil war" needs a new name. I've heard the following suggested:

War Between the States
North-South War
War of Northern Aggression
War to Repel Northern Aggression
War of Succession
War of Succession and Reunification
War of Succession and Reconquest

I think probably "War of Succession and Reunification" comes closest in terms of accuracy.
I think the word you were looking for was "secession." The southern states seceded from the federal Union.
 

Snake Pleskin

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More accurately it is not a bias against a persons color or nationality but thier CULTURE.
The liberal govt has not figured out that you CAN NOT legislate what people like or dislike. Everything is called racist or racism to try and shame people into feeling a certain way. The lemmings will follow it, others will think on their own, and make their own choice .
 

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